Re: [xmca] dualism

[mike cole <lchcmike@gmail.com>]

As i hinted in my earlier note, Andy, I thought people would find it both
interesting and find things to disagree with. The person who most surprised
me was Tim Ingold whose work I greatly admire. While he went after, for
example, the "social vs ecological" dualism, he did not use the term,
culture, once in his talk. Very surprising.
mike

On Sun, Feb 28, 2010 at 7:44 PM, Andy Blunden <ablunden@mira.net> wrote:

> I wonder if you could offer any hints, Mike. I started listening to one of
> the brain-freaks, and to be honest I got bored. Though the production values
> were good. There is so much of this idiocy around. Is there some good people
> there (apart from good ol' Steven Rose)?
>
> I recently reviewed a collection of articles around this area
> ("Psychology's Territories") for "Theory & Psychology," covering "both
> sides" of the debate, which had some interesting takes on the question, some
> great stuff from historians of science. But in reading one of the "ruthless
> reductionists" (Wolfgang Prinz), I realized that Vygotsky offered us what I
> think is a good angle for making some kind of a bridge to these people that
> think that consciousness is an illusion. I think we should agree with them.
> But we should say,
>
> "Yes, it's an illusion but one which nonetheless allows us to survive and
> prosper (they'll agree with that) and it's an illusion which can be studied
> scientifically (perking up their interest). My consciousness is an illusion
> (well, an appearance really, because it is not mistaken), but for me, *your*
> consciousness is real (surprise, interest), and by observing your behaviour
> I can even tell what's in it. But I seriously doubt that you will ever
> figure out what's in it by looking at physiology. If it's an illusion, what
> do you expect to find in brain tissue?"
>
> What do you think?
> Andy
>
> mike cole wrote:
>
>> Thanks Andy-- Politzer is a very interesting figure in the Vygotskiana
>> world.
>>
>> If you have not done so, i really recommend the talks at the Danish Conf
>> on meaning beyond the brain both for a lot you can agree with and news
>> from interesting folks you have probably not encountered that you might or
>> might agree with. Interesting in all events.
>>
>> http://www.dpu.dk/site.aspx?p=14668
>>
>> mike
>>
>> On Sat, Feb 27, 2010 at 7:40 PM, Andy Blunden <ablunden@mira.net <mailto:
>> ablunden@mira.net>> wrote:
>>
>>    A FaceBook friend recently drew my attention to this fascinating
>>    commentary on Descartes by the early Marxist Psychologist, George
>>    Politzer:
>>
>>
>> http://marx.org/archive/politzer/works/1937/descartes-tricentennial.htm
>>
>>    Andy
>>    Martin Packer wrote:
>>
>>        Can you give some textual evidence for this statement, Michael?
>>
>>        Martin
>>
>>
>>        On Feb 26, 2010, at 1:09 PM, Michael Glassman wrote:
>>
>>            Martin, David, Jorge, all
>>
>>            .But
>>            these organizational structures are definitely inside of the
>>            head for
>>            Vygotsky so there really is no way for him to escape dualism.
>>
>>
>>
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>>    --
>>  ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>    Andy Blunden http://www.erythrospress.com/
>>    Classics in Activity Theory: Hegel, Leontyev, Meshcheryakov,
>>    Ilyenkov $20 ea
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>>
> --
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Andy Blunden http://www.erythrospress.com/
> Classics in Activity Theory: Hegel, Leontyev, Meshcheryakov, Ilyenkov $20
> ea
>
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