[xmca] Re: xmca Digest, Vol 93, Issue 13

["Negueruela, Eduardo" <enegueruela@miami.edu>]

Dear all:

We are pleased to announce a new peer-reviewed journal published by Equinox: Language & Sociocultural Theory.

Language and Sociocultural Theory is an international journal devoted to the study of language from the perspective of Vygotskian sociocultural theory.

Articles appearing in the journal may draw upon research in the following fields of study: linguistics and applied linguistics, psychology and cognitive science, anthropology, cultural studies, and education. Particular emphasis is placed on applied research grounded on sociocultural theory where language is central to understanding cognition, communication, culture, learning and development. The journal especially focuses on research that explores the role of language in the theory itself, including inner and private speech, internalization, verbalization, gesticulation, cognition, and conceptual development. Work that explores connections between sociocultural theory and meaning-based theories of language also fits the journal’s scope.

You will find more information about the journal in the following link:


https://www.equinoxpub.com/journals/index.php/LST/index


We invite you to consider L & SCT when submitting your articles for publication.
Best,
eduardo

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Eduardo Negueruela-Azarola, PhD
Associate Professor, Spanish Second Language Acquisition & Applied Linguistics
Spanish Basic Language Program, Director

University of Miami
Department of Modern Languages and Literatures
Merrick Bldg. 212-5
University of Miami
Coral Gables, FL 33124

enegueruela@miami.edu<mailto:enegueruela@miami.edu>

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

On Feb 16, 2013, at 3:00 PM, <xmca-request@weber.ucsd.edu<mailto:xmca-request@weber.ucsd.edu>>
 <xmca-request@weber.ucsd.edu<mailto:xmca-request@weber.ucsd.edu>> wrote:

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Today's Topics:

  1. Re: Reading Piaget again... (mike cole)


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Fri, 15 Feb 2013 12:53:47 -0800
From: mike cole <lchcmike@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [xmca] Reading Piaget again...
To: "Goncu, Artin" <goncu@uic.edu>
Cc: "eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity" <xmca@weber.ucsd.edu>
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All -- Here is the link to the Newletter discussion Artin is referring to:

http://lchc.ucsd.edu/Histarch/newsletters.html

On Fri, Feb 15, 2013 at 11:27 AM, Goncu, Artin <goncu@uic.edu> wrote:



Piaget and Vygotsky comparisons are of interest to many us for many
reasons.  Trying to understand the similarities and differences between
their stances regarding the role of culture in development is one
motivation for this.  The LCHC Newletter made provisions for this issue
also.  For example, a group of us from Chicago addressed how the two men
conceptualized the role of culture in play, language, affect, and
creativity in a 1988 collection that was published in the Newsletter.  It
is this background that led me to send my post here.  ag


On Thu, February 14, 2013 10:50 am, mike cole wrote:
Very interesting that this issue should come before the group, Artin. And
great to hear from Jonathan
and get a 1962 reference for the Piaget position, at that time, that
stages
were universal but the rate of attaining them culturally variable
depending
upon the "mental food value" of the culture.

This period of his thinking, as I understand it, came from a unesco
conference and a book by tanner (a student of biological growth) and
Inhelder where he was interacting with anthropologists such as Margaret
Mead.

This is the position, when combined with the presumed intellectual
consequences of schooling led to Bruner's conclusion that some cultures
promote cognitive development faster and FURTHER than others.

An extensive LCHC discussion of these issues circa 1983 can be found
here:
Note the list of contributing
authors.

http://lchc.ucsd.edu/Pubs/Culture-CognitiveDev.pdf

There has been a lot of subsequent work (Smith, Duveen,
Perret-Clermont......) on the social/cultural elements elabortable from
Piagetian ideas.

The LCHC position focused on decalage and social mechanisms organizing
what
now it is discussed
as trajectories through sociocultural linked and sociocultural organized,
systems of activities/cultural practices.

Adding biological history back into the discussion of ontogeny seems to
me
to be a priority for the developmental of a CHAT-informed theory of
ontogeny.

