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Re: [xmca] Polls are closed: Manfred Holodynsk's article is choice



Helena, consider the following scenario which Manfred uses to illustrate what he calls "personal sense" and "societal meanings":

       "People do not appropriate the use of signs and their meanings
       during social interactions in an impartial way.  They interpret
       and use them in the light of their actually elicited motives
       along with the motives they assign to the interaction partner.
       The societal meaning of the used signs does not have to match
       the individually assigned personal sense.  For example, an
       outsider may well interpret a public fit of rage by a
       low-ranking bank employee towards his superior as an inexcusable
       violation of social etiquette. However, for the menial employee,
       it may well be a reassertion of self-esteem in response to a
       humiliating directive" (p. 22).

What I see is that the "low-ranking bank employee" might, for example, have been a union member, maybe even attended one of your training course the previous week. Whatever the reason, the response is not immediately "personal", but arises from the employee's commitments to projects including projects other than that embodied in the practical norms of the bank as a profit-making enterprise (aka "social etiquette"). What is personal is "the motivating sphere of consciousness, a sphere that includes our inclinations and needs, our interests and impulses, and our affect and emotion." (Vygotsky, Thinking and Speech, chapter 7, quoted on the same page by Holodynski). As Manfred points out, these motivations, etc., are not just a subset of "societal meanings". Personal sense is something qualitatively different, which is acquired in the course of participation in a variety of (societal) activities (or projects).

The kind of conflict which could arise in this scenario is what Vasilyuk had in mind when he considered what he called "life relations" which may conflict with each other and generate personal crises. In fact, all of Vasilyuk's work depends on the fact that a person has commitments to multiple projects, which are both societal and personal in their ontological status. "Activities" (or projects) exist, and it is thanks to such activities that we have concepts, and only thus it is possible for us to understand human action, because human actions are not generally to be explained by their immediate goals, but rather make sense only when seen as part of larger ("molar") projects. Without being able to grasp, using concepts, the various of projects motivating a person's actions and underlying their emotional expression displayed as they do so, it would be impossible to understand human action. But I do agree with Martin in one respect (23/03/2013) - there is no omniscient observer to tell us what is the "societal meaning." In ANL's time, the Politburo was supposed to play that role, but that was an illusion anyway. Now we see life more as a fabric woven of divers threads. But I am not concerned about being provided with "a criterion for choosing between projects" - the individual's actions and their emotional responses signal to us their practical relation to the various projects underway in their life, and make them comprehensible to themselves and others.

My point is just that the binary contast between personal sense and societal meaning is untenable.

Rather, activities, as particular instances (or realisations) of a concept mediate between the universal concepts provided in our material culture, and individual actions. All these "can be verified in a purely empirical way."

Andy

Helena Worthen wrote:
Carol --

Certainly. And this difference has implications. For example: Learning.
When one learns a job that one does for art's sake, one learns it
differently (or is taught it differently) than when one learns a job for
the utilitarian motive of receiving money. Or, another example: social
context.  The place where one practices a job that one does for art's sake
is likely to be unregulated, whereas the place where one practices a job
that one does to earn money is going to be -- or is supposed to be
regulated. These regulations govern the relationship between the worker
and the person/s who employ him/her/. Etc.

Helena

On 3/27/13 9:40 PM, "Carol Macdonald" <carolmacdon@gmail.com> wrote:

Helena

Andy points out in his book (An interdisciplinary theory of activity) that
people may work for arts sake, but they may have a utilitarian motive for
their work, for example working for the money. I think you may be in
agreement with this.

Carol

On 28 March 2013 00:20, Helena Worthen <helenaworthen@gmail.com> wrote:

Martin --

Apologies for lurking, following by cryptic/petulant message.

The point being that the same action can, depending on what activity
system you're looking at it from, mean two very different things. And
they
can be in conflict, ranging from a cool, subdued conflict, to a very hot
one. Specifically (since my interest lies in how people negotiated
decent
conditions of work), someone can be doing a job for the purpose of
earning
a living, and care not one whit about what the industry is (could be
weaving cloth, making bombs, dumping garbage pails in a restaurant,
grading papers). Or the person can be doing a job for the purpose of
doing
the job. Most studies of the workplace assume that people at work are
working for the purpose that the firm/company/enterprise/industry is set
up for. When they overlook the possibility that two very different,
sometimes conflicting activities are taking place (an activity system
defined by motive/purpose), then they can't discern how people are
feeling, how they're learning to do the job, how they're managing their
effort, etc etc.

Thanks for asking.

Helena

On 3/27/13 1:42 PM, "Martin Packer" <packer@duq.edu> wrote:

Hi Helena,

Which point are you referring to? There have been so many!

Martin

On Mar 27, 2013, at 1:13 PM, Helena Worthen <helenaworthen@gmail.com>
wrote:

Hello -- Exactly my point in my MCA article on using AT to study
work.
Helena Worthen
Hworthen@illinois.edu

On 3/22/13 8:40 AM, "Holodynski, Manfred"
<manfred.holodynski@uni-muenster.de> wrote:

Dear colleagues,

thank you very much for all your valued comments on my article.
There
are
a lot of aspects already discussed and I have some difficulties to
follow
all lines of argumentation. Therefore, I would like to answer to the
following:

1. Emotions as psychological function within the macrostructure of
activity.

As Andy claims it I get my Activity Theory from AN Leont'ev and I
focused
especially on his concept of macrostructure of activity and its
levels
of
activity that is related to motives, actions that are related to
goals
and operations that are related to the conditions under which an
action
is given. And Andy gets precisely to the heart of it when he stated
that
my article needs to be read with attention to motivation and how the
macrostructure of an activity is related to the motives and goals
of an
individual. One activity can be realized by different actions, and
one
action can realize different activities.



