Re: [xmca]schools-without-computers-by-choice-and-conviction-that-they-dont-help-kids

[Arturo Escandon <arturo.escandon@gmail.com>]

Not so native to the US. Meet the intellectual drive behind
neoliberalism in the UK and the US, Friedrich Hayek.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friedrich_Hayek

Best.

Arturo

On 31 October 2011 09:45, Andy Blunden <ablunden@mira.net> wrote:
> C'mon Huw! :) "Neo-liberal" is an extremely common term in public discourse
> here in Australia. Of course I can't answer for the US, even though the
> ideas arrived here from the US. Here's the Wikipedia entry:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neoliberalism which shows its specific meanings
> in a number of different countries. I would say that the term came in in the
> wake of the failure of both Keynes and Milton Friedman, though the notion is
> very sympathetic to Milton Friedman's ideology, but not so closely
> associated with control of the macro-economic levers by central government.
> Part of the difficulty of accepting the term in the US may be the use of
> "liberal" as a term of abuse by those who are in fact "neo-liberals". The
> ideas are native to the US but the choice of word is somewhat "un-American."
> :)
>
> Andy
>
> Huw Lloyd wrote:
>>
>> On 30 October 2011 23:57, Michael Glassman <MGlassman@ehe.osu.edu> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>
>>> Hi Huw.
>>>
>>> Neo-liberal has almost nothing to do with traditional definitions of
>>> liberal.  There is a long and convoluted history to the term.  I might
>>> suggest Naomi Klein's book for a good definition if you are interested.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> That it explains why I didn't know it.  It disqualifies itself.
>>
>> Huw
>>
>>
>>
>>>
>>> Michael
>>>
>>> ________________________________
>>>
>>> From: xmca-bounces@weber.ucsd.edu on behalf of Huw Lloyd
>>> Sent: Sun 10/30/2011 7:44 PM
>>> To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity
>>> Subject: Re:
>>>
>>> [xmca]schools-without-computers-by-choice-and-conviction-that-they-dont-help-kids
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 30 October 2011 22:26, Michael Glassman <MGlassman@ehe.osu.edu> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Hi Huw,
>>>>
>>>> My difficulty with the Gates Foundation is similar to many of the
>>>> corporate sponsors pouring money into foundations in attempts to
>>>>
>>>
>>> influence
>>>
>>>>
>>>> education policy.  The worst among them is probably the Broad Foundation
>>>> which I believe has been highly detrimental in the corporate
>>>>
>>>
>>> administrators
>>>
>>>>
>>>> that they are training and then bribing impoverished school districts
>>>>
>>>
>>> (with
>>>
>>>>
>>>> tip money to them) to put them in power.  I think they've been failures
>>>> everywhere, but of course when you have backers like that you fail
>>>>
>>>
>>> upwards.
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Anyway I see many of these "foundations" as attempting to instill a
>>>>
>>>
>>> strong
>>>
>>>>
>>>> neo-liberal ideology in our schools.  It is part of Naomi Klein's "Shock
>>>> Doctrine."  These foundations are turning our school systems into the
>>>>
>>>
>>> Chile
>>>
>>>>
>>>> of 2011.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> Hi Michael,
>>>
>>> The connotations of the term 'liberal' in the uk are mostly positive, for
>>> instance of seeking to go beyond symptoms, such as tolerating anti-social
>>> behaviour in favour of the promise of a more permanent and significant
>>> improvement (i.e. transformation rather than containment).   The other
>>> side
>>> of the coin is the notion of putting "well meaning" before realistic, or
>>> practical, implementation.
>>>
>>> Does "neo" in the political stream connote "watered down"?  As opposed to
>>> its use in philosophy such as Neoplatonism.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Sorry for the rant, but this is one of my many peeves (so many I can't
>>>> even claim they are pets anymore).
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> Maybe you could start a peeve hive?  :)
>>>
>>> Huw
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Michael
>>>>
>>>> ________________________________
>>>>
>>>> From: xmca-bounces@weber.ucsd.edu on behalf of Huw Lloyd
>>>> Sent: Sun 10/30/2011 4:56 PM
>>>> To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity
>>>> Subject: Re:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> [xmca]schools-without-computers-by-choice-and-conviction-that-they-dont-help-kids
>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 26 October 2011 13:03, Michael Glassman <MGlassman@ehe.osu.edu>
>>>>
>>>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> [...]
>>>>> There is also the idea of who is actually interviewed in the article
>>>>>
>>>
>>> and
>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> quote in the blog post.  The head of e-bay isn't really that much of a
>>>>> technology person, more of a businessman, and I believe a strong
>>>>> libertarian.  Don't assume the Silicon Valley people have that good a
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> grasp
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> of education.  Remember Bill Gates (I know, he's Seattle) and his
>>>>> foundation are in my opinion doing more harm than good to open and
>>>>> progressive education.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Hi Michael,
>>>>
>>>> Out of interest, what flavour of objection do you have to the Gates
>>>> Foundation?
>>>>
>>>> My thoughts were about the cautionary ideas exemplified by Ivan Illich
>>>> (secondary problems introduced by institutionalising monetarily poorer
>>>> countries and the like), though I'm currently fairly ignorant of what
>>>> they're actually doing.
>>>>
>>>> Huw
>>>> __________________________________________
>>>> _____
>>>> xmca mailing list
>>>> xmca@weber.ucsd.edu
>>>> http://dss.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/xmca
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> __________________________________________
>>>> _____
>>>> xmca mailing list
>>>> xmca@weber.ucsd.edu
>>>> http://dss.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/xmca
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> __________________________________________
>>> _____
>>> xmca mailing list
>>> xmca@weber.ucsd.edu
>>> http://dss.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/xmca
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> __________________________________________
>>> _____
>>> xmca mailing list
>>> xmca@weber.ucsd.edu
>>> http://dss.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/xmca
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> __________________________________________
>> _____
>> xmca mailing list
>> xmca@weber.ucsd.edu
>> http://dss.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/xmca
>>
>>
>>
>
> --
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> *Andy Blunden*
> Joint Editor MCA: http://www.tandfonline.com/toc/hmca20/18/1
> Home Page: http://home.mira.net/~andy/
> Book: http://www.brill.nl/default.aspx?partid=227&pid=34857
>
> __________________________________________
> _____
> xmca mailing list
> xmca@weber.ucsd.edu
> http://dss.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/xmca
>



-- 
Arturo J Escandon
Associate Professor
Department of Spanish and Latin-American Studies
Nanzan University
18 Yamazato-cho, Showa-ku
Nagoya, 466-8673 JAPAN

Tel: +81 (52) 832 3111 (extension 3604)
Mobile: +81 (908) 796 4220
E-mail: escandon@nanzan-u.ac.jp
arturo.escandon@nakamachi.com
__________________________________________
_____
xmca mailing list
xmca@weber.ucsd.edu
http://dss.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/xmca