[Xmca-l] Re: Playing with/at TED

[Tom Richardson]

Thank you, Lois, for finding time for this thoughtful reply to the threads
around your TED piece -a link to your 'What's developing is below:
http://vimeo.com/98797556
Tom


On 23 June 2014 16:01, Lois Holzman <lholzman@eastsideinstitute.org> wrote:

> Thanks to all who've watched the video and commented.
> Over the weekend I completed two weeks of PLAYING WITH a "small group" of
> psychologists/youth workers/educators from 5 countries who were in NYC for
> their final residency period with me and the Institute. I kept up with your
> posts but wasn't able to respond until now.
> I find the discussion fascinating in a few ways, which I will try to
> describe through commenting on what's been said/written.
>
> I greatly appreciated Tom's concern ("We need Play to evolve the next
> tranche of revolutionary strategy and
> > tactics, but Play alone will never arrive at the necessity for
> > revolutionary overthrow of capitalism") and further comment and
> subsequent expansion on this ("While I did not wish to attack or offend
> deliberately, I feel that the
> limitations of work within individual/small group relationships, no matter
> how creative, redemptive and transformative, cannot have that same effect
> upon the 500year-developed /developing reality which is modern bourgeois
> society. It is that sense of limitation which I attempted,
> > straightforwardly to convey").
>
> > Tom, I in no way felt attacked or offended.
>
> > I found Shirley and Helen's and Carol's versions of what I was doing in
> the talk and what the activities I presented might be "about" very helpful
> and appreciated learning what they saw.  I was indeed trying to present
> something new to the audience, something that gave them the feeling that
> there was more "behind it" and that something was pretty unorthodox.
>
> > I suppose the key thing I can say in response is that I was speaking
> about play in a very particular way, as revolutionary. I was really pleased
> that the audience for the live presentation picked up on that and was
> excited by this new way of seeing. What I think revolutionary play is (in
> my talk I repeated what I mean by that several times—taking what there is
> and making something new, doing what we do not know how to do, relating as
> who we are/other than who we are at the same time) is a cultural-historical
> activity that creates development, and that all of us human beings need to
> develop if we are to have a shot at overthrowing capitalism. (For "theory"
> the most concise expansion of this might be All Power to the Developing.The
> position put forth in that article has generated lively dialogue, as it is
> not the most popular among Marxists.)
>
> > As I read some of the comments on my talk, it seems to me that how I
> understand play as revolutionary was not taken into account fully. By that
> I mean it seems like one's own understanding of play was substituted
> unaware. Perhaps this has something to do with Hue seeing play as
> "overdone" as well as David's commenting:
> >  "One of the problems of Lois's talk is that it doesn't give us a very
> clear
> view of what play is not. But I would say that street kids talking to
> policemen about their fear of being gunned down in the street is a pretty
> good place to start. Lois herself recognizes in her talk that the
> conversations are not part of
> the play. But then we need to look at when and where the activity stopped
> being play, and above all why. Otherwise we rob "play" of all of its
> content."
>
> Sorry, David, if I was less than clear here. For me, the conversation was
> part of the play. The activity never stopped being play, as I understand
> it. The cops and kids were playing, in my sense of revolutionary play, as
> they were creating a conversation they had never had and perhaps could not
> were they not playing/performing...they were doing what was beyond them and
> creating something new together. I imagine you and others may not see it
> that way, but that's what I see.
>
> David's comments also highlight for me an aspect of perhaps different ways
> of approaching what it means to engage in the activity of understanding. As
> I read you, you need me to say what play is not and you also need me to
> pinpoint the beginnings and endings of something identified as play. It's
> that "is" that for me is the problematic term—it reads to me as pictorial
> and essentializing in reference to meaning. Apologies if I have
> misunderstood you. And while I don't mind playing being simultaneously the
> "leading activity" and the constant activity, I'm inspired by Vygotsky, not
> overdetermined by him.
>
> I'm very sensitive to how we speak/write to each other, however,
> especially when difference of opinion gets in the way or replaces curiosity
> to learn more about how come someone thinks/believes what they apparently
> do. And so I wish that we would be asking more questions of each other...
> and perhaps saying things in less absolutist and knowing terms.
