I find Eugene's, Jay's and Gordon's functional and contextual nuancing of
the classical triad very rewarding (am I forgetting somebody?). Wondering
if it is very lazy of me to just ask if there are any nameable alternatives
as handy in size as the IRE. Since, for example I had counted as IREs only
those triads that started with a fairly defined question, whereas Eugene
uses an example that has an initiating move that does not seem (like a
question) to be explicitly shaped so as to evoke a response -- it is the
start of a list construction which _becomes_ a joint list construction,
which _then_ is turned into an IRF by being summed up and "opened to the
future" in the third turn...
>"We can do it by kitchen, by color..." (Initiation)
>The third grader interrupted him, "...by size, by material..." (Response)
>The fourth grader ended, "yeah, we can do it in many ways.
>Let's try to find all of them!" (Evaluation)
I can see that it makes sense to single out the pattern on the grounds of
this final move of catching up/ /bringing together/ /extending -- this is
a very handy and "educational" device (I agree with Gordon there. I also
agree with Jay on the first IR(E) in an IRIRE being elided, or completed by
the beginning of the next round. This is also classical, I guess -- I just
didn't have the words.)
But I also think that it is in many ways a great step from the IRE
in the family context with a number of children that is small enough for
all to have their say and where there is also the cosiness of physical
intimity -- this is a far step from the IRE of the transmissionary
classroom where one teacher "dialogues" with a roomful of kids sitting at
their desks (to keep with the stereotype). And yet, the first may well be a
preparation for the second -- wasn't that how we started this thread:
wondering about relationships between parenting and teaching. (By the way,
Jay, I don't know if parents are always just so self-assuredly intent on
making children into copies of themselves, the experience of parenting is
often very fraught with feelings of guilt an inadequacy...)
Anyway what I find interesting when I look back on my reading
habits as witnessed by that transcript is that I can see both my children,
with differences according to age, learning to perform in ALL the slots of
the pattern -- although (for many reasons, I suppose) I dominate the
question market quantitatively. Thinking vaguely of the "No bedtime
story..." by S.B. Heath I wonder if children do not just come to school
differently prepared for IRE or not IRE, but also for more or less rigid/
/flexible versions of the IRE -- could it even be offensive to some kids
letting learners usurp the position of initiating?
As for the "knowing the answer" of the questions in reading they seem to me
to have again a function that is a bit different from the classroom where
the teacher does some kind of sampling of who possesses which piece of
knowledge. To my understanding it is very characteristic of family reading
that parents read (children demand) the same books over and over. So
everybody basically knows everything, and knows that the others know... I
think the questioning also has a phatic or "community building" function of
pulling everybody in to contribute... Questions/ /Initiations may be
"invitations". Hmmm... interesting... how closely "cognitive testing"
(mutual) is linked to the building of closeness here. Knowledge as bonding,
huh...
Just another scrap from the family album: this is me and my three&half
yearold daughter in the very beginning of the session, where she breaks
into my reading with a comment, to which I cautiously disagree...
AL: Are we going to read?
E: Sure: "Teodor the Teddybear had become old.
He had lost an eye and an ear.
And Mother has thrown him in the wastebin"=
AL: =Yes! //Mo-
E: //"because she doesn't want any broken toys around."
AL: Noo! We don't either! When our toys break
then we'll throw them away ar- arSELVES!
We too are going to throw them away.
E: Yes. Although if they're just a little broken,
then we usually keep them.
Cause you can play with them quite well anyway.
AL: Yes...
E: (goes on reading)
Who is doing what?
Have a happy new year out there!
Eva