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Re: [xmca] (ism) v (ist) and cherries



I suppose there's a distinction to be made between the types of synthesis we're talking about. I work on a research project that takes a situative approach to assessment, but we're lately drawing from Dan Schwartz's work on Preparation for Future Learning. Though PFL did not emerge out of situative theories of learning, the notion can be remediated for situative purposes.
What becomes problematic is when we use "synthesis" to talk about  
what's really cherrypicking. I agree with others that the issue is  
aligned with questions of epistemology and ontology, and things get  
muddled when people haven't clearly articulated the theories of  
knowing and learning that guide their approach. If you take a  
stridently situative approach to cognition, for example, then you'll  
have a lot of splainin to do if, for example, you start trying to  
integrate notions of cognitive load or mental models into your theory  
of learning.




~~

Jenna McWilliams
Learning Sciences Program, Indiana University
~
http://jennamcwilliams.blogspot.com
http://remediatingassessment.blogspot.com
~
jenmcwil@indiana.edu
jennamcjenna@gmail.com




On Apr 8, 2010, at 12:23 PM, Rafi Santo wrote:

I've been enjoying this conversation so much that I've decided to emerge from behind my usual lurker stance. (First time poster, long time reader, all that.)
It sounds like these two issues, cherry-picking theories (or, framed  
more positively, synthesizing or remixing theories) and cherry  
picking data actually have a pretty dynamic relationship.  From what  
you're saying Jay, it would follow that perhaps in order to  
effectively synthesize learning theories and/or developmental  
paradigms, in the beginning stages one might cherry-pick data in  
order to support that emerging hypothesis before it gets quashed.  
These two types of cherry-picking are distinct, but have an  
important relationship between them for those that see it as  
possible to synthesize theories, a group that I count myself as part  
of.  At the same time, this very relationship might feed the  
narratives (and, of course, valid arguments) that opponents to  
synthesis make about the lack of methodological rigor that synthesis  
work can be characterized by.
Rafi

__

Rafi Santo
Senior Program Associate
Online Leadership Program
Global Kids
http://www.globalkids.org/?id=5
http://olpglobalkids.org

At 9:37 PM -0700 4/7/10, Jay Lemke wrote:
I truncated and added the cherries to make a comment on the "cherry- picking" debate that Jenna's blog (link below) pivoted into the conversation here.
There it seems to be about the reputed evils of mixing theories (of  
learning and/or development). But I took the lesson concerning  
cherry-picking from Fred Erickson, for whom it was, much more  
persuasively, about the dangers of selectively picking just those  
items of data or evidence that support a particular position.
I think that cherry-picking (the metaphor means picking just the  
sweet, ripe cherries from the tree and leaving the unripe sour  
ones) items of evidence to support a hypothesis or a theory is OK  
when the theory is very new and needs some benefit of the doubt so  
it can be developed and elaborated into something worth more  
carefully evaluating. Rather than just trying to kill it off in the  
cradle.
Once it's old enough to fend for itself, then it's dangerous to its  
future well-being to feed it only ripe cherries and not see how it  
copes, or doesn't, with sour cherries that are inevitably also to  
be found. Cherry-picking evidence is what happens with cults,  
religions, conspiracy theories, political fanaticisms, and other  
things that scholarly inquiry tries to avoid becoming. I have a  
religious faith that eating occasional sour cherries is good for  
the healthy development of useful and interesting new theories and  
practices. What doesn't kill us makes us stronger!
But this view of cherry-picking does NOT apply in the same sense to  
concepts, ideas, methods, discourse thematics, representations, and  
the like. They are the only stuff around from which to build new  
theories and practices, and it makes sense to explore any possible  
combination of them that might be helpful. While philosophers may  
shudder, I simply don't believe any two ideas are inherently and  
necessarily incompatible with one another, or that philosophical  
purism or canons of "consistency" are really of much use, much less  
intellectual necessities. This stance is generally associated with  
postmodernism, but need not be. I think it's better associated with  
a high tolerance for ambiguity and uncertainty in the theory- 
creation process. And some philosophers certainly seem to agree  
(e.g. Feyerabend, Latour, Serres).
Of course I also don't believe that theories ever do, or ever can,  
definitively (much less uniquely) explain phenomena. They are just  
tools for getting on with the inquiry, or provisionally guiding  
practice, until something else comes along.
JAY.


Jay Lemke
Professor (Adjunct, 2009-2010)
Educational Studies
University of Michigan
Ann Arbor, MI 48109
www.umich.edu/~jaylemke

Visiting Scholar
Laboratory for Comparative Human Cognition
University of California -- San Diego
La Jolla, CA
USA 92093







On Apr 7, 2010, at 3:38 PM, Jenna McWilliams wrote:

I don't know! That's why I've pitched this issue to you guys.

I recently sat on the sidelines watching a pair of academics argue over whether cultural-historical learning theories are as theoretically rigorous as cognitivist theories. As you might imagine, the cognitivist argued they aren't as rigorous, while the situative theorist argued they were. I wonder if you xmca-ers have thoughts on this.





~~

Jenna McWilliams
Learning Sciences Program, Indiana University
~
http://jennamcwilliams.blogspot.com
http://remediatingassessment.blogspot.com
~
jenmcwil@indiana.edu
jennamcjenna@gmail.com




On Apr 7, 2010, at 3:50 PM, mike cole wrote:

Jenna-- No wonder you are so quiet on XMCA-- you are busy in another
interesting discussion, differently mediated!

So, vis a vis the local conversation, how do constructivism or
constructionism
relate to cultural-historical theories?
mike

On Wed, Apr 7, 2010 at 10:12 AM, Jenna McWilliams <jenmcwil@umail.iu.edu >wrote:
Hello,
I'm really enjoying this conversation, as it aligns really nicely with issues I'm grappling with both in my graduate work and in my research
projects and groups.

Though I'm a shameless self-promoter, I normally wouldn't plug my blog in such an esteemed listserv--except that I recently published a post about the (ir)reconcilability of sociocultural and cognitivist learning theories (at http://jennamcwilliams.blogspot.com/2010/04/why-i-am-not-constructionist.html , if you want to see). It's the conversation below the post that interests me now--a fun debate has started about whether pulling from sociocultural and cognitivist theories can be called "synthesis" or "cherrypicking." I fall on
the "cherrypicking" side of things, though I can acknowledge how
rhetorically poor that term is.

I was going to post some of this thread in the comments section before I started worrying about the appropriateness of doing that, so instead I'll
just set forth a plea to anyone who's interested to join in on the
conversation. My readers and I would be most grateful for any thoughts you
are willing to offer.

Thanks for this listserv, which is supporting my knowledge acquisition and
enabling me to participate in knowledge production.

jenna



~~

Jenna McWilliams
Learning Sciences Program, Indiana University
~
http://jennamcwilliams.blogspot.com
http://remediatingassessment.blogspot.com
~
jenmcwil@indiana.edu
jennamcjenna@gmail.com


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