[Xmca-l] Re: Best possible theoretical approach on learning from life experiences
Beth Ferholt
bferholt@gmail.com
Fri Nov 17 23:46:13 PST 2017
Thank you, Ulvi. I AM sorry for the delay. Sometimes I can not keep with
XMCA's pace.
At this point the thread has gone in too many (new for me) directions for
me to follow, although the second reading looks very useful for me now --
thank you, David.
We were thinking of all consciousness as having an aesthetic form, but I am
trying to develop this a little more in an upcoming chapter.
I saw Pinar used Woolf's Mrs. Bennet and Mr. Brown and so went back to that
-- I do suggest it to you if you have not read it!
Beth
On Wed, Nov 8, 2017 at 1:13 PM, Ulvi İçil <ulvi.icil@gmail.com> wrote:
> Berth,
>
> >From your article with Nillson:
>
> to describe a perezhivanie, just
> described as “the frame that makes life like art,” as an action: a means of
> creating the aesthetic form of
> consciousness.
>
> Then, we can suppose that a poet, as an artist, if he is especially a
> communist one, loaded with consciousness, who strives for creating the
> aesthetic form of consciousness for others, can live life as a perezhivanie
> and can us make use of his own life to "teach life to others" and "to
> fasten development of consciousness" (these two latter belon to Nazim
> Hikmet, communist poet).
>
> I think your article with Nillson will be a very enligtening one.
>
> Ulvi
>
>
>
> On 8 November 2017 at 18:33, Beth Ferholt <bferholt@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Robert, Thank you so much for this paper. It is just what I need to read
> > NOW, for a chapter proposal I am reading. Wonderful.
> > Ulvi, Thank you very much: I can send this congratulations back to my
> > younger self : ) .
> > Beth
> >
> > On Wed, Nov 8, 2017 at 11:23 AM, Robert Lake <
> boblake@georgiasouthern.edu>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > Thanks Beth!
> > > I am reminded immediately of Pinar and Grumet's notion of " Currere"
> the
> > > infinitive form of the Latin word curriculum.
> > > which I continually use for and with my education students.
> > > In 2004 Pinar explained that:
> > > The method of currere reconceptualized curriculum from course
> > > objectives to complicated conversation with oneself
> > > (as a 'private' intellectual), an ongoing project of
> > self-understanding
> > > in which one becomes mobilized for engaged pedagogical action
> > > —as a private-and-public intellectual – with others in the social
> > > reconstruction of the public sphere". *What is Curriculum Theory.*
> > > <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Currere#cite_note-pinar2004-2>
> > > This approach has been misrepresented as being "too Western and linear"
> > > but I think that is unfair. Your can use this anyway you want. It also
> > > reminds me of LSV'S notion of the dialectic between inner speech
> > > and public "performance."
> > >
> > > Here is a link to the groundbreaking paper from 1975.
> > >
> > > http://files.eric.ed.gov/fulltext/ED104766.pdf
> > >
> > > Robert L.
> > >
> > > On Wed, Nov 8, 2017 at 10:58 AM, Beth Ferholt <bferholt@gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > > Before Mike introduced me to Vasilyuk -- who looks to Crime and
> > > Punishment
> > > > -- I thought the best place to go to think about a person's life,
> > > formation
> > > > and learning with something similar to perezhivanie at the center was
> > > > Virginia Woolf, To the Lighthouse and The Waves especially.
> > > >
> > > > I think the question of whether or not autobiography or poetry is the
> > > > better place to look is very interesting, and a response would have
> > > > something to do with bodily sensations but also with suicide because
> in
> > > > suicide and some art you have an end point: In autobiography you have
> > the
> > > > "I", I suppose, but you need to have the closure, too.
> > > >
> > > > I think you combine these two with the "going meta," and Woolf shows
> > > > herself thinking about thinking ... so this is why her work is
> helpful
> > > > here.
> > > > Beth
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Wed, Nov 8, 2017 at 9:58 AM, Ulvi İçil <ulvi.icil@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Thank you Robert!
> > > > >
> > > > > 8 Kas 2017 17:56 tarihinde "Robert Lake" <
> > boblake@georgiasouthern.edu>
> > > > > yazdı:
> > > > >
> > > > > > Hi Andy, Ulvi and all!
> > > > > > Thank-you for connecting autobiography and perezhivanie. Back in
> > 1984
> > > > > > before #meta became trendy,Jerome Bruner
> > > > > > referred to this with his students this way.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > There was also talk about how people go beyond merely knowing
> about
> > > > > things
> > > > > > to reflecting upon them in order to effect correction and
> > > self-repair —
> > > > > how
> > > > > > to get students to reflect, to turn around on themselves, to go
> > > "meta,"
> > > > > to
> > > > > > think about their ways of thinking.
