Re: [xmca] help: Vygotsky and pedology (reading Holowinsky, part 1)

[Anton Yasnitsky <the_yasya@yahoo.com>]

Just a clarification: The post that I pointed us to is NOT nonsense, nonsense is what is quoted in this post.

So, the quote is from another opus magnum on Soviet pedology by Dr. Holowinsky who, in his paper Holowinsky, Ivan Z. (1993). Pedology in 
Europe and Developmental Psychology in Ukraine. School Psychology 
International, 14 (4), 327-338 states:

One of Zaporozhets's younger students was P.I. Zinchenko who
> made a significant contribution in research on memory processes. His 
>dissertation on involuntary (incidental) memory became a classical work 
>in that field. Zinchenko's children Vasyl and Taras continue into the 
>present important research efforts in their own right (p. 332).
>Comment. 

First, both Aleksander Zaporozhets (1905-1981) and Petr Zinchenko (1903-1969) were the students of AN Leontiev (1903-1979), who defended their dissertations around the same time in 1935-36, and, for a number of reasons, P. Zinchenko can hardly qualify as a "younger student" Zaporozhets.

Second, Petr Zinchenko, indeed, had two children, whose names started with "V" and "T". Indeed, both became prominent psychologists. Furthermore, the "V" became a full member of Academy of Pedagogical Sciences of the Soviet Union (Russian Academy of Education these days) and the member of the American Academy of Arts and Sciences. A number of his books were translated into English and are not unfamiliar to Western scholars, see, e.g. Formation of visual images; studies of stabilized retinal images [by] V.P. Zinchenko and N. Yu. Vergiles. Consultants Bureau 1972 OR The psychometrics of fatigue. Zinchenko, V.P. Taylor & Francis, 1985 


The only problem is that the "V" guy is not a person with a Ukrainian name "Vasyl'" but Vladimir, whereas, the "T" guy is not seemingly another Ukrianian male Taras, but rather a female scholar, also with a list of publications, Tat'yana Petrovna Zinchenko.

I find this example quite characteristic for this specific author, whose work often occurs, like in this case, hilariously funny. 

My comments on Vygotsky and pedology paper will follow "under separate cover"...




----- Original Message ----
From: mike cole <lchcmike@gmail.com>
To: ablunden@mira.net; "eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity" <xmca@weber.ucsd.edu>
Sent: Tue, May 18, 2010 9:16:12 PM
Subject: Re: [xmca] help: Vygotsky and pedology

Gentlemen--

The post that Anton pointed us to is nonsense. The article on Pedology is
more interesting, although he does mischaracterize me as THE editor
of Mind in Society. Some interesting refs there. The article was written in
about 1987 at a time when it was not so easy to get straight information
on these matters. The Makarenko stuff was interesting. I didn't know he was
connected with the NKVD  (assuming that is true).

Ease up. history is long, life is short.
mike

On Tue, May 18, 2010 at 6:06 PM, Andy Blunden <ablunden@mira.net> wrote:

> Fair point, Anton. I didn't check it because I didn't feel I qualified as
> someone 'familiar with Vladimir Petrovich Zinchenko', though I did 'know
> about the existence of such person'. I've read some of his work but I know
> nothing about the person beyond that. I have always tended to confuse the
> two Zinchenkos; are  they father and son? I have checked it now, of course,
> and from your comment I guess there must be a gross factual error in that
> little paragraph. But I can't tell. I'll have to trust you.
>
> Andy
>
>
> Anton Yasnitsky wrote:
>
>> Andy,
>>
>> I am under the impression you did not check out the link, specifically,
>> the quote in English. If not, please, feel free to do so. Just in case, here
>> is the link again:
>>
>> http://community.livejournal.com/psyhistorik/27712.html
>>
>> Please let us know if you do not believe this example counts as a
>> justification.
>>
>> Anton
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----
>> From: Andy Blunden <ablunden@mira.net>
>> To: "eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity" <xmca@weber.ucsd.edu>
>> Sent: Tue, May 18, 2010 8:12:24 PM
>> Subject: Re: [xmca] help: Vygotsky and pedology
>>
>> Anton,
>> When political leaders in my country tell you that another person is a
>> fool but don't have time to justify their claim they say: "Trust me!"
>>
>> Andy
>>
>> Anton Yasnitsky wrote:
>>
>>> Here is my first reaction to Eugene's question, the rest will follow when
>>> I find time to fully enjoy the paper in question:
>>>
>>> Below is the link to my favourite example of Holowinsky's scholarship
>>> that can be best appreciated by anybody familiar with Vladimir Petrovich
>>> Zinchenko, or who at least knows about the existence of such person and the
>>> basics of his genealogy:
>>>
>>> http://community.livejournal.com/psyhistorik/27712.html
>>>
>>> Enjoy :)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message ----
>>> From: Eugene Matusov <ematusov@udel.edu>
>>> To: "eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity" <xmca@weber.ucsd.edu>
>>> Sent: Tue, May 18, 2010 4:13:32 PM
>>> Subject: RE: [xmca] help: Vygotsky and pedology
>>>
>>> Dear Anton-
>>>
>>> Can you elaborate on Holowinsky's points in his article that you view as
>>> wrong, please? And what is your basis for this criticism? I'm asking
>>> these
>>> questions not because I want to challenge your views but because I want
>>> to
>>> learn more about this interesting and potentially influential history and
>>> you are a specilist in this area.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> Eugene
>>> PS I was surprised to read in Holowinsky's article about Makarenko's
>>> opposition to pedology. Do you know more about that, by any chance?
>>> ---------------------
>>> Eugene Matusov, Ph.D.
>>> Professor of Education
>>> School of Education
>>> University of Delaware
>>> 16 W Main st.
>>> Newark, DE 19716, USA
>>>
>>> email: ematusov@udel.edu
>>> fax: 1-(302)-831-4110
>>> website: http://ematusov.soe.udel.edu
>>> publications: http://ematusov.soe.udel.edu/vita/publications.htm
>>>
>>> Dialogic Pedagogy Forum: http://diaped.soe.udel.edu
>>> ---------------------
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>  -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: xmca-bounces@weber.ucsd.edu [mailto:xmca-
>>>> bounces@weber.ucsd.edu] On Behalf Of Anton Yasnitsky
>>>> Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 4:55 PM
>>>> To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity
>>>> Subject: Re: [xmca] help
>>>>
>>>> If I may add a comment, the author, as a rule,  presents a lot of
>>>>
>>> ridiculous--to
>>>
>>>> say just "erroneous" would be a gross understatement--stuff in his
>>>>
>>> writings,
>>>
>>>> so I would like to thank Mike for the paper and am anticipating a really
>>>> hilarious reading :)
>>>>
>>>> Anton
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message ----
>>>> From: Joao <jbmartin@sercomtel.com.br>
>>>> To: "eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity" <xmca@weber.ucsd.edu>
>>>> Sent: Sun, May 16, 2010 9:11:14 PM
>>>> Subject: [xmca] help
>>>>
>>>> Hi...
>>>> I need to find the paper "Vygotsky and the History of Pedology" of Ivan
>>>> Z.
>>>> Holowinsky. (School Psychology International, v. 9, 1988) Can anyone
>>>> help
>>>> me?
>>>>
>>>> Thanks
>>>>
>>>> Joao Martins
>>>>
>>>>
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>>>>
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>>
> --
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Andy Blunden http://home.mira.net/~andy/ <http://home.mira.net/%7Eandy/>+61 3 9380 9435 Skype andy.blunden
> An Interdisciplinary Theory of Activity: http://www.brill.nl/scss
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