But that is a discussion for another day. Getting straignt the role of
culture in Piaget and Vygotsky's views seems a very important task.

methinks.
mike



On Thu, Feb 14, 2013 at 8:22 AM, Goncu, Artin <goncu@uic.edu> wrote:



Thank you, Jon. I didn't mention Piaget's references to parent-child
interaction in "the Moral Judgment" since the entire book is about the
role of adult-child relationship and its relevance to moral development.
ag


On Wed, February 13, 2013 6:49 pm, Jonathan Tudge wrote:
Artin and Huw,

I have students read the following as part of my Piaget offerings in a
theories class:
Piaget, J. (1973). *The child and reality: Problems of genetic
psychology*.
New York: Grossman. Chapter 1: ?Time and the intellectual development
of
the child? (original work published in 1962).

It's quite clear in this chapter that Piaget was more than willing to
acknowledge the influence of both social class and culture, not in
changing
the order through which children would pass through stages of
development
but in speeding up or slowing down the age at which they'd be likely
to
show evidence of being in one or other stage.

He wrote "stages are precisely characterized by their set order of
succession. They are not stages which can be given a constant
chronological
date. On the contrary, the ages can vary from one society to
another..."
(p. 10).  (As this chapter was initially presented as a lecture he
somewhere or other, tongue-in-cheek no doubt, mentions that the
children
of
his listeners undoubtedly go through the stages faster.)  Towards the
end
of the chapter he wrote as follows:
"Moreover, we will find collective accelerations in certain social
classes
and in certain milieux" (pp. 25-26), and went on to discuss
differences
in
children's responses in Geneva, Montreal,  Martinique (a delay of
approximately four years), Tehran (similar to Geneva), and rural Iran
(a
delay of approximately 2.5 years).

We can, of course, argue about the manner in which non-schooled
children
were tested (as Mike and others have done very effectively), but it's
really hard to say that Piaget held that culture or class were
irrelevant
to children's cognitive development.

In the book that Artin mentioned you can also find lots of evidence of
the
ways in which parents and children influence children's social and
moral
development--yet still we're confronted with the image of Piaget's
child
being the little scientist working alone on the mysteries of the
world.

All the best,

Jon


~~~~~~~~~~~

Jonathan Tudge
Professor
Office: 155 Stone
***Important*** Please note that I have a new office phone line***

Mailing address:
248 Stone Building
Department of Human Development and Family Studies
PO Box 26170
The University of North Carolina at Greensboro
Greensboro, NC 27402-6170
USA

phone (336) 223-6181. [However, given the amount I travel, it's best
to
communicate with me by email.]
fax   (336) 334-5076

http://www.uncg.edu/hdf/facultystaff/Tudge/Tudge.html



On Wed, Feb 13, 2013 at 7:16 PM, Huw Lloyd
<huw.softdesigns@gmail.com>wrote:

On 13 February 2013 21:19, Goncu, Artin <goncu@uic.edu> wrote:


In re-reading Piaget for a class I teach, I saw the following
sentences
in
"The Moral Judgement of the Child" that I had underlined many years
ago,
noticed them again, and felt that he may not have been given
sufficient
credit for his observations about the role of culture and class in
his
discussions.  On p. 209-10 referring to the findings he has just
reported,
he says "To begin with, they relate only to the children belonging
to
a
certain ethnical (sic) group and a certain social stratum (the
poorer
parts of Geneva and a few children from an elementary school at
Neuchatel.)  I wish he had theorized about the role of culture and
class,
going beyond these observations but that is another story...


My reading recollection is that he is forever hedging his bets and
encumbered by an audience expecting a "rational" account of genetic
phenomena.  On one occasion I was hunting about for some Piagetian
ideas
that, I was confident, were laid out with clarity only to discover
that
is
was Vygotsky writing about Piaget.

No doubt there's much more to it -- the influence of idioms such as
French
sociologists and psychologists, translations etc.

Huw




Artin Goncu, Ph.D
Professor,
Educational Psychology
College of Education M/C 147
1040 W. Harrison St.
Chicago, IL 60607
http://education.uic.edu/epsy/browseour%20faculty.cfm
(312) 996-5259

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Artin Goncu, Ph.D
Professor,
Educational Psychology
College of Education M/C 147
1040 W. Harrison St.
Chicago, IL 60607
http://education.uic.edu/epsy/browseour%20faculty.cfm
(312) 996-5259

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Artin Goncu, Ph.D
Professor,
Educational Psychology
College of Education M/C 147
1040 W. Harrison St.
Chicago, IL 60607
http://education.uic.edu/epsy/browseour%20faculty.cfm
(312) 996-5259




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