[Xmca-l] Re: Translation or Paraphrase?

[David Kellogg]

Oh, it's the same issue that Minick himself and others had with the
Hanfmann and Vakar translation, Andy. It's a paraphrase.

David Kellogg
Sangmyung University

New Article:
Han Hee Jeung & David Kellogg (2019): A story without SELF: Vygotsky’s
pedology, Bruner’s constructivism and Halliday’s construalism in
understanding narratives by
Korean children, Language and Education, DOI: 10.1080/09500782.2019.1582663
To link to this article: https://doi.org/10.1080/09500782.2019.1582663

Some e-prints available at:
https://www.tandfonline.com/eprint/KHRxrQ4n45t9N2ZHZhQK/full?target=10.1080/09500782.2019.1582663



On Wed, Jun 12, 2019 at 9:34 AM Andy Blunden <andyb@marxists.org> wrote:

> Firstly, I have checked the transcription, and it is indeed true to the
> *LSVCW* version. Originally, the old "Thought and Language" translation
> had been used here, but a few years ago I replaced it with Minick's.
>
> My initial reaction is that Minick's rendering of the sentence is much
> easier to read and understand. What is the issue for you?
>
> Andy
> ------------------------------
> Andy Blunden
> http://www.ethicalpolitics.org/ablunden/index.htm
> On 12/06/2019 6:41 am, David Kellogg wrote:
>
> Andy:
>
> On Vygotsky Internet Archive  version of T&S Chapter Five, Section Five,
> second paragraph, we've got this.
>
> "Nevertheless, this mode of uniting concrete objects in a common group
> differs from that based on thinking in concepts or conceptual thinking.
> First, the nature of the connections that are established among the objects
> in the group differs from that characteristic of concepts. Second, as
> defined by the relationship of each object in the group to the group as a
> whole, the structure of the unified group differs profoundly in type and
> mode of activity from that based on conceptual thinking."
>
> The Russian, in both the first 1934 edition and the 1982 Russian CW
> edition is this:
>
>
> Но способ объединения различных конкретных предметов в общие группы,
> характер устанавливаемых при этом связей, структура возникающих на основе
> такого мышления единств, характеризующаяся отношением каждого отдельного
> предмета, входящего в состав группы, ко всей группе в целом, — все это
> глубоко отличается по своему типу и по способу деятельности от мышления в
> понятиях, развивающихся только в эпоху полового созревания.
>
>
>
> The 1994 Vygotsky Reader, edited by Rene van der Veer and Jaan Valsiner,
> uses the 1931 "Pedology of the Adolescent" version of this study for its
> Chapter Nine. On p. 218, it's got this:
>
>
>
> "But the manner of the unification of different real objects into general
> groups, the character of the connections which becomes established during th
> is process, the structure of the affinities which arise on the basis of such
> thinking, which is characterized by the relationship of each individual
> object having become part of the composition of the group, to the group
> as a whole - all th is is fundamentally different by its nature and the
> manner of its operation from thinking in concepts, which only develops at
> the time of puberty."
>
>
> This  Vygotsky Reader version is an actual translation, but the version we
> have for T&S Chapter Five, which I assume is an accurate transcription of
> Norris Minick's version in the English CW, seems little more than a
> paraphrase. What gives?
>
>
>
> David Kellogg
> Sangmyung University
>
> New Article:
> Han Hee Jeung & David Kellogg (2019): A story without SELF: Vygotsky’s
> pedology, Bruner’s constructivism and Halliday’s construalism in
> understanding narratives by
> Korean children, Language and Education, DOI: 10.1080/09500782.2019.1582663
> To link to this article: https://doi.org/10.1080/09500782.2019.1582663
>
> Some e-prints available at:
>
> https://www.tandfonline.com/eprint/KHRxrQ4n45t9N2ZHZhQK/full?target=10.1080/09500782.2019.1582663
>
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: http://mailman.ucsd.edu/pipermail/xmca-l/attachments/20190612/dea953cc/attachment.html