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Re: [xmca] fetishism | word meaning

On 10 June 2011 00:14, Joseph Gilbert <joeg4us@roadrunner.com> wrote:

> Huw:
> Do you suppose that there is any, or do you experience any, relationship
> between any particular phone, when heard, and a particular feeling-reaction.

Yes, I do suppose.

> If we admit that there is no perception without being affected by the thing
> perceived, then phones must affect us. So, what is the effect of a given
> phone?

Fear of phone spam in my case.

> Are we affected identically by all phones or differently by different
> phones?

Differently, for me.

> What is the mechanism of non-verbal, vocal communication in humans and
> other species?

My hypothesis is that it is various degrees of dialogical appreciation,
dependent on the sophistication of the nervous system.

> If we are, in fact, affected feeling-wise by our specific phones, then how
> is our subliminal perception of things affected by the vocal sounds we use
> to refer to them?

I'd say that the tone (timbre) of our sounds is, to some degree, a function
of our affect, etc.

There are more subtleties, ofcourse.  In a particular mood, particular
images (including words) will come to mind.

>        I see that the preponderance of spoken language's communicative
> function takes place subconsciously. Do you recognize or look for the
> subconscious effects on us of the sounds we use to form our spoken words?

On occasion.

>        On a personal note, do you sense any arrogance in your reply to my
> last e-mail?

No.  Mostly clarity.  Take care though, Joseph.  Some people find it very
easy to project their experiences.

> First you identify yourselves as "scientists and schlors".

No.  I identified.  Note that this list is not comprehensive.  Here be
scholars and scientists doesn't exclude readers and those of curious minds.

I think this kind of error is making things difficult for you, Joseph.

Very well. So you are... I already knew that. Therefore, what? I am
> heartened to hear you refer to your group as "A well meaning and thoughtful
> bunch". That is something we all should strive for. Were you saying that I
> was "inflicting you with help"? Were you saying that I was not being
> "precise" enough for the purposes of this exchange? Finally, I was not
> intentionally aksing questions, but rather sharing thoughts on a subject
> with which you seemingly deal. A questioner/requester, in the your context,
> is a supplicant. Are you suggesting that I assume that role here?

None other than the basic protocol of genuine assistance.  Without good
feedback that is sought out, we're lost.

>        As a matter of personal curiouity; what answers were you seeking
> that caused you to pursue these studies?

Pretty much as it says on the members list.

>        I was looking to understand how we are, as a species, affected by
> our spoken language, - our culture.

There's plenty to wonder about there.   It's obviously something you have
lots of energy for.


>                J. Gilbert
> On Jun 9, 2011, at 2:20 PM, Huw Lloyd wrote:
>  On 9 June 2011 20:22, Joseph Gilbert <joeg4us@roadrunner.com> wrote:
>>  Dear All:
>>> I do not intend to offend, however faced with the choice in front of me
>>> of
>>> withdrawing from this forum or of sharing my perspective on spoken
>>> language,
>>> I choose the later. If one is passionately pursuing understanding, one,
>>> above all else, looks for the causes of whatever one is seeking to
>>> understand. I am not interested in participating in pointless chit-chat
>>> as a
>>> social activity/exercise. And I am not much interested in what others who
>>> came before have said about my subject of interest, if their
>>> pronouncements
>>> do not facilitate my own understanding. I have found the information I
>>> wish
>>> to share only by focusing on the fundamental causative forces that
>>> produced
>>> spoken language.
>>       If those I would like to share my findings with would be more
>>> concerned with delving into the matter before us, and be willing to
>>>  sincerely look for answers, than they are to maintain and defend their
>>> assumed position, I believe a genuine dialog could take place. Rarifying
>>> the
>>> discussion by unnecessarily complicating the search for clarity creates a
>>> false aura of expertise around those who are initiated into the lingo,
>>> and
>>> seems to enable them to establish and protect their status as
>>> gate-keepers
>>> for the ivory-towered dispensers of "truth".
>> xmca is an extension of a (scientific) journal, mca.  Here be scientists
>> and
>> scholars.  A well meaning and thoughtful bunch, mind you.  However, to
>> avoid
>> being inflicted with help, some precision is required.  If you want to
>> increase the chances of a particular kind of answer, or dialogue, you'll
>> need to ask a particular kind of question/request.
>> Huw
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