Re: [xmca] History, today, individual, action and no action

[mike cole <lchcmike@gmail.com>]

Ulvi--

The revultion of Americans to both Hiroshima and bombing of Baghdad was
widespread. But it was tempered by fear and lack of knowledge. Also, re
collective memory -- narratives build up which make moral decisions easier,
but evaluation can be variable because the narrative can hide the events
just as easily as make them more henious.

The work on social/collective/cultural memory is quite relevant.
mike

On Thu, Sep 17, 2009 at 1:21 PM, ulvi icil <ulvi.icil@gmail.com> wrote:

> Thanks
>
> 2009/9/17, David Preiss <ddpreiss@me.com>:
> >
> > Hi Ulvi,
> > If I understood well what you are looking for I could also recommend Teun
> > A. van Dijk work on ideology.
> > David Preiss
> >
> >
> > On Sep 17, 2009, at 2:11 PM, ulvi icil wrote:
> >
> > Merci beaucoup Emily
> >>
> >> 2009/9/17, Duvall, Emily <emily@uidaho.edu>:
> >>
> >>>
> >>> Hi Ulvi,
> >>> Have you looked at Wertsch's work on collective memory/ remembering and
> >>> cultural narratives? I am no expert, but I found his presentation at
> >>> ISCAR quite compelling and it may speak to your concerns.
> >>> Another voice to consider is Hannah Arendt (The Human Condition,
> >>> perhaps).
> >>> Just some thoughts...
> >>> ~em
> >>>
> >>> -----Original Message-----
> >>> From: xmca-bounces@weber.ucsd.edu [mailto:xmca-bounces@weber.ucsd.edu]
> >>> On Behalf Of ulvi icil
> >>> Sent: Thursday, September 17, 2009 6:00 AM
> >>> To: lchcmike@gmail.com; eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity
> >>> Subject: Re: [xmca] History, today, individual, action and no action
> >>>
> >>> Sorry.
> >>>
> >>> US Foriegn Policy was merely an example.
> >>>
> >>> I intended to ask the fact that human mind seems to be much more
> >>> critical to
> >>> similar past events than to actual current ones and I wonder what may
> be
> >>> the
> >>> reasons for this.
> >>>
> >>> When I compare current responses of today's people to Hiroshima and to
> >>> Baghdat, it seems to me that the one for the first is quite ciritical,
> >>> towards a past event whereas most of humand minds are not so much
> >>> critical
> >>> to that extent for the second.
> >>>
> >>> This brings to my mind an explanatory reason like: People are less
> >>> critical
> >>> to current facts which may invite them for opposing action...Past
> events
> >>> are
> >>> frozen facts, not inviting people to change them...But current ones
> >>> invite
> >>> them to change, to action
> >>>
> >>> Anyway, I will think more on this and then return back to the group
> >>> later
> >>> wit some better formulations of my questions...
> >>>
> >>> Thanks
> >>>
> >>> Ulvi
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> 2009/9/16, mike coole <lchcmike@gmail.com>:
> >>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Too abstract for me, Ulvi. Are you referring to events like discussion
> >>>>
> >>> of
> >>>
> >>>> learning sciences or American foreign policy in the last decade? And
> >>>>
> >>> if the
> >>>
> >>>> later, hard to see connection to academic concerns of xmca, although I
> >>>> could
> >>>> surmise ways to tackle it.
> >>>>
> >>>> Past events have ready formulated narratives while the present is a
> >>>> contestation of them.
> >>>>
> >>>> What do you have in mind?
> >>>>
> >>>> mike
> >>>>
> >>>> On Wed, Sep 16, 2009 at 12:55 AM, ulvi icil <ulvi.icil@gmail.com>
> >>>>
> >>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>>
> >>>> I have one question in my mind that I look for the answer and intend
> >>>>>
> >>>> to
> >>>
> >>>> share:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> People seem to be more critical towards facts, actions etc in
> >>>>>
> >>>> history,
> >>>
> >>>> let's
> >>>>> say, United States foreign policy...or let's say some "bad" features
> >>>>>
> >>>> of
> >>>
> >>>> capitalism
> >>>>>
> >>>>> But the same people seem less critical towards the current ones,
> >>>>>
> >>>> parallel
> >>>
> >>>> or
> >>>>> similar to the same fact...and tend to see these facts unavoidable,
> >>>>>
> >>>> as
> >>>
> >>>> facts
> >>>>> to be admitted as facts etc
> >>>>>
> >>>>> What may be the reasons for this?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> May one of these the fact that, historical one is frozen and needs
> >>>>>
> >>>> no
> >>>
> >>>> change
> >>>>> but if you are critical towards a current one, then you should move
> >>>>>
> >>>> against
> >>>>
> >>>>> it, you should enter into action against it...and this is the reason
> >>>>>
> >>>> why,
> >>>
> >>>> people do not criticize the current one, because they do not want to
> >>>>>
> >>>> act
> >>>
> >>>> against it...they know the fact is "bad" , they admit it, but they
> >>>>>
> >>>> perhaps
> >>>>
> >>>>> try to rationalize their position etc?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> (It is obvious that that inaction is not merely inaction, it means
> >>>>>
> >>>> also
> >>>
> >>>> less
> >>>>> consciousness in some respects...In some respects, because "action"
> >>>>>
> >>>> is
> >>>
> >>>> not
> >>>>
> >>>>> always filled with a better consciousness...e.g. actions of masses
> >>>>>
> >>>> at a
> >>>
> >>>> historical moment may be with or without more or les consciousness)
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Thanks
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Ulvi
> >>>>> _______________________________________________
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> >>>>> http://dss.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/xmca
> >>>>>
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> >>
> >
> > David Preiss
> > ddpreiss@me.com
> > http://web.mac.com/ddpreiss/
> >
> > _______________________________________________
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> > http://dss.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/xmca
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