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Re: [xmca] Victor Wooten: Music as a Language
Joseph,
I don't *know* much but I *believe *that you are wrong.
I wish you all the best as you continue to develop your thinking.
Keep on singing...
Cheers!
:-)
greg
On Wed, Aug 22, 2012 at 4:54 PM, Joseph Gilbert <joeg4us@roadrunner.com>wrote:
> I put the word, know, in parentheses to indicate that we don't know
> objectively, in an absolute way, but, in a subjective way. We experience
> "absolute" feelings. The sounds of words create feelings within our
> emotional bodies, while what we call our objective knowledge is never
> complete or provable. Feelings are accepted as givens, as uncontested
> facts. It is a fact that we have feelings: what they mean is open to
> debate. But while the endless debate goes on, we continue to have our
> feelings about whatever we have words with which to refer. Our only
> reliable, consensus sense of "knowing" results from the emotional-feeling
> effects upon us of the sounds of our spoken words. The feelings are facts,
> and universal: the search for objective meaning - whatever that is - is
> ongoing and subject to controversy. So the feelings from the sounds rule by
> default in the job of informing us of the meaning of things. We make
> decisions not based on absolute objective knowledge, but rather on what
> seems to work. Does what seems to work really work? Is our way of life
> sustainable? Is our sense of what seems to work dependent upon how we are
> affected by the sounds of our words? Remember, all we really have to go on
> to grasp the meaning of things is our feelings about them. The more we know
> about things, the more words we have to bring to bear on decisions
> involving them. The more words we have to bring to bear, the more feelings
> we have to consider. Those with larger vocabularies have more complex
> analytical capabilities.
>
> Joseph Gilbert
>
>
> On Aug 22, 2012, at 1:58 PM, Greg Thompson wrote:
>
> Joseph,
>> music can't be the only way that we "know" what words mean - otherwise
>> this
>> email would be completely incomprehensible and Chomsky would have been out
>> of a job long ago!
>>
>> But you do point to a very important aspect of language that linguistic
>> anthropologists refer to as "indexicality", and which most Enlightenment
>> thinkers (following Kant, e.g., Chomsky) see as largely irrelevant to the
>> meaning of language (what we might say is the polar opposite of your
>> position, Joseph). So you present an important corrective. We should be
>> cautious, though, how far in the other direction we let the pendulum
>> swing...
>>
>> sometimes behave so strangely
>> sometimes behave so strangely
>> sometimes behave so strangely
>> [I can still hear the music...]
>>
>> -greg
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Aug 22, 2012 at 9:42 AM, Joseph Gilbert <joeg4us@roadrunner.com
>> >wrote:
>>
>> The sound aspect of words is perceived as we perceive music. That is how
>>> we "know" what it means. Music is the universal language. The sounds of
>>> our
>>> words is the universal language. We are moved, literally, by the sounds
>>> of
>>> our voices. The sounds of all our vowels and consonants relate to
>>> emotions.
>>> Our world-view, shared by others within our language group, is
>>> established
>>> by our experience of this emotional affect of our spoken words coupled
>>> with
>>> their referential function. When we verbalize, we feel the sounds while
>>> thinking of the things. Therefore we associate the feelings of the sounds
>>> of our words with the things to which we refer with them. Of course, the
>>> feelings are associated with the sounds of the words, not directly with
>>> the
>>> things. If we did not associate the sounds with the things, we would not
>>> have a clue as to the meaning of our world. This misassociation creates
>>> our
>>> only consensus information as to the meaning of our world. We ORDer our
>>> world with our wORD.
>>>
>>> Joseph Gilbert
>>>
>>> On Aug 21, 2012, at 8:30 PM, Greg Thompson wrote:
>>>
>>> and I just remembered where I first heard this - on Radio Lab. Here is
>>>>
>>> the
>>>
>>>> show, listen while you work...
