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RE: [xmca] Perezhivanie and Dewey's concept of experience
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- Subject: RE: [xmca] Perezhivanie and Dewey's concept of experience
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- Thread-topic: [xmca] Perezhivanie and Dewey's concept of experience
The only time that I know of that LSV talks about catharsis is in The Psychology of Art, where he does not talk about perezhivanie, at least in the 1971 MIT translation; but according to Van der Veer, that translation only includes about half of what's available in Russian.
From: email@example.com [mailto:firstname.lastname@example.org] On Behalf Of Andy Blunden
Sent: Monday, February 25, 2013 6:09 PM
To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity
Subject: Re: [xmca] Perezhivanie and Dewey's concept of experience
Before moving on to Wundt, and Aristotle I wonder if any xmca correspondents could help me with this question?
In my collection of quotes at
http://www.ethicalpolitics.org/seminars/perezhivanie.htm I was able to line up Dewey's concept of "an experience" with Vygotsky's concept of "perezhivanie" on 5 different "dimensions". But there is one aspect of perezehivanie which I can line up with Freud and Stanislavsky and several contemporary commentators such as Ferholt, Kravtsov, Vasilyuk, ..., but I can't find it in Dewey and I don't know where to find it in Vygotsky, and that is:
* in order to function in development, perezhivanie must be "recalled"
and "worked over" in "catharsis" which is related to what Mike Cole calls "prolepsis" or "temporality". Where do I find a clear expression for this idea in Vygotsky and is it to be found in Dewey?
Larry Purss wrote:
> Mike, Andy, Martin
> Mike has summarized the thread to this point in the conversation with
> I was also delighted to see the connection to Dilthey. To me he
> stands for the "understanding" side of Wundt's duality between
> volkpsychology and experimental psychology. Two sides of the crisis.
> Add it to your list of quotations about perezhivanie, Andy, and lets
> link it somehow to xmca.
> Mike, as we link up Dilthey, Dewey, and Vygotsky we seem to be linking
> up *lived experience* which emphasizes the SUBJECTIVE emotional,
> visceral significance of lived experience.
> Another central concept is the understanding of *recollection* when
> the impact of the situation on the person summons up the entire lived
> experience of development.
> Does Aristotle's notion of *phronesis* as the relationship BETWEEN
> *character* and *application* also offer another source for linking to
> perezhivanie?? My reason for asking is that Gadamer has *recollected*
> lived experience as *flourishing* by returning to Aristotle. Aristotle
> also was exploring notions of the *moral good* and I want to link this
> to page 3 of Andy's notes on perezhivanie. On page 3 Vygotsky uses the
> metaphor of
> *prism* and *refraction* on the environments role and influence on the
> course of development. Vygotsky is suggesting the discipline of
> pedology as a genre OUGHT to always be capable of finding the
> particular *prism* THROUGH WHICH the influence of the environment of
> the environment on the child is REFRACTED. In Vygotsky's own words pedology:
> "OUGHT to be able to find the relationship which exists between the
> child and its environment, the child's emotional experience
> [perezhivanie], in other words how a child BECOMES AWARE of,
> INTERPRETS, [and] EMOTIONALLY RELATES to a certain event. This is such
> a prism which DETERMINES the role and influence of the environment on
> the development of, say, the child's CHARACTER, his psychological development, etc.
> Andy the way you chose to present the multiple shades of meaning of
> perezhivanie [TRANSlated as "lived experience"] through gathering
> together multiple authors each presenting their particular
> understanding of "lived experience" I found helpful in offering a
> deepening clarity of perezhivanie. In conjunction with Dewey's
> understanding of aesthetic experience as a deepening *intensification*
> of lived experience and Dilthey's exploration of lived experience as
> *undergoing*, possible new linkings or avenues of conversation open up.
> Fascinating thread which brings to center stage questions of
> subjectivity, intra-subjectivity, inter-subjectivity,
> trans-subjectivity and how these various understandings of
> subjectivity [and character development] link to perezhivanie. I
> appreciate how XMCA is contributing to my personal development.
> On Sun, Feb 24, 2013 at 6:25 PM, mike cole <email@example.com> wrote:
>> I expect Ivo just sat that dangling issue there on purpose and I was
>> also delighted to see the connection to Dilthey. To me he stands for
>> the "understanding" side of Wundt's duality between volkpsychology
>> and experimental psychology. Two sides of the crisis.
>> Add it to your list of quotations about perezhivanie, Andy, and lets
>> link it somehow to xmca.
>> On Sun, Feb 24, 2013 at 6:05 PM, Andy Blunden <firstname.lastname@example.org> wrote:
>>> Marvellous quote, Martin. None of these issues were discovered
>>> yesterday, it seems.
>>> I had forgotten that a couple of years ago I made up a collection of
>>> quotes from various writers on "Perezhivanie" here:
>>> Martin Packer wrote:
>>>> On Feb 19, 2013, at 7:13 PM, Ivo Banaco <email@example.com> wrote:
>>>>>> Sorry, I've just realized I've mistaken Dewey with Dilthey, I
>>>>>> wonder why...
>>>> Perhaps because all of this was in Dilthey too.
>>>> Dilthey (1833-1911) considered human experience (erlebnis, usually
>>>> translated 'lived experience') to be concrete and historical,
>>>> by the context of the past and by the horizon of the future, and he
>>>> that lived experience is the basis for all understanding. Lived
>>>> is a direct, immediate, pre-reflective contact with life, an act of
>>>> perceiving in which the person is unified with the object of their
>>>> understanding. It is made up not of static cognitive categories but
>>>> of meaningful unities which are prior to the separation between
>>>> emotion, willing, with knowing. Lived experience contains within
>>>> it the
>>>> of living, and of life itself.
>>>> "That which in the stream of time forms a unity in the present
>>>> has a unitary meaning is the smallest entity which we can designate
>>>> experience" (Dilthey, Collected Works 7, 194)
>>>> "The experience does not stand like an object over against its
>>>> experiencer, but rather its very existence for me is
>>>> the whatness which is present for me in it" (Collected Works 7,
>>>> xmca mailing list
>>> *Andy Blunden*
>>> Home Page: http://home.mira.net/~andy/
>>> Book: http://www.brill.nl/concepts
>>> xmca mailing list
>> xmca mailing list
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