May I quote Andy's words:

" Because motives are not given to immediate perception; they have
to
be
inferred/learnt. Emotional expression and experience signal the
success,
failure, frustration, expectation, etc. of goals and motives for
both
participant/observers and the individual subject themself, emotion
is
tied up with motives and goals and therefore with the structure of
an
activity. One and the same action could be part of different
""actions
activities (!) (MH)"". It is the emotions which signal (internally
and
externally) the success, etc., etc., that is, in an action's
furthering
an activity, and it is this which makes manifest and actual that
connection between action and activity, for both the
observer/participant
and the individual subject.

So there is no metaphysics here. No hypothetical "states of mind",
or
intelligent infants, etc."



a) Take the example of the opening of the window. That's the
behavior.
What's the goal?

b) Imagine the person is a leader and opens the window in order to
greet
his followers and to hold a speech. That's the goal. What is the
activity?

c) If one look at the circumstances one can derive that the speech
is a
part of a political activity in order to celebrate the election
victory.
So, if the leader also feels pride and enthusiasm about the victory
there
is coincidence between the publically assigned meaning and the
personally
felt sense of the situation. However, it may also be possible that
he
doesn't feel pride but a great burden and he personally feels to be
overloaded with the duties and future expectations. Then the
societal
meaning assigned by the followers to this situation and the personal
sense assigned by the leader himself are not congruent. The leader
framed
this situation under an achievement perspective whether he is able
to
fulfill the leadership.



But, note when we talk about actions and activity, then we speak
about
an
advanced level of activity e.g. in children or adults, but not in
infants
who start to have intentions but still not a mental image of a
future
state of affairs.



2. Differentiation between the basic level in infants and advanced
level
in older children:

- A young infant has not already established a goal-driven level of
actions. In the first weeks one can observe the acquisition of first
operations and of first expectations what should happen. But these
expectations are not yet represented as a mental image about the
desired
future states. This is the product of the acquisition of a sign
system
which enables the person to evoke and  imagine a future state in the
here
and now and to start to strive for it. And for this starting point,
not
only to imagine different future states, but also to select one of
them
and to start to strive for it, emotional processes come into play
that
color one of the imagined future state e.g. in a state worth
striving
for
and that mobilize the executive power to start striving for it.

However, the ability to form such notions of goals and to transform
them
into actions is not something that occurs automatically. It emerges
in
a
long-drawn ontogenetic learning process in which the attainment of
goals
through actions is tried, tested, and increasingly optimized. Older
children are



So, for an understanding of my emotion concept the macrostructure
of an
activity is very decisive because I embedded emotions as a specific
psychological function within the macrostructure of an activity.



Best

Manfred



Prof. Dr. Manfred Holodynski

Institut für Psychologie in Bildung und Erziehung

Westfälische Wilhelms-Universität Münster

Fliednerstr. 21

D-48149 Münster

+49-(0)-251-83-34311

+49-(0)-251-83-34310 (Sekretariat)

+49-(0)-251-83-34314 (Fax)


http://wwwpsy.uni-muenster.de/Psychologie.inst5/AEHolodynski/index.html
manfred.holodynski@uni-muenster.de





-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
Von: Andy Blunden [mailto:ablunden@mira.net]
Gesendet: Freitag, 22. März 2013 04:13
An: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity
Cc: Holodynski, Manfred
Betreff: Re: Polls are closed: Manfred Holodynsk's article is choice



Mike, Manfred gets his Activity Theory from AN Leontyev, rather than
Engestrom's "systems of activity."

So actions and activities are defined by their goals and motives. So
Manfred's article needs to be read with attention to motivation and
how
the structure of an activity is related to motives and goals.
Because
motives are not given to immediate perception; they have to be
inferred/learnt. Emotional expression and experience signal the
success,
failure, frustration, expectation, etc. of goals and motives for
both
participant/observers and the individual subject themself, emotion
is
tied up with motives and goals and therefore with the structure of
an
activity. One and the same action could be part of different
actions.
It
is the emotions which signal (internally and externally) the
success,
etc., etc., that is, in an action's furthering an activity, and it
is
this which makes manifest and actual that connection between action
and
activity, for both the observer/participant and the individual
subject.
So there is no metaphysics here. No hypothetical "states of mind",
or
intelligent infants, etc.



It's all in there.



Andy



mike cole wrote:

Hi Andy - and here I was wondering why operation/action/activity
were
not prominent in Manfred's article. Where does he lay out the
views in
this note? Am I reading too superficially as usual? Seems important
for me to get clear about! Mike On Thursday, March 21, 2013, Andy Blunden wrote: Think of your illustration,Martin, about whether, in opening the window, you were acting as a technician or moral leader. I.e.,
the
   meaning of the action lies in the activity of which it is a
part,
   which is not immediately given. Manfred does not refer this to
"intention" or "belief". Manfred is quite specific that the signalising and self-perception of an action in relation to an activity - i.e., an action's being of this and not that
activity -
   is a function played by emotion. Concepts like internal state
and
   intention are derivative from operation/action/activity, not
fundamental. Andy


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--
Carol A  Macdonald Ph D (Edin)
Developmental psycholinguist: EMBED
Academic, Researcher, Writer and Editor
Honorary Research Fellow: Department of Linguistics, Unisa
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--
------------------------------------------------------------------------
*Andy Blunden*
Home Page: http://home.mira.net/~andy/
Book: http://www.brill.nl/concepts
http://marxists.academia.edu/AndyBlunden

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