[xmca] Re: [UD-PIG] What good for kids seems dangerous for adults

[Mike Cole <lchcmike@gmail.com>]

Eugene, Tony, et al.

Firstly, I would like to follow up with the discussion of binaries which I
think is important, and allied items that came up in those notes. But Eugene
and
I can do that off line or when we (finally!) get to see each other, or
whenever. Unless the issues are of import to others who would seek
clarification or
tell us how we are both wrong headed, or whatever. I also want to write
seriously about the issue of youth desired activities and adult sanctioned
activities as these influence our work and general understanding. But this
is also a large issue and will take time and should not be discussed if
of narrow interest. So I would prefer to hear other voices chime in, as has
happened incredibly with the minus/plus math discussion.

(Another version of "what do you all think" rented from Eugene). And a way
of dealing with urgent need to respond to a very large number of student
fieldnotes before morning!!!).

Tony-- Your take on the issue Eugene raised is not what we are talking
about, but not unrelated. To me a really major manifestation of the
phenomenon
you are writing about is that in 1983 Sheila and I could write a text where
Barker and Wright's *One Boy's Day* was relevant, if antique. But you will
not find that empirical example (nor a lot else) in the current version of
that textbook. I rode the streets of LA and climbed around its sewer system
at a kid, and sold papers on a street corner in west LA in the late 40's
when "Midwest" was still a going mid-western town. NO NO NO now. So old
fashioned it might make the current generation titter as they twitter. More
on that later.

I am working and thinking about Sophie's brave efforts to understand -2*6.
The use of multiplication as repeated addition helps, but when I get
to -2*-6 I feel as if I am only part way there and want something like
Jerry's mirror approach. What makes it so strange is that at another level
I have no trouble with the contents of figure 1. Something about
commognition going it seems. Gotta study Ng's pic too.

Now, gotta go back to my local students until I have given them the feedback
they need for this coming week of work/learning/fun. Kotbegmot willing, I
will be back here  with you-all ere too long
mike



On Sun, May 3, 2009 at 9:32 AM, Tony Whitson <twhitson@udel.edu> wrote:

> I am eager to hear what Mike has to say.
>
> At the risk of commenting on something that may be different from Mike
> and/or Eugene's meaning:
>
> I think this has become more and more prevalent over the course of my
> lifetime, at least in the US.
>
> I went to school through 12th grade in Iowa, where there wasn't anyplace to
> go, really, even after age 16 when you could drive (although there were all
> kinds of adventures possible by bicycle).
>
> When I moved to Boston at 18, one thing that seemed really exciting to me
> was the way kids had free reign of that marvellous city, inexpensively via
> the MTA. When I lived in Chinatown, I saw diverse groups of kids (mixing,
> for example, Chinese and Italian from the North End) freely roaming the city
> on the Boston subway system.
>
> That seemed to change at the time of the conflict over busing, when
> politicians like Louise Day Hicks
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louise_Day_Hicks
> fanned the flames of fear and suspicion among population groups.
>
> Then, of course, came the paranoia over "Mr. Stranger Danger"
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stranger_danger
>  -- which although perhaps overreaction, was not totally without basis in
> reality.
>
> Now I live in an apartment complex with one entry from a suburban street to
> the lanes and parking lots within our complex. School buses pick kids up and
> drop kids off at that entry. At an age when I was riding my bike all over
> town in Illinois and then in Iowa, the kids today are watched over by their
> parents until they're on the bus, and then greeted by parents waiting for
> them when they're dropped off when they get home.
>
> I expect that Eugene and probably Mike were referring to things that are
> meaningful intellectually, aesthetically, etc.; but I think the problem, in
> the US at least, goes way beyond that.
>
> What do you think?
>
> On Sun, 3 May 2009, Eugene Matusov wrote:
>
>  Dear Mike-
>>
>>
>>
>> Many years ago, you made a very good point in one of our private phone
>> conversations that unfortunately, I did not write down after you. You said
>> something like, "Often what is meaningful for kids seems to be dangerous
>> for
>> adults." Is my memory correct? Can you elaborate on that? Have ever
>> written
>> on that?
>>
>>
>>
>> By now, I have so many observations and examples of this sad point. I wish
>> somebody studied this phenomenon on a systematic basis. I saw so many
>> cases
>> when adults literally suck the life out of kids because of their concerns
>> about kids' safety and well-being.
>>
>>
>>
>> What do you think?
>>
>>
>>
>> Eugene
>>
>>
>>
>> ---------------------
>>
>> Eugene Matusov, Ph.D.
>>
>> Professor of Education
>>
>> School of Education
>>
>> University of Delaware
>>
>> Newark, DE 19716, USA
>>
>>
>>
>> email: ematusov@udel.edu
>>
>> fax: 1-(302)-831-4110
>>
>> website:  <http://ematusov.soe.udel.edu/> http://ematusov.soe.udel.edu
>>
>> publications:  <http://ematusov.soe.udel.edu/vita/publications.htm>
>> http://ematusov.soe.udel.edu/vita/publications.htm
>>
>>
>>
>> Dialogic Pedagogy Forum:  <http://diaped.soe.udel.edu/>
>> http://diaped.soe.udel.edu
>>
>> ---------------------
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
> Tony Whitson
> UD School of Education
> NEWARK  DE  19716
>
> twhitson@udel.edu
> _______________________________
>
> "those who fail to reread
>  are obliged to read the same story everywhere"
>                  -- Roland Barthes, S/Z (1970)
>
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