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RE: [xmca] Human spark TV show: when did the sparks begin?



Steve, 
I didn't see much of the series, but one part I did see had to do with
stone tool-making of a hominid cousin--I think Neanderthal. The comment
was that over thousands of years the technology of making this stone
tool did not progress an iota. So the fact of (somehow ???) inventing
the technology was a spark of genius, the spark didn't quite kindle into
flame at that phylogenetic period.
David

-----Original Message-----
From: xmca-bounces@weber.ucsd.edu [mailto:xmca-bounces@weber.ucsd.edu]
On Behalf Of Steve Gabosch
Sent: Tuesday, January 26, 2010 1:30 AM
To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity
Subject: Re: [xmca] Human spark TV show: when did the sparks begin?

Mike's comment about "many sparks," and that nicely made PBS show now  
available online in at least 2 of the 3 episodes about "The Human  
Spark -The Nature of Human Uniqueness", has gotten me thinking about a  
line of questioning that has been on my mind for some time, and which  
I'll pose in terms of the spark metaphor.

An online introduction to the series suggests that the human spark may  
be only 30K years old.

from:
http://www.pbs.org/wnet/humanspark/about/about-the-series-introduction/3
5/

"In the first program, Alda witnesses the dazzling (apparent) debut of  
the Human Spark in the spectacular 30,000 year-old artwork carved and  
painted on the walls of caves in France ..."

My question is: didn't the Neandertal peoples also possess some of the  
'human spark'?  And how about our many other human cousins - didn't  
humanity begin to 'spark' its way out of the animal world millions of  
years ago?

Surely, migrating all over the planet 50K or more years ago, and the  
development all the new technologies associated with that period -  
sometimes dubbed the "Great Leap Forward" - (barbed hooks, traps, wall  
paintings, etc. etc. etc.) - involved a new and dramatic wave of  
sparks.  And yes, from available evidence, modern humans, homo sapiens  
sapiens, appear to be no more than about 200K years old (all dating  
mentioned here is very rough, of course).

But what about other human (humanoid?) accomplishments - durable  
production tools such as stone axes, fire, and so forth?  Those were  
results and causes of human sparks, too - yes?

- Steve








On Jan 22, 2010, at 5:42 PM, mike cole wrote:

> Larry---
>
> Could we start to think in this way: elements of what created homo  
> sapiens
> sapiens was not a single spark. it was, under very special  
> environmental
> circumstances, perhaps involving also a mutation of some part of the  
> genome
> simulataneously, the coordination of many sparks at one time and  
> place?
>
> Compression of different humanoid populations in Northern Europe
> during ice age circa 50k years ago give or take several k years?
> mike
>
> On Thu, Jan 21, 2010 at 7:05 PM, Larry Purss <lpurss@shaw.ca> wrote:
>
>> Hi everyone
>> I posted this thought earlier and addressed it to Mabel by accident.
>> I thought I had lost it to the great unknown.
>> So here is my question directed through Mabel's response.
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: Mabel Encinas <liliamabel@hotmail.com>
>> Date: Thursday, January 21, 2010 2:04 pm
>> Subject: RE: [xmca] Human spark TV show
>> To: Larry <lpurss@shaw.ca>
>>
>>>
>>> Hi, Larry.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Before saying anything... did you mean to send this note to xmca?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Mabel
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Date: Thu, 21 Jan 2010 10:06:30 -0800
>>> From: lpurss@shaw.ca
>>> Subject: Re: RE: [xmca] Human spark TV show
>>> To: liliamabel@hotmail.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> You are welcome Mabel.
>>>
>>> I have a question about theoretically trying to connect the dots
>>> around a theme of  "theory of mind" referred to in the
>>> Human Spark and the notions of development.
>>> The show pointed out that chimps have awareness of their own
>>> perspective and may have limited capacity to "understand"
>>> anothers intentionality. However humans have the "capacity" or
>>> "potential" to hold up to 5 levels or perspectives of
>>> intentionality of mind.
>>> From a developmental perspective of "emergence" the theme that
>>> this seems to point to being able to hold multiple perspectives
>>> at the same time in "tension".
>>> Lave's notion of development as being able to take different
>>> "positions" (the structured term is "roles") may be an aspect of
>>> this emergence.
>>> Piaget's notion of de-centering may be pointing to a similar  
>>> capacity.
>>> The development of the capacity to "reflect" or RE-cognize may
>>> also be pointing in the same area.
>>> Bhaktin's notion of multivoicedness may be another perspective.
>>> G.H.Mead's and W. James social self  also seem to point to this.
>>> Peirce's notion of "fallibility" or holding the tension of
>>> "uncertainty" may also be implicated.
>>> Do  others on CHAT see a biological component to this
>>> capacity or the alternative is that our cultures are in such
>>> tension with the modern forms of communication that out of this
>>> cultural tension notions such as the above are being constructed
>>> to contain and give meaning to the tension.
>>> What do others think?
>>>
>>> Larry
>>> I was curious how others on CHAT
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: Mabel Encinas <liliamabel@hotmail.com>
>>> Date: Wednesday, January 20, 2010 11:12 pm
>>> Subject: RE: [xmca] Human spark TV show
>>> To: lpurss@shaw.ca
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Larry,
>>>>
>>>> Thank you for the reminder! I saw the other two: very good.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Mabel
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2010 19:19:56 -0800
>>>>> From: lpurss@shaw.ca
>>>>> To: xmca@weber.ucsd.edu
>>>>> Subject: [xmca] Human spark TV show
>>>>>
>>>>> For people on the west coast of America, the 3rd installment
>>>> of "The Human Spark" is on at 8PM Pacific time.
>>>>>
>>>>> Larry
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> xmca mailing list
>>>>> xmca@weber.ucsd.edu
>>>>> http://dss.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/xmca
>>>>
>>>> _________________________________________________________________
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