>>>>
>>>> http://www.radiolab.org/2007/**sep/24/behaves-so-strangely/<http://www.radiolab.org/2007/sep/24/behaves-so-strangely/>
>>>>
>>>> -greg
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, Aug 21, 2012 at 9:13 PM, Greg Thompson <
>>>>
>>> greg.a.thompson@gmail.com>**wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Here is the psychologist's version of speech to song:
>>>>> http://philomel.com/asa156th/**mp3/Sound_Demo_1.mp3<http://philomel.com/asa156th/mp3/Sound_Demo_1.mp3>
>>>>>
>>>>> for more, check out:
>>>>> http://deutsch.ucsd.edu/**psychology/pages.php?i=212<http://deutsch.ucsd.edu/psychology/pages.php?i=212>
>>>>>
>>>>> Be sure to listen through all of the demos (the first one is the
>>>>> longest
>>>>> one), and listen to them in order.
>>>>>
>>>>> Enjoy...
>>>>>
>>>>> EVERYBODY SING:
>>>>>
>>>>> sometimes behave so strangely
>>>>> sometimes behave so strangely
>>>>> sometimes behave so strangely
>>>>> sometimes behave so strangely
>>>>> sometimes behave so strangely
>>>>> sometimes behave so strangely
>>>>> sometimes behave so strangely
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, Aug 21, 2012 at 7:48 PM, Anton Yasnitsky <the_yasya@yahoo.com
>>>>>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Futhermore, language as music --
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?**v=hBFZsm-dnBs<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hBFZsm-dnBs>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> :)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ______________________________**__
>>>>>> From: Peter Smagorinsky <smago@uga.edu>
>>>>>> To: "eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity" <xmca@weber.ucsd.edu>;
>>>>>> "LLED7408-2012@listserv. uga. edu (LLED7408-2012@listserv.uga.**edu<LLED7408-2012@listserv.uga.edu>)"
>>>>>> <
>>>>>> LLED7408-2012@listserv.uga.edu**>; "dave.smags@live.com" <
>>>>>> dave.smags@live.com>; Jane Farrell <jefarrell@mac.com>; "
>>>>>> star_karashii@hotmail.com" <star_karashii@hotmail.com>; Anne
>>>>>>
>>>>> Smagorinsky
>>>
>>>> <annesmagorinsky@me.com>
>>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2012 6:27:18 PM
>>>>>> Subject: [xmca] Victor Wooten: Music as a Language
>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://ed.ted.com/lessons/**victor-wooten-music-as-a-**language<http://ed.ted.com/lessons/victor-wooten-music-as-a-language>
>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Gregory A. Thompson, Ph.D.
>>>>> Sanford I. Berman Post-Doctoral Scholar
>>>>> Laboratory of Comparative Human Cognition
>>>>> Department of Communication
>>>>> University of California, San Diego
>>>>> http://ucsd.academia.edu/**GregoryThompson<http://ucsd.academia.edu/GregoryThompson>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Gregory A. Thompson, Ph.D.
>>>> Sanford I. Berman Post-Doctoral Scholar
>>>> Laboratory of Comparative Human Cognition
>>>> Department of Communication
>>>> University of California, San Diego
>>>> http://ucsd.academia.edu/**GregoryThompson<http://ucsd.academia.edu/GregoryThompson>
>>>> ______________________________**____________
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>>
>>
>> --
>> Gregory A. Thompson, Ph.D.
>> Sanford I. Berman Post-Doctoral Scholar
>> Laboratory of Comparative Human Cognition
>> Department of Communication
>> University of California, San Diego
>> http://ucsd.academia.edu/**GregoryThompson<http://ucsd.academia.edu/GregoryThompson>
>> ______________________________**____________
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>
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>
--
Gregory A. Thompson, Ph.D.
Sanford I. Berman Post-Doctoral Scholar
Laboratory of Comparative Human Cognition
Department of Communication
University of California, San Diego
http://ucsd.academia.edu/GregoryThompson
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