RE: [xmca] Emotion at Work

Paul et al., a complete version of Huck Finn is available at
http://ww3.telerama.com/~joseph/finn/finntitl.html. p

-----Original Message-----
From: xmca-bounces@weber.ucsd.edu [mailto:xmca-bounces@weber.ucsd.edu] On
Behalf Of Paul Dillon
Sent: Sunday, August 05, 2007 8:49 PM
To: mcole@weber.ucsd.edu; eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity
Subject: Re: [xmca] Emotion at Work

mike,
   
  it would be interesting to look at Mark Twain's discussion of Huck's
emotions on the raft going down the Mississippi in relation to YE's use of
that example of learning by expansion in response to the contradictions.
   
  I don't have a copy of Hucklebery Finn around.
   
  Paul

Mike Cole <lchcmike@gmail.com> wrote:
  Hi Andy--

I am pretty sure you are not alone in reading the original text which is,
nice to say,
located at lchc.ucsd.edu and findable by googling the site.

XMCA discourse suffers from various shortcomings, one of them being the
fallible memories
and distractions for old timers and the fact that many have not read basic
texts and are running
on rumor. I suffer both these deficiencies often and one of them is in play
in my discussion of
michael roth's paper (I'll keep you guessing as to which one).

I will try to discuss positive emotions in a later message.
I share concerns about the term system being added to activity, but do it
myself , and worry
about it both when i do it and when i do not.

Leontiev/Engestrom I will leave to the more knowledgable among us for now,
but several including
YE have written on the topic.