>
> David (again) wrote:
> PS: Obviously, the teacher who claimed that their generation in China (my
> wife's generation) did not play after the age of two was just playing
> around with poor Lois. But that's no reason to play along...
>
> I "obviously" (and here it makes sense to use that word) cannot know your
> intention in writing what and how you wrote the above, as we cannot know
> each other's intentions. So I'll jump off from what you say and maybe help
> you see what I was trying to convey—75 teachers (not 1) told us in
> different ways/phrases that they hadn't played since they were very little
> children. They weren't making any claims, neither for themselves as
> individuals and certainly not for their generation. They were talking with
> us and sharing their experiences. I assume your wife has done the same with
> you, and that would be interesting to learn about.
>
> I'm off tonight to work in Frankfurt for the week, but if there is further
> conversation I will respond quickly.
>
> If any of you are interested in pursuing the topic of play and performance
> in our current context of capitalism's crisis, from my community's
> perspective, you can view an event, What Developing in a World in Crisis
>  which begins with 9 people from 8 countries speaking to how they see the
> development challenges in their countries, followed by a conversation
> between me and a colleague, and then the audience.
>
> Again, thanks for including me, TED, play in your discussions,
> Lois
>
>
>
>
> Lois Holzman
> Director, East Side Institute for Group & Short Term Psychotherapy
> 104-106 South Oxford Street
> Brooklyn, New York 11217
> Chair, Global Outreach, All Stars Project, UX
> Tel. +1.212.941.8906 x324
> Fax +1.718.797.3966
> lholzman@eastsideinstitute.org
> Social Media
> Facebook | LinkedIn | Twitter
> Blogs
> Psychology Today| Psychology of Becoming | ESI Community News
> Websites
> Lois Holzman | East Side Institute | Performing the World
> All Stars Project
>
>
>
> On Jun 22, 2014, at 1:31 AM, mike cole <lchcmike@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > I wonder what Lois thinks about all of this discussion that Peter
> started?
> > Mike
> >
> > On Friday, June 20, 2014, David Kellogg <dkellogg60@gmail.com> wrote:
> > I agree completely with Tom's remarks. I remember that almost every
> summer
> > in Chicago between five and ten black children in the city would be
> > murdered by police for playing with toy guns. Consider this:
> >
> >
> http://www.mintpressnews.com/us-police-murdered-5000-innocent-civilians-since-911/172029/
> >
> > To link this to the previous thread--I don't think that the article "What
> > Theory is Not" has a workable definition of theory, and for that reason I
> > found it little more than a list of complaints. But part of the
> dialectical
> > method is defining what things are by looking at what things are
> > not: transgressing that boundary is precisely what we mean when we say
> that
> > something is in the process of becoming what it is not.
> >
> > One of the problems of Lois's talk is that it doesn't give us a very
> clear
> > view of what play is not. But I would say that street kids talking to
> > policemen about their fear of being gunned down in the street is a pretty
> > good place to start.
> >
> > Lois herself recognizes in her talk that the conversations are not part
> of
> > the play. But then we need to look at when and where the activity stopped
> > being play, and above all why. Otherwise we rob "play" of all of its
> > content.
> >
> > I think the same thing is true when we say that children play constantly,
> > from the moment they wake up to the moment they go to bed (and Vygotsky,
> of
> > course, says the opposite--play is a "leading" activity but for that very
> > reason we cannot say it is the main activity).
> >
> > David Kellogg
> > Hankuk University of Foreign Studies
> >
> > PS: Obviously, the teacher who claimed that their generation in China (my
> > wife's generation) did not play after the age of two was just playing
> > around with poor Lois. But that's no reason to play along...
> >
> > dk
> >
> >
> > On 20 June 2014 06:03, Tom Richardson <tom.richardson3@googlemail.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > A fascinating and moving 14+minutes of Lois ....only how I wish that I
> did
> > > not subscribe to a class analysis which means that the last example of
> the
> > > 'kids of colour' and the NYPD is called into deep question - will the
> > > lethal divides of capitalism's "special bodies of armed men" from
> > > working-class citizens, (and of course it extends to imperialism's
> > > destruction of whole countries), be 'overcome' by Play. Lois'
> commitment
> > > and passionate intelligence almost lets me believe it might, but I know
> > > that I'm fooling myself.