> > > > > > —"Notes on the Cognitive Revolution" (*Interchange*
> > > > > > <http://www.springerlink.com/content/h115766255987075/>, 1984.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > *Robert L.*
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Retrieved from :
> > > > > > https://www.visualthesaurus.com/cm/wordroutes/its-getting-
> > > > > > meta-all-the-time/
> > > > > >
> > > > > > On Mon, Nov 6, 2017 at 8:09 PM, Andy Blunden <ablunden@mira.net>
> > > > wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > I think autobiography is a genre which is very rich for the
> > > > > > > study of perezhivanie; even the writing of the autobiography
> > > > > > > itself is a part of the perezhivanie, as the writer looks
> > > > > > > back over their life, and the experiences which have shaped
> > > > > > > them, reassessing how they responded to events intervening
> > > > > > > in their life and surviving. I think I mentioned Gorki's
> > > > > > > multi-volume autobiography to you,
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Andy
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > > > Andy Blunden
> > > > > > > http://www.ethicalpolitics.org/ablunden/index.htm
> > > > > > > On 7/11/2017 6:28 AM, Ulvi İçil wrote:
> > > > > > > > Also the following "survival of culture" theme is said to be
> a
> > > > > > principal
> > > > > > > > worry for Marina Tsvetaeva
> > > > > > > > by this same Turkish professor on Russian language and
> > > > literature...
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Anyway, another method to study "perezhivanie", I believe, is
> > to
> > > > look
> > > > > > > into
> > > > > > > > theses on the life of such Russian poets, even if they do not
> > use
> > > > the
> > > > > > > > concept,
> > > > > > > > we can be sure that there is a lot of "perezhivanie" in
> those
> > > > > > theses...
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > probably because poets are the best human beings to study
> > > > > > "perezhivanie"
> > > > > > > > for reasons easy to conceive.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Especially when we think to Mayakovsky, Yesenin,
> > Tsvetaeva...who
> > > > all
> > > > > > > > suicided, unfortunately.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > On 6 November 2017 at 21:14, Ulvi İçil <ulvi.icil@gmail.com>
> > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >> It seems to me that the concept perezhivanie is a sine qua
> non
> > > > > concept
> > > > > > > for
> > > > > > > >> studying the lives and works of poets especially: Pushkin,
> and
> > > > many
> > > > > > > others.
> > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > >> I would say that a poet's life and work can not and should
> not
> > > be
> > > > > > > studied
> > > > > > > >> without this concept.
> > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > >> Completely impossible.
> > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > >> For instance, for Pushkin, a poem is a magical union of
> > sounds,
> > > > > > thoughts
> > > > > > > >> and feelings, which fits completely with intellect and
> affect,
> > > > > > cognition
> > > > > > > >> and emotion.
> > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > >> In case of some other poets, I would add "colours" because
> for
> > > > > > instance,
> > > > > > > >> Nazim Hikmet (who is said to see the world in colours) says
> > that
> > > > the
> > > > > > > >> closest poet to him is Eluard and there is a thesis on
> colour
> > in
> > > > the
> > > > > > > poems
> > > > > > > >> of Eluard and Hikmet. (May this mean Pushkin was more
> > sensitive
> > > to
> > > > > > > sounds
> > > > > > > >> than colours? An outstanding Turkish professor on Russian
> > > language
> > > > > and
> > > > > > > >> literature told me that there is not slightest deviation of
> > > rythm
> > > > in
> > > > > > > >> Pushkin whereas there is in all others)
> > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > >> Do we know any example of any such study in Russian
> > databases? A
> > > > > poet
> > > > > > > >> studied with "perezhivanie".
> > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > >> On 4 November 2017 at 14:02, Andy Blunden <
> ablunden@mira.net>
> > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > >>> I would recommend Vasilyuk, but AN Leontyev should be read
> > > > > > > >>> as well:
> > > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > > >>> http://www.ethicalpolitics.org/ablunden/pdfs/Fedor%
> > > > 20Vasilyuk.pdf
> > > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > > >>> http://www.ethicalpolitics.org/ablunden/pdfs/Fedor%
> > > > 20Vasilyuk.pdf
> > > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > > >>> Andy
> > > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > > >>> ------------------------------
> ------------------------------
> > > > > > > >>> Andy Blunden
> > > > > > > >>> http://www.ethicalpolitics.org/ablunden/index.htm
> > > > > > > >>> On 4/11/2017 10:41 PM, Ulvi İçil wrote:
> > > > > > > >>>> Dear all,
> > > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > > >>>> For a study on Turkish poet, also a painter and
> playwright,
> > > > Nazim
> > > > > > > >>> Hikmet,
> > > > > > > >>>> whom learning seems to be heavily determined from life
> > > > experiences
> > > > > > at
> > > > > > > >>> each
> > > > > > > >>>> stage of his life,
> > > > > > > >>>> I am looking for a best theoretical approach in general on
> > > > > learning
> > > > > > > from
> > > > > > > >>>> life experiences, then more specifically for such great
> > poets,
> > > > > > > painters
> > > > > > > >>> and
> > > > > > > >>>> play writers.
