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Re: [xmca] Help With Spanish/Portuguese



Hello Kellog,

He is talking in a kind of mix of Spanish and Portuguese, so
yes, Portuguese speakers can comprehend him.

I think that the question of who is Emilia Ferreiro is already covered.

But one thing is important to note: Many say that the "caminho suave" (soft
way) for alphabetization proposed by Ferreiro, based on the teaching of the
relationship between letters and phonemes and with a image in the form of
the letter to help the child remenber, is mechanistic and led to a very
very serious problem we face in Brazil now: a very high percentage of
people with functional illiteracy. Much before Ferreiro propositions,
Vygotsky already criticized this kind of alphabetization, that seems to be
gathering force again with some dubious "neurological background" from the
cognitive sciences, for the lack of opportunity for the child to give
meaning for this.

Many educators in Brazil "blame" Piaget and Ferreiro for the lack of
capacity for many Brazilians (even in the university) to comprehend a text,
they can read but can't give it a meaning and much less criticize it, i.e.,
no abstract reasoning about the text. Paulo Freire ways seems to goes in
the Vygotsky direction, but we must remenber also that he worked with adult
workers, not elementary school children.

I am hyper simplifying things here, and of course there are other factors
to this phenomena, but this is the kind of discussion you would hear about
in these parts.

Wagner

2013/1/11 kellogg <kellogg59@hanmail.net>

>   I wonder if I could get some help from our Latin American friends.
> There is this video of Freire speaking in 1992 about his relationship to
> Vygotsky:
>
>
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eg8IQ7LlEyY
>
>
>
> I gather that what he says is roughly this:
>
>
>
> a) When he first read Vygotsky, it appeared to him that Vygotsky had
> copied his own work! (That's a joke--he acknowledges that Vygotsky had died
> nearly sixty years earlier)
>
> b) Vygotsky goes much further than Piaget in his understanding of language
> acquisition.
>
> c) There is some OTHER person ("Emilia Fujera"?) who goes much further
> still in her scientific understanding of language acquisition but who does
> not go nearly as far as Freire himself in the ideological/political
> understanding of education.
>
>
>
> For some reason, Freire is speaking in Spanish, although I imagine a
> Portuguese speaker could understand him. The problem is that I can't follow
> very well, having never really studied either language. Can somebody help?
>
>
>
> Who is "Emilia Fujera"?
>
>
>
> David Kellogg
>
> Hankuk University of Foreign Studies
>
>
> --------- 원본 메일 ---------
>
> *보낸사람*: Wagner Luiz Schmit <wagner.schmit@gmail.com>
> *받는사람* : "eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity" <xmca@weber.ucsd.edu>
> *날짜*: 2013년 1월 11일 금요일, 01시 16분 02초 +0900
> *제목*: Re: [xmca] Activity concept
> Thank you very much Goncu and Larry!
>
> Larry this conversation is very interesting! I though that this kind
> of discussion already happened, but I wasn't able to find something
> like this. And Rubinshtein is in the middle of the discussion also!!!
>
> Wagner
>
> 2013/1/10 Larry Purss <lpscholar2@gmail.com<http://mail2.daum.net/hanmail/mail/MailComposeFrame.daum?TO=lpscholar2@gmail.com>
> >:
> > Wrong site
> > THIS is the specific site
> >
> > http://ethicalpolitics.org/seminars/stetsenko.htm
> >
> > which carries on an exploration of your question
> >
> > Larry
> >
> > On Thu, Jan 10, 2013 at 8:04 AM, Larry Purss <lpscholar2@gmail.com<http://mail2.daum.net/hanmail/mail/MailComposeFrame.daum?TO=lpscholar2@gmail.com>>
> wrote:
> >
> >> Hello Wagner
> >>
> >> This site
> >>
> >>
> >>
> https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=ethicalpolitics.org%2Fseminars&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_cp.r_qf.&bvm=bv.1357700187,d.cGE&biw=1024&bih=523&wrapid=tlif135783394963311&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=iw&ei=-eXuUJ-WHIOnigKHloHIDw
> >>
> >> I found helpful for situating this question among an intimate group
> >> carrying on a conversation on this topic.
> >> Larry
> >>
> >> On Thu, Jan 10, 2013 at 7:00 AM, Goncu, Artin <goncu@uic.edu<http://mail2.daum.net/hanmail/mail/MailComposeFrame.daum?TO=goncu@uic.edu>>
> wrote:
> >>
> >>>
> >>> Hello Wagner,
> >>>
> >>> The following review that addresses the views of Vygotsky and Leont'ev
> may
> >>> be helpful. Best, ag
> >>>
> >>> Göncü, A., & Gauvain, M. (2011). Sociocultural Approaches to
> >>> Educational Psychology: Theory, Research, and Application. In K.
> Harris,
> >>> J. Brophy., G. Sinatra, & J. Sweller (Eds.). APA Educational Psychology
> >>> Handbook: Contributions to Education. Vol.1.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Thu, January 10, 2013 8:26 am, Wagner Luiz Schmit wrote:
> >>> > Greetings and Happy New Year to all!!!
> >>> >
> >>> > I may be doing a silly questions and probably someone already
> answered
> >>> > about this, but I searched the web for something more concise and
> >>> > could not find (yet):
> >>> >
> >>> > What are the differences on the concept of Activity between Vygotsky,
> >>> > Leontiev and Ilyenkov?
> >>> >
> >>> > I will tackle some Leontiev and Ilyenkov texts from the Marxists.org
> >>> > archives and I am also reading the text "Criticisms of Vygotsky’s
> >>> > concept of Activity" by Andy Blunden. But I wanted to have a "large
> >>> > picture view" or at least some positioning to do not get lost in my
> >>> > readings.
> >>> >
> >>> > Thank you.
> >>> >
> >>> > Wagner Luiz Schmit
> >>> > __________________________________________
> >>> > _____
> >>> > xmca mailing list
> >>> > xmca@weber.ucsd.edu<http://mail2.daum.net/hanmail/mail/MailComposeFrame.daum?TO=xmca@weber.ucsd.edu>
> >>> > http://dss.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/xmca
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Artin Goncu, Ph.D
> >>> Professor,
> >>> Educational Psychology
> >>> College of Education M/C 147
> >>> 1040 W. Harrison St.
> >>> Chicago, IL 60607
> >>> http://education.uic.edu/epsy/browseour%20faculty.cfm
> >>> (312) 996-5259
> >>>
> >>> __________________________________________
> >>> _____
> >>> xmca mailing list
> >>> xmca@weber.ucsd.edu<http://mail2.daum.net/hanmail/mail/MailComposeFrame.daum?TO=xmca@weber.ucsd.edu>
> >>> http://dss.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/xmca
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> > __________________________________________
> > _____
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>
> <kellogg59@hanmail.net>
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