In a rush to be a passably social husband for the evening.
mike

On 8/5/07, Andy Blunden wrote:
>
> Wow! That's a classic article, Mike. Somehow I've gone all these years
> without reading it. I don't think I was aware of how deeply Engstrom
> embedded conflict in his idea of "system of activity"; "contradiction
> between use-value and exchange value" can sound a little dry until you
> realise that this is just the conflict that Helena was referring to, viz.,
> class interests!
> This still leaves open a few questions for me:
>
> 1. Why does this seem "cold" especially when we see how conflict-ridden is
> Leontyev and Engstrom's original idea?
> 2. I can see how "systems of activity" arise objectively out of
> contradictions or relations in an existing system of activity, by a
> process
> of differentiation, but what is the criterion for claiming something to be
> a "system" of activity, rather than just an activity?
> 3. If we can trace the source of negative emotions connected to learning,
> in conflict, what is the place of positive emotions, or are emotions
> simply
> epiphenomena from the standpoint of learning?
>
> Andy
> At 11:01 AM 5/08/2007 -0700, you wrote:
> >As I think is true for everyone who has been following this thread, I
> found
> >helena's summaries and commentaries
> >extremely thought provoking. Whenever we dig deep into a topic, as in
> this
> >case, my overwhelming impulse is
> >to feel as if I have to go back to the beginning and rethink everything,
> and
> >then I panic because I will not have time
> >to do so, and then I start plotting to teach a class "from the beginning"
> >and then THAT becomes too complicated
> >to arrange, and then I start looking for shortcuts.
> >
> >In what follows I am not following the emotion line of discussion
> although I
> >believe, along with others here as I interpreted
> >them, that we all believe emotion to be deeply implicated in
> >learning/work/earning a living/....... My only thought is that
> >I want to remember moments of positive emotion, as illustrated in the
> >article and many places, and not restrict emotion
> >to the consequences of conflict. I don't thinks michael r does this, but
> in
> >a couple of the posts, the times of intense
> >positive emotion experienced might get submerged.
> >
> >Rather, I think as I read through some dozen+ messages that the terms
> >"activity" and "activity system" are floating around
> >in ways that leave me confused, at times, to whether and when people are
> >agreeomg, elaborating, or talking about different
> >things.
> >
> >I started stumbling over the "making a living" "vs" "commercial fishery
> >production" as different activity systems. There seems
> >to me to be something incommensurate, in time scale, in what we could
> mean
> >by "motive", "need" or "object" these vastly
> >different enterprises. The relations can't, it seems to me, be seen as
> >activity 1<-->activity2 etc, but perhaps, I was thinking
> >in terms of embedding, where "fish farming" is one of many historically
> >accumulated ensemble of activities that, as an ensemble,
> >constitute "making a living" for the social group or the socium in
> general.
> >
> >Following this line of thought, I was led backward in my thinking to
> Yrjo's
> >philosophical anthropology of the evolution from animal
> >to human activity, where human activity is vastly more differentiated (in
> >his representation of it) than animal activity.
> >
> >I have no great insights to offer here. For those who have never done so,
> it
> >might be worthwhile looking at
> >
> >http://www.edu.helsinki.fi/activity/pages/chatanddwr/activitysystem/
> >
> >where this story is told in synoptic form and the issue of division of
> labor
> >and class come up as well.
> >
> >Thanks a lot for the stimulus to re-education, all.
> >mike
> >
> >On 8/5/07, Steve Gabosch wrote:
> > >
> > > Many aspects of the situation Wolff-Michael
> > > describes in the fish hatchery with Erin and Jack
> > > - layoffs, new management, new policies,
> > > initiative from workers ignored, solidarity among
> > > workers, negative attitudes, arguments with
> > > management, budget cuts, threats of job cuts -
> > > remind me of hundreds of similar situations I
> > > have experienced in the aircraft manufacturing
> > > plants I worked at for many years, and just
> > > retired from (yea!!). A complex work
> > > environment like a fish hatchery or a mega
> > > manufacturing company tends to exaggerate the
> > > dynamics and contradictions of everyday activity
> > > - the class conflicts in particular between
> > > people are more pronounced and expressed in more
> > > specific ways in a larger production oriented
> > > workplace than is typically found in a shopping
> > > mall, neighborhood, or even a school, where
> > > conflicting needs and motives between and within
> > > people are always there but tend to be more
> > > smoothed over and less obvious. As Helena
> > > indicates, in workplaces, especially if there is
> > > open activity supporting workers (organizing a
> > > union, getting a better contract, fighting for
> > > better working conditions, opposing
> > > discrimination), deeper social questions rise to
> > > the surface and can become explicit. And it most
> > > certainly is a world of many emotions, emotional
> > > payoffs, varying emotional payoffs, which is
> > > Wolff-Michael's most important point - emotions are very much at work
> at
> > > work.
> > >
> > > A way I try to make sense of the zillion
> > > conflicts between people that can be observed in
> > > a large factory or any work environment is to try
> > > to get a handle on what a person's concrete needs
> > > and motives are. There is usually much more
> > > going on than meets the eye. Sometimes, even the
> > > persons involved are not fully aware of (able to
> > > fully articulate verbally) the multiple needs and
> > > motives that are driving them and the people
> > > around them. Helena points to a very common
> > > conflict, between participating in production and
> > > earning a living - layoff situations. During a
> > > layoff, as with Erin, the relationship between
> > > these two activities becomes problematic. I have
> > > sure seen that many times! I have been through
> > > several waves of massive layoffs at Boeing, which
> > > tends to have a cyclical production cycle, and
> > > emotions certainly do run high on the job during
> > > these very difficult situations.
> > >
> > > Safety issues are another arena where