> > > > > > > >>>> Just to give a closer idea, please look at the section
> below
> > > > from
> > > > > > his
> > > > > > > >>>> novel, Life's good, brother.
> > > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > > >>>> I appreciate highly any idea, proposal on such a
> theoretical
> > > > > > approach.
> > > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > > >>>> Thank you.
> > > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > > >>>> Ulvi
> > > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > > >>>> I sat down at the table in the Hôtel de France in Batum. A
> > > table
> > > > > > with
> > > > > > > >>>> carved legs—not just the legs but the whole gilded oval
> > table
> > > > was
> > > > > > > >>> covered
> > > > > > > >>>> with intricate carvings. Rococo . . . In the seaside house
> > in
> > > > > > > Üsküdar, a
> > > > > > > >>>> rococo
> > > > > > > >>>> table sits in the guestroom. Ro-co-co . . . The journey I
> > made
> > > > > from
> > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > >>>> Black
> > > > > > > >>>> Sea coast to Ankara, then from there to Bolu, the
> > > > thirty-five-day,
> > > > > > > >>>> thirty-fiveyear
> > > > > > > >>>> journey on foot to the town where I taught school—in
> short,
> > to
> > > > > make
> > > > > > a
> > > > > > > >>>> long story short, the encounter of a pasha’s
> descendant—more
> > > > > > > precisely,
> > > > > > > >>> a
> > > > > > > >>>> grandson—with Anatolia now rests on the rococo table in
> the
> > > > Hôtel
> > > > > de
> > > > > > > >>>> France in Batum, spread out over the table like a
> tattered,
> > > > dirty,
> > > > > > > >>>> blood-stained
> > > > > > > >>>> block-print cloth. I look, and I want to cry. I look, and
> my
> > > > blood
> > > > > > > >>> rushes
> > > > > > > >>>> to my
> > > > > > > >>>> head in rage. I look, and I’m ashamed again. Of the house
> by
> > > the
> > > > > sea
> > > > > > > in
> > > > > > > >>>> Üsküdar. Decide, son, I say to myself, decide. The
> decision
> > > was
> > > > > > made:
> > > > > > > >>> death
> > > > > > > >>>> before turning back. Wait, don’t rush, son. Let’s put the
> > > > > questions
> > > > > > on
> > > > > > > >>> this
> > > > > > > >>>> table, right next to Anatolia here. What can you sacrifice
> > for
> > > > > this
> > > > > > > >>> cause?
> > > > > > > >>>> What
> > > > > > > >>>> can you give? Everything. Everything I have. Your freedom?
> > > Yes!
> > > > > How
> > > > > > > >>>> many years can you rot in prison for this cause? All my
> > life,
> > > if
> > > > > > > >>> necessary!
> > > > > > > >>>> Yes, but you like women, fine dining, nice clothes. You
> > can’t
> > > > wait
> > > > > > to
> > > > > > > >>>> travel,
> > > > > > > >>>> to see Europe, Asia, America, Africa. If you just leave
> > > Anatolia
> > > > > > here
> > > > > > > on
> > > > > > > >>>> this
> > > > > > > >>>> rococo table in Batum and go from Tbilisi to Kars and back
> > to
> > > > > Ankara
> > > > > > > >>> from
> > > > > > > >>>> there, in five or six years you’ll be a senator, a
> > > > minister—women,
> > > > > > > >>> wining
> > > > > > > >>>> and
> > > > > > > >>>> dining, art, the whole world. No! If necessary, I can
> spend
> > my
> > > > > whole
> > > > > > > >>> life in
> > > > > > > >>>> prison. Okay, but what about getting hanged, killed, or
> > > drowned
> > > > > like
> > > > > > > >>> Mustafa
> > > > > > > >>>> Suphi and his friends if I become a Communist—didn’t you
> ask
> > > > > > yourself
> > > > > > > >>> these
> > > > > > > >>>> questions in Batum? I did. I asked myself, Are you afraid
> of
> > > > being
> > > > > > > >>>> killed? I’m not afraid, I said. Just like that, without
> > > > thinking?
