Re: [xmca] Vygotsky, Luria and Eisenshtein (links to chain)

It would be great to get the info on Eisenshtein and LSV/ARL. The
entire Stanislavsy and beyond discussion is quite broad. Yrjo has
written on this topic.
mike

On 10/31/08, Mike Cole <lchcmike@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 10/31/08, Achilles Delari Junior <achilles_delari@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> To add more two or three links to a chain-complex
>>
>> 1) About Luria and Eisenshtein: "Eisenstein planned two courses on the
>> psychology of art at Luria's request, in 1940 and 1947 (both in Leyda
>> (ed.)
>> "The Psychology of Composition")." (Christie & Taylor, 1993, p. 225 -
>> Endnote 87); I ask for an used edition at amazon, seems to be fine.
>> "Psychology of Composition" sounds like an interesting title and subject
>> to
>> me, composing evoques spinozian concept of "joy".
>>
>> 2) About Eisenshtein and Stanislavsky similarity: there is a very
>> interesting note by Nikolai Veresov commenting Vygotsky's "genetic law of
>> cultural development" explaining something about what they means by
>> "Category":
>>
>> "Category is the philosophical concept. How can one imagine that the
>> function exists as a category? Sounds strange, but according to
>> STANISLAVSKY
>> (famous theatre director Vygotsky used to know) AND Sergey EISENSHTEIN
>> (filmmaker and a friend of Vygotsky) "category" in the drama means
>> "collision", "event", dramatic unit, and the unit of analysis of drama:
>> it
>> might be a dialogue (mostly) or emotional explosion and so on. Vygotsky
>> is
>> speaking about development as a process of events, collisions and their
>> reflections in both planes." (N. VERESOV) (Caps mine)
>>
>> Available at http://webpages.charter.net/schmolze1/vygotsky/vygotsky.html
>> I don´t know the actual source yet - If there is a book or paper by
>> Verosov
>> about these matters. I will check.
>>
>> 3) About Eisenshtein and Stanislavsky differences: Eisenshtein seemed to
>> be
>> closer to Meyerhold than to Stanislavsky, the pome of Eris was maybe
>> differences of emphasis in verbal or non-verbal components of the actor's
>> play... but this stands only like um more question, not a secure
>> information. Seems that there was, at that time, some kind of fight
>> against
>> "verbalization" in theatre, in which Meyerhold was activily envolved, but
>> the actual role of Eisenshtein in that dispute is nothing clear to me.
>> Eisenstein movies seems to operate with some kind of "pictograms", but
>> nothing to affirm about absolutily dispense "words", even like "inner
>> speach" - must be something about this in his own writings, quoting
>> Vygotsky, I guess that I remember something like this in a work of a
>> filmmaker friend of mine, some talks with her. But it was a long time
>> ago,
>> too. I remain in my thinking by complex, you know.
>>
>> What do you think about these links? There are something useful?
>>
>> Thank you.
>> Achilles.
>>
>>
>>> From: achilles_delari@hotmail.com
>>> To: xmca@weber.ucsd.edu
>>> Subject: RE: [xmca] Vygotsky, Luria and Eisenshtein (a question)
>>> Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2008 01:02:11 +0000
>>>
>>>
>>> Oh, it's great, Mike...
>>>
>>> Borges wrote a tale named "Funes..." recreating something of
>>> Shereshevsky... you know. So
>>> seems that there is very artistic features in real human psychic
>>> experience. About "generalized
>>> image" I will see... Is this concept at "Iazik i soznanie"? We have a
>>> Portuguese version. I have
>>> read many years ago. I don't remember if I knew this concept , even in
>>> another book. It
>>> occurs to me, right now, to search immediately something about what
>>> system
>>> of acting was
>>> used by Eisenstein's actors, if we can find any relation with
>>> Stanislavsky's system of creative
>>> actor's work... studied by Vygotsky discussed in the text from 1932
>>> (publish in Collected Woks,
>>> vol. 6 - prologue by Dot Robbins), and so important in 1934 (thought and
>>> word) with the
>>> notion of "subtext"... If you tell us about psychological studies about
>>> audience, and the feelings
>>> and understanding of audience, the way that film is constructed and
>>> actor
>>> plays their roles
>>> must be interesting to study too. After all, all we must to act... (as
>>> "akt", and as "postuk").
>>> I had think about the other way of mutual influences in dialog
>>> psychology-movie too: what we
>>> can learn from movie semiotics? And/or what about Eisenstein can teach
>>> something to historical-
>>> cultural approach? For instance, the notion of "non-indifferent
>>> nature"...
>>> I'm thinking by complex,
>>> like ever I do. But now, it's the only way I can think. And these are
>>> all
>>> links that I can put in the
>>> chain until now. And we even need a thesis and the young guy/girl with
>>> it
>>> in mind - I hope this
>>> person can will arise soon in this context...
>>>
>>> I will see something about Eisenshtein and Stanislavsky, right now.
>>> What do you think? It can be useful?
>>>
>>> Thank very much, for all your contributions since before, since many
>>> years
>>> ago.
>>>
>>> Achilles.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> > Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2008 16:10:46 -0700
>>> > From: lchcmike@gmail.com
>>> > To: xmca@weber.ucsd.edu
>>> > Subject: Re: [xmca] Vygotsky, Luria and Eisenshtein (a question)
>>> >
>>> > Excellent question. Lets see what we can find out.
>>> > There are references in Eisenshtein's published work about his
>>> > activities
>>> > with
>>> > Shereshevsky, the mnemonist. And there is, I believe, a close relation
>>> > between the idea of "generalized image" in Luria and Eisenshtein's
>>> > notion of
>>> > montage.
>>> >
>>> > All we need is a bright young person with a thesis in mind and a ghost
>>> > of
>>> > chance
>>> > of getting it done in this context.
>>> > mike
>>> >
>>> > On Thu, Oct 30, 2008 at 3:35 PM, Achilles Delari Junior <
>>> > achilles_delari@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>> >
>>> > >
>>> > > Greetings for all.
>>> > >
>>> > > One more extemporaneous question.
>>> > >
>>> > > If I'm not misremembering, in "Making mind", Mike Cole exposes some
>>> > > very
>>> > > interesting data about Luria and Vygotsky's works with the audience
>>> > > of
>>> > > Eisenshtein's movies, didn't he expose? Puzirey, I remember well,
>>> > > has
>>> > > said
>>> > > something about Eisenshtein's reading of "Psychology of Art", in the
>>> > > files
>>> > > of Eisenshtein's personal library was founded an exemplar of the
>>> > > book,
>>> > > in
>>> > > which at several places are underlined the words "contend and
>>> > > form"...
>>> > > a
>>> > > basis for his own work has filmmaker. But, what more we can know
>>> > > about
>>> > > those
>>> > > works with audience? Everything was loosed with War? Is there no
>>> > > follower or
>>> > > co-worker that have dedicate even a single book or paper about these
>>> > > researchs? I Have thinking about these questions since 1991-1994
>>> > > when
>>> > > I had
>>> > > read the fragments that I quote here, and only now I can ask for
>>> > > you.
>>> > > It's
>>> > > not my main subject now, but I'm concerning with it in a personal
>>> > > way,
>>> > > and
>>> > > why not to ask for? Somebody can give me some help?
>>> > >
>>> > > Thank you very much for your attention and help.
>>> > > Achilles.
>>> > >
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Received on Fri Oct 31 17:43:31 2008