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RE: [xmca] Communication/social relations/obshenie

Yes, "communication" is used like that; but I think it's profoundly wrong to
reduce social signification to communication in this sense.

Derrida was critical of that tendency in Saussure. I've attached a pdf with
a couple quotes (it's from the amazon preview page -- sorry but I don't have
time to "communicate" the content in a smoother way right now).

Peirce also often fell into this way of rendering signification as
communication. Rick Parmentier finds Peirce to have arrived late in his
career at this kind of reduction as his general position. I think Rick
overstates CSP's commitment to this position, but it was a pronounced
tendency. (I think Engstrom misinterprets Parmentier's interpretation of
Peirce here.)

I am writing on this now, proposing a different understanding of
signification (including thinking, social organization, and understanding).
One implication is that Sfard's use of "communication" for "commognition"
might not do justice to where she wants to go with that. 

-----Original Message-----
From: xmca-bounces@weber.ucsd.edu [mailto:xmca-bounces@weber.ucsd.edu] On
Behalf Of mike cole
Sent: Saturday, November 21, 2009 11:22 AM
To: eXtended Mind, Culture,Activity
Subject: [xmca] Communication/social relations/obshenie

" Since communication is the precise measure of the possibility of social
organization, of good understanding among men (sic), relations that are
beyond its range are not truly social..
GH Cooley, 1894.

for Cooley, like Pierce, "mind is made concrete in culture."

Cooley's first book: The theory of transportation. No accident that.

If asked for the dominant translation, communication would be my
translation, David. Work of mine using the word communication has been
translated using obshenie repeatedly in Russian. Of course, that brings us
to a point you do not explicitly raise. What does communication mean in
English in .....1830/1930/1950/2009? In England, the US and elsewhere. The
complex transformations of the word's dominant meanings in different
discourses has been changing (I am at present teaching a course on the
"history of communication" and the issue is ever before us).

Relevant here, as well, is the point made by Suppes, emphasized by
D'Andrade, and appropriated by me in various contexts that defintions are
often/always covertly theories.

Seems like its a term ripe for a systematic comparative treatment. Who
knows, perhaps friend Boris Mescheryakov, who interests himself in such
issues, will help us out!!

On Sat, Nov 21, 2009 at 6:08 AM, Bella Kotik-Friedgut <bella.kotik@gmail.com
> wrote:

> David, I consider that "общение" may be translated as "communication" 
> or "contact" depending on the context, but "social relations" would be 
> "общественные отношения".
> Bella Kotik

Attachment: Derrida on Communication.pdf
Description: Adobe PDF document

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