> > > > > > No.
> > > > > > > I
> > > > > > > >>>> first knew
> > > > > > > >>>> I was afraid, then I knew I wasn’t. Okay, are you ready to
> > be
> > > > > > > disabled,
> > > > > > > >>>> crippled, or made deaf for this cause? I asked. And TB,
> > heart
> > > > > > disease,
> > > > > > > >>>> blindness? Blindness? Blindness . . . Wait a minute—I
> hadn’t
> > > > > thought
> > > > > > > >>> about
> > > > > > > >>>> going blind for this cause. I got up. I shut my eyes tight
> > and
> > > > > > walked
> > > > > > > >>> around
> > > > > > > >>>> the room. Feeling the furniture with my hands, I walked
> > around
> > > > the
> > > > > > > room
> > > > > > > >>> in
> > > > > > > >>>> the darkness of my closed eyes. Twice I stumbled, but I
> > didn’t
> > > > > open
> > > > > > my
> > > > > > > >>> eyes.
> > > > > > > >>>> Then I stopped at the table. I opened my eyes. Yes, I can
> > > accept
> > > > > > > >>> blindness.
> > > > > > > >>>> Maybe I was a bit childish, a little comical. But this is
> > the
> > > > > truth.
> > > > > > > Not
> > > > > > > >>>> books or
> > > > > > > >>>> word-of-mouth propaganda or my social condition brought me
> > > > where I
> > > > > > am.
> > > > > > > >>>> Anatolia brought me where I am. The Anatolia I had seen
> only
> > > on
> > > > > the
> > > > > > > >>>> surface, from the outside. My heart brought me where I am.
> > > > That’s
> > > > > > how
> > > > > > > >>> it is
> > > > > > > >>>> .
> > > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --
> > > > > > Robert Lake Ed.D.
> > > > > > Associate Professor
> > > > > > Social Foundations of Education
> > > > > > Dept. of Curriculum, Foundations, and Reading
> > > > > > Georgia Southern University
> > > > > > P. O. Box 8144, Statesboro, GA 30460
> > > > > > Co-editor of *Review of Education, Pedagogy, and Cultural
> Studies,*
> > > > > vol.39,
> > > > > > 2017
> > > > > > Special issue: Maxine Greene and the Pedagogy of Social
> > Imagination:
> > > An
> > > > > > Intellectual Genealogy.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > http://www.tandfonline.com/toc/gred20/39/1
> > > > > > Webpage: https://georgiasouthern.academia.edu/RobertLake*
> Democracy
> > > > must
> > > > > be
> > > > > > born anew in every generation, and education is its midwife.*
> John
> > > > > > Dewey-*Democracy
> > > > > > and Education*,1916, p. 139
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Beth Ferholt
> > > > Associate Professor
> > > > Department of Early Childhood and Art Education
> > > > Brooklyn College, City University of New York
> > > > 2900 Bedford Avenue
> > > > Brooklyn, NY 11210-2889
> > > >
> > > > Email: bferholt@brooklyn.cuny.edu
> > > > Phone: (718) 951-5205
> > > > Fax: (718) 951-4816
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Robert Lake Ed.D.
> > > Associate Professor
> > > Social Foundations of Education
> > > Dept. of Curriculum, Foundations, and Reading
> > > Georgia Southern University
> > > P. O. Box 8144, Statesboro, GA 30460
> > > Co-editor of *Review of Education, Pedagogy, and Cultural Studies,*
> > vol.39,
> > > 2017
> > > Special issue: Maxine Greene and the Pedagogy of Social Imagination: An
> > > Intellectual Genealogy.
> > >
> > > http://www.tandfonline.com/toc/gred20/39/1
> > > Webpage: https://georgiasouthern.academia.edu/RobertLake*Democracy
> must
> > be
> > > born anew in every generation, and education is its midwife.* John
> > > Dewey-*Democracy
> > > and Education*,1916, p. 139
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Beth Ferholt
> > Associate Professor
> > Department of Early Childhood and Art Education
> > Brooklyn College, City University of New York
> > 2900 Bedford Avenue
> > Brooklyn, NY 11210-2889
> >
> > Email: bferholt@brooklyn.cuny.edu
> > Phone: (718) 951-5205
> > Fax: (718) 951-4816
> >
>
--
Beth Ferholt
Associate Professor
Department of Early Childhood and Art Education
Brooklyn College, City University of New York
2900 Bedford Avenue
Brooklyn, NY 11210-2889
Email: bferholt@brooklyn.cuny.edu
Phone: (718) 951-5205
Fax: (718) 951-4816
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