[Xmca-l] Re: Intrinsic motivation?

Thu Aug 7 09:17:09 PDT 2014

Andy,

what I like of the theory of activiy is that it provides something on which
we can anchor the collective material activity: its object.
We cannot deny that in an industrial production someone has started a
business and defined the strategy of production and its consequent
organization of work. This is a 'true' object in the sense that it has
concrete consequences for the workers. And it is not a personal motive (the
motive of the employer) because the motive behind an industrial production
has to respond to some cultural-historical need (need of shoes, of cars, of
good Italian wine and not only French wine :-))) ).

What I tried to show with my research is exactly what you say: you talks
about the multiple interests in an organization, I talk of different
personal senses of the motive/object of the enterprise. As I tried to
explain, I have my theoretical reasons to prefer to use the concept of
motives instead of the concept of motivation or interests.

Cristina

2014-08-07 17:38 GMT+02:00 Andy Blunden <ablunden@mira.net>:

> Perhaps Greg. I am not familiar with Leight Starr's work.
> The only boundary objects I know are Engestrom's, and in his case it is a
> step in a good direction, but it is a bit like putting a lightweight into a
> heavyweight fight but giving him bigger gloves to compensate.
>
>
> Andy
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> *Andy Blunden*
> http://home.pacific.net.au/~andy/
>
>
> greg.a.thompson@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> Andy,
>> I wonder if you would be warmer to Leigh Starrs idea of boundary objects?
>> I do believe a special issue of MCA on Starrs work is in the works. Rumor
>> has it.
>> Greg
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>
>>
>>> On Aug 7, 2014, at 6:15 AM, Andy Blunden <ablunden@mira.net> wrote:
>>>
>>> Yes, I understand that, Cristina. That is Leontyev's approach. You have
>>> correctly represented it.
>>> It's just that I don't agree with it.
>>> As I suggested, to privilege one point of view as the true point of view
>>> and all other points of view as "personal"
>>> (1) Sets up a bad dualism, actually far worse than any dualism Descartes
>>> was guilty of.
>>> (2) Reflects the world ANL lived in: the PolitBuro's view was the
>>> "objective" and "true" aim of all activities in the USSR.  Everyone
>>> fulfilled their targets, exceptr of course for dissidents and saboteurs,
>>> but in fact it was all mostly a fiction. Since the 1940s, sociologists have
>>> shown that multiple interests are at play in any business enterprise. A
>>> binary relation is quite inadequate to represent the relations active
>>> within a business or any activity, far less a modern capitalist country.
>>> (3) Vygotsky's approach is in my opinion far superior, in that instead
>>> of having an unproblematic, objective or true object, it relies on how each
>>> of the participants in the activity conceive of its object. This was not in
>>> itself sufficient for an Activity Theory, but it is a much better start
>>> than Leontyev's which is inferior to sociological theories of 60 years ago,
>>> as I see it.
>>>
>>> Andy
>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> *Andy Blunden*
>>> http://home.pacific.net.au/~andy/
>>>
>>>
>>> Maria Cristina Migliore wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> Andy,
>>>>
>>>> I intend objective motive as the motive of the activity. Objective does
>>>> not
>>>> refer to objectivity, objectiveness and judging objectively here.
>>>> Objective
>>>> motive refers to the idea that "the object of an activity is its true
>>>> motive."
>>>> This is the terminology proposed by Leontiev in Activity, Consciousness,
>>>> and Personality, section 3.5 The General Structure of Activity, page 62
>>>> However, I tend to not use the locution 'objective motive'. But
>>>> motive/object.
>>>>
>>>> H
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>

-- 

Maria Cristina Migliore, Ph.D.

Senior Researcher

IRES Istituto Ricerche Economico Sociali del Piemonte

Via Nizza, 18

10125 Torino – Italia

Tel. +39 011 6666463

cell. 348 0454272

Fax.  +39 011 6696012

e-mail   migliore@ires.piemonte.it

skype mariacristinamigliore

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