> > > "participating in production" can conflict with
> > > worker's self-interests. Although people are not
> > > necessarily fully conscious of it, these issues
> > > get resolved almost minute to minute in dynamic
> > > ways, sometimes resolved by choosing to get
> > > something fixed or changed, generating potential
> > > conflicts with supervision, sometimes resolved by
> > > working around or through the safety or health
> > > issue, perhaps just accepting the wear and tear
> > > on one's body and taking other little
> > > risks. These issues can hide beneath the surface
> > > for a while and then break out more dramatically
> > > when someone gets hurt or something otherwise
> > > goes wrong (and then the fingerpointing begins,
> > > where needs and motives may get openly
> > > debated). Helena alludes to this when she
> > > points out how safety questions, especially
> > > incidents and near misses, are really good ways
> > > to get people to talk about their jobs. Part of
> > > what makes these stories so interesting is the
> > > way they reveal conflicting needs and motives,
> > > between labor and management, between different
> > > workers with different tasks, between a worker and herself or himself.
> > >
> > > Another area of conflicting motives and needs I
> > > have seen over the years: during union activity
> > > that could result in a strike, solidarity can
> > > come into conflict with earning a living. Some
> > > contemplate crossing a picket line, a
> > > particularly dramatic example of dealing with
> > > conflicting motives in a work situation - and one
> > > with consequences that are likely to generate
> > > very tense emotional valences, sometimes for a long time after.
> > >
> > > - Steve
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > At 07:17 PM 8/4/2007 -0500, you wrote:
> > > >Andy --
> > > >
> > > >Almost. It's not the *key* fact about emotion.
> > > >However, when there is conflict between the
> > > >bottom line and the attempt to earn a living,
> > > >that conflict shapes the knowledge that people
> > > >bring to bear on resolving the conflict.
> > > >Sometimes there is no conflict. Either way, the
> > > >kind of knowledge that people develop in order
> > > >to survive and protect or improve their jobs is
> > > >emotionally charged, and that emotion can be
> > > >seen to have been shaped by the social relations of their work.
> > > >
> > > >Take symphony orchestra players -- for example,
> > > >the Milwaukee symphony. They organized a union
> > > >(based on the example of the Chicago symphony)
> > > >back in the 1970's or earlier. When they started
> > > >bargaining, the job of a symphony musician was a
> > > >terrible job. (To check out what a "bad" job for
> > > >performers is, take a look at the Washington DC
> > > >ballet.) Over the course of 30 years, the
> > > >Milwaukee job has become better and better. The
> > > >musicians have a considerable amount of power --
> > > >over the choice of program, the hiring of a
> > > >conductor, the hiring of new musicians, loans
> > > >for instruments, conditions while touring, etc.
> > > >Whether the city can afford the good working
> > > >conditions is another question. Negotiating an
> > > >incrementally better contract year after year
> > > >takes knowledge. That knowledge has an emotional
> > > >valence, positive valence -- to use Wolff-Michael's terms.
> > > >
> > > >At the other extreme, remember the Sago mine
> > > >tragedy? There was one survivor. While he was in
> > > >a coma, his wife was interviewed on television.
> > > >She described how she and her husband had talked
> > > >about how dangerous the mine was. The problem
> > > >was that if he left the mine, she'd have to go
> > > >to work, and there was no job she could get that
> > > >would pay enough to support them and cover
> > > >childcare. The actual level of danger, the
> > > >immediacy of the danger, was unknown to them,
> > > >although that information existed. This was a
> > > >mine that had been closed but reopened when the
> > > >price of gas rose and coal became economically
> > > >viable. It was a non-union mine. The calculation
> > > >that she and her husband made about his
> > > >likelihood of surviving his job was deeply
> > > >fatalistic. This is a case where someone knew he
> > > >was engaging in very dangerous work but just
> > > >went ahead and did it because he felt he had no other choice.
> > > >
> > > >People do work all the time that exposes them to
> > > >risks, and they know it, and sometimes they know
> > > >how to do something about it and sometimes they
> > > >just shrug their shoulders and say, "I can't do anything about it."
> > > >
> > > >This body of knowledge about how to survive a
> > > >job, and how to protect or improve it, is common
> > > >across all kinds of work. Symphony musicians can
> > > >talk to grocery clerks can talk to social
> > > >workers can talk to prison guards can talk to
> > > >teachers about what they know about it. The
> > > >emotions are all over the map, depending on
> > > >their job, but the knowledge is something they have in common.
> > > >
> > > >Helena Worthen
> > > >NEW EMAIL: hworthen@uiuc.edu
> > > >Chicago Labor Education Program
> > > >Suite 110 The Rice Building
> > > >815 West Van Buren Street
> > > >Chicago, IL 60607
> > > >312-996-8733
> > > >
> > > >-----Original Message-----
> > > >From: xmca-bounces@weber.ucsd.edu
> > > >[mailto:xmca-bounces@weber.ucsd.edu] On Behalf Of Andy Blunden
> > > >Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2007 1:39 AM
> > > >To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity
> > > >Subject: RE: [xmca] Emotion at Work
> > > >
> > > >That's fascinating Helena. I feel I've got to know you for the first
> > > time.
> > > >Thank you.
> > > >
> > > >Just to clarify: you are saying that conflict (interpreted as
> conflict
> > > >between activity systems, endowing actions with conflicted
> motivations,
> > > >significance, etc.) is *the key* fact about emotion. yes? Would you
> go
> > > any
> > > >further than this? Or is this too narrow?
> > > >
> > > >Andy
> > > >At 07:04 PM 3/08/2007 -0500, you wrote:
> > > > >Hello -- I'll try to respond to Wolff-Michael, Andy and Paul all
> > > together,
> > > > >since all three are picking up on my claim that two, not one
> activity
> > > > >systems are taking place in the fish hatchery where the employees
> that
> > > > >Wolf-Michael observed are working. I especially want to reply to
> Andy's
> > > > >question, "If someone were to deny that, say, earning and living