> > > We need Play to evolve the next tranche of revolutionary strategy and
> > > tactics, but Play alone will never arrive at the necessity for
> > > revolutionary overthrow of capitalism, only, from Lois' examples,
> > > ultimately futile attempts at transcending class conflict,
> > >
> > > Tom Richardson
> > > Middlesbrough
> > > UK
> > >
> > >
> > > On 19 June 2014 20:57, Carol Macdonald <carolmacdon@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > > Well Lois
> > > >
> > > > That was splendid, awesome! All you serious XMCAers please watch.
> > > >
> > > > Carol
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On 19 June 2014 13:48, Lois Holzman <lholzman@eastsideinstitute.org>
> > > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Here's the link, Carol.
> > > > > http://tedxnavesink.com/project/lois-holzman/
> > > > >
> > > > > Lois Holzman
> > > > > Director, East Side Institute for Group & Short Term Psychotherapy
> > > > > 104-106 South Oxford Street
> > > > > Brooklyn, New York 11217
> > > > > Chair, Global Outreach, All Stars Project, UX
> > > > > Tel. +1.212.941.8906 x324
> > > > > Fax +1.718.797.3966
> > > > > lholzman@eastsideinstitute.org
> > > > > Social Media
> > > > > Facebook | LinkedIn | Twitter
> > > > > Blogs
> > > > > Psychology Today| Psychology of Becoming | ESI Community News
> > > > > Websites
> > > > > Lois Holzman | East Side Institute | Performing the World
> > > > > All Stars Project
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > On Jun 19, 2014, at 3:02 AM, Carol Macdonald <
> carolmacdon@gmail.com>
> > > > > wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > Louis
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Please could you send the link again?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Thanks
> > > > > > Carol
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > On 19 June 2014 01:03, Lois Holzman <
> lholzman@eastsideinstitute.org>
> > > > > wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > >> Hi All,
> > > > > >> Peter kindly posted a link to a talk I gave last month at a TEDx
> > > > > >> event--TEDxNavesink Play.
> > > > > >> Aside from the prep being among the hardest things I've ever
> done
> > > > > (staying
> > > > > >> within their rules and structure, not being academic but saying
> > > > > something
> > > > > >> new for people to think about, and more), it was a delight to be
> > > with
> > > > > folks
> > > > > >> who appreciate and value play--many of whom are affording
> people in
> > > > > their
> > > > > >> communities with the opportunity to play in all kinds of ways.
> It
> > > was
> > > > > >> really growthful for me and my team. I was really pleased to
> > > reconnect
> > > > > with
> > > > > >> Peter Gray after many years and to meet other good people. The
> > > one-day
> > > > > >> event was organized are 4 P's--possibility, pleasure, progress
> and
> > > > > paradox.
> > > > > >> I invite you all to include these talks within your conversation
> > > > > here--even
> > > > > >> though they're not theoretical. Maybe it's a new kind of play
> for
> > > > many.
> > > > > >> Lois
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> Lois Holzman
> > > > > >> Director, East Side Institute for Group & Short Term
> Psychotherapy
> > > > > >> 104-106 South Oxford Street
> > > > > >> Brooklyn, New York 11217
> > > > > >> Chair, Global Outreach, All Stars Project, UX
> > > > > >> Tel. +1.212.941.8906 x324
> > > > > >> Fax +1.718.797.3966
> > > > > >> lholzman@eastsideinstitute.org
> > > > > >> Social Media
> > > > > >> Facebook | LinkedIn | Twitter
> > > > > >> Blogs
> > > > > >> Psychology Today| Psychology of Becoming | ESI Community News
> > > > > >> Websites
> > > > > >> Lois Holzman | East Side Institute | Performing the World
> > > > > >> All Stars Project
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --
> > > > > > Carol A  Macdonald Ph D (Edin)
> > > > > > Developmental psycholinguist
> > > > > > Academic, Researcher,  and Editor
> > > > > > Honorary Research Fellow: Department of Linguistics, Unisa
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Carol A  Macdonald Ph D (Edin)
> > > > Developmental psycholinguist
> > > > Academic, Researcher,  and Editor
> > > > Honorary Research Fellow: Department of Linguistics, Unisa
> > > >
> > >
>
>