> and
> > > > >producing a product, were two different activity systems, how would
> you
> > > go
> > > > >about justifying that?"
> > > > >
> > > > >It has to do with what you're trying to do, what you need the
> theory to
> > > be
> > > > >able to show or explain.
> > > > >
> > > > >Wolff-Michael's discussion article is an effort to enrich and
> expand
> > > the
> > > > >theory itself, and I thank him for doing that. He is writing "as
> part
> > > of
> > > > >an effort to develop third-generation-historical activity theory,"
> and
> > > to
> > > > >incorporate emotion, motivation and identity into that theory. If
> you
> > > > >picture his audience, he's speaking to other researchers and the
> > > academic
> > > > >community generally. His data contributes to this effort.
> > > > >
> > > > >I'm dealing with a different problem. I'm trying to explain
> something
> > > that
> > > > >is going on in my classes. However, I can't do it without ALSO
> > > speaking
> > > > >to the same audience as Wolff-Michael and engaging with theory.
> This is
> > > > >because theory is an indispensable tool for successful practice.
> But
> > > I'm
> > > > >trying to answer the question, "How do we explain the intense
> emotion
> > > with
> > > > >which the learning produced at work is charged?"
> > > > >
> > > > >In my job as a labor educator for the University of Illinois, I
> teach
> > > > >people about work from the point of view of workers. This means
> > > everything
> > > > >from labor history, labor law, basics of representation and
> bargaining
> > > to
> > > > >job design, including safety. Just as in any teaching, I have to
> find
> > > out
> > > > >what my students, most of whom are working adults, already know in
> > > order
> > > > >to figure out how and what to teach them. This is axiomatic in
> teaching
> > > > >kids and undergraduates -- you build on prior knowledge, right? But
> > > when I
> > > > >start to investigate what my adult students know, I find it charged
> > > with
> > > > >strong -- sometimes extreme -- emotion. It has other
> characteristics as
> > > > >well, but the one that surfaces immediately in the classroom is
> this
> > > > >emotion. It can run the gamut from despair to pride to gratitude to
> > > > >bitterness. Whatever it is, that's what a teacher has to build on.
> For
> > > my
> > > > >practice as a teacher, I need theory that can account for this. As
> > > > >Wolff-Michael shows, this emotion is integral to the cognitive
> activity
> > > > >going on. The cognitive activity is not "cool," it's hot. Where
> does
> > > this
> > > > >emotion come from? Thus my investment in seeing CHAT developed to
> > > account
> > > > >for emotion.
> > > > >
> > > > >Sociocultural learning theory generally assumes that social context
> has
> > > a
> > > > >powerful, if not fully determinative impact on learning. The
> Engestrom
> > > > >model -- the famous triangle -- gives us a representation of what
> we
> > > mean
> > > > >by "social context." Andy, since you ask about "unit of analysis,"
> I'll
> > > > >respond by saying that I'm happy with the concept of "unit of
> analysis"
> > > > >and furthermore, I like Engestrom's model as an image of the unit
> of
> > > > >analysis of an activity system. It's a concise way to visualize all
> the
> > > > >things you have to think about when you ask, of a situation,
> "What's
> > > going
> > > > >on here?" or of a person or group of people, "What are they doing
> > > here?"
> > > > >The Engestrom model leads me to ask, "What's the nature of the
> division
> > > of
> > > > >labor that I'm looking at?" "Who is the community out of which
> these
> > > > >people have been selected?" "What are the history, the traditions,
> the
> > > > >customs, the rules of this activity?" "What are they using -- what
> > > > >material or cultural tools, what resources or equipment?" and most
> > > > >important, "Why are they doing what they're doing?"
> > > > >
> > > > >One of the things you can do with that model is talk about how it
> > > > >transforms and expands, moves via contradictions from one activity
> to
> > > > >another, is part of a network of activity systems or is nested in
> other
> > > > >activity systems (I'm looking at Engestrom 1987 Figure 2.11 and
> 2.12,
> > > > >here). All I've done is place one activity system opposite another
> > > > >activity system to represent that there is a conflict between the
> two
> > > > >activity systems. One is the activity system of production, the
> other
> > > is
> > > > >the activity system of earning a living.
> > > > >
> > > > >This is the image I propose to represent the difference between the
> > > kind
> > > > >of learning activity that workers engage in when learning how to do
> the
> > > > >work they are hired to do, as opposed to the kind of learning
> activity
> > > > >that workers engage in when they are learning how to survive at
> their
> > > job
> > > > >or how to protect or improve their working conditions. These two
> > > activity
> > > > >systems are driven by different motives. Sometimes there is no
> conflict
> > > > >between them but sometimes the conflict is extreme. Either way, we
> need
> > > to
> > > > >be able to theorize what's going on. Either way, the social
> > > relationships
> > > > >of those activity systems impact the learning activity and leave
> their
> > > > >mark on it. It seems reasonable to me that that is where the
> emotion
> > > comes
> > > > >from.
> > > > >
> > > > >Other major theories of learning do not have the potential to be
> > > developed
> > > > >in this direction. Some theories of learning are individual (Kolb).
> But
> > > > >even among theories that treat learning as a collective activity
> > > > >-- distributed cognition, legitimate peripheral participation,
> > > > >communities of practice, human capital theory -- we don't hear
> about
> > > > >conflict. Sometimes this doesn't matter. When we're talking about
> > > school
> > > > >learning or informal learning such as second language acquisition
> > > outside
> > > > >school, we may not need to be able to talk about the conflicting
> > > purposes
> > > > >of the site where the learning is being produced. But if we're
> talking
> > > > >about working adults (of whom there are a lot), we do need to be
> able
> > > to
> > > > >surface the reality that what people learn in order to meet the

=== message truncated ===

       
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Received on Mon Aug 6 02:59 PDT 2007