CoP certainly seems useful for the lads study in that it addresses identity development -- in the lads view they have become outsiders -- but the socio-economic/cultural-historical dimensions that lead this development of conciousness are not well laid out in the CoP framework, last I checked. What are boundaries of the community in other ways seem to need more definition. Still, as you point out Nancy, there is a lot of purchase in the notion of LPP. Is there anything recent about who determines what is "legitimate"?
-------------- Original message ----------------------
From: "Ares, Nancy (Warner)" <nancy.ares@rochester.edu>
> Lave and Wenger would call it legitimate peripheral participation, or
> engagement in practices that are increasingly central to the practices of a
> community...
>
> Nancy Ares
> Assistant Professor
> Teaching & Curriculum
> The Warner Graduate School of Education
> and Human Development
> University of Rochester
> P.O. Box 270425
> Rochester, NY 14627
> 585-273-5957
> fax 585-473-7598
>
> > ----------
> > From: xmca-bounces@weber.ucsd.edu on behalf of
> > xmca-whoever@comcast.net
> > Reply To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity
> > Sent: Monday, April 17, 2006 1:33 PM
> > To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity
> > Subject: RE: [xmca] "informants as lames"
> >
> > Yes, and we also face the limitations of the simple dichotomy of "inside"
> > and "outside", when there is at least a third possibility of being "on the
> > border".
> > In a more fuzzy way, can we consider degrees of being inside, and movement
> > toward the inside being complementary to appropriation? What would
> > movement toward the outside be called?
> >
> > -------------- Original message ----------------------
> > From: "Ares, Nancy (Warner)" <nancy.ares@rochester.edu>
> > > Whose purpose would we be referring to, the individuals, the sub-group
> > > (lads), the larger AT (the school), or society (for example)? From one
> > > perspective, the lads, I can see that they would consider themselves
> > > outsiders. From the school's perspective, I could see that they would be
> > > considered insiders who are troubled or troublemakers, but still inside.
> > > >From a societal perspective, I could see them as insiders of a
> > particular
> > > kind, but clearly involved and influential.
> > >
> > > The unit of analysis question emerges again...
> > >
> > > Nancy Ares
> > > Assistant Professor
> > > Teaching & Curriculum
> > > The Warner Graduate School of Education
> > > and Human Development
> > > University of Rochester
> > > P.O. Box 270425
> > > Rochester, NY 14627
> > > 585-273-5957
> > > fax 585-473-7598
> > >
> > > > ----------
> > > > From: xmca-bounces@weber.ucsd.edu on behalf of Worthen, Helena
> > > > Reply To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity
> > > > Sent: Monday, April 17, 2006 10:49 AM
> > > > To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity
> > > > Subject: Re: [xmca] "informants as lames"
> > > >
> > > > Hello --
> > > >
> > > > We could refer to purpose or consciousness here to distinguish between
> > > > who's in and who's out. If they're actively conspiring against school
> > > > culture they're still a part of it, shape it, participate in it -- but
> > to
> > > > the extent that they are participating in it with a different purpose
> > and
> > > > different consciousness, they are a separate activity system -- for
> > the
> > > > purposes of a study of boundaries, that would consistute a boundary --
> > > > right?
> > > >
> > > > Helena WOrthen
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Mon, April 17, 2006 9:00 am, bb wrote:
> > > > > All this begs the question of what it means to be inside and outside
> > the
> > > > > community, and conversely, what/where/when are the boundaries of the
> > > > > community. Who says who's in and who's out?
> > > > >
> > > > > Are the lads in Willis' study in or out of the school community?
> > They
> > > > > might
> > > > > say "out", but in actively conspiring against school culture, do
> > they
> > > > not
> > > > > participate in it, shape it, and therefore constitute part of it?
> > > > >
> > > > > Not intending to make trouble, it just comes naturally when I'm
> > puzzled.
> > > > >
> > > > > bb
> > > > >
> > > > > On Monday 17 April 2006 9:32 am, Andrew Jocuns wrote:
> > > > >> I think Paul Rabinow in his ethnography, Reflections
> > > > >> on Fieldwork in Morocco, mentions that the first
> > > > >> person to greet an anthropologist is often an outsider
> > > > >> in the community. I am not sure if was him or someone
> > > > >> else who wrote that anthropologists should stay away
> > > > >> from said person.
> > > > >>
> > > > >> andy
> > > > >>
> > > > >> --- Mike Cole <lchcmike@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > >> > I am looking for a reference to the problem of
> > > > >> > anthropological fieldwork
> > > > >> > that arises because people who are likely to
> > > > >> > interact with an outsider to the community are
> > > > >> > themselves likely to be
> > > > >> > marginal within their own communities. The phrase
> > > > >> > that comes to mind is "lames."
> > > > >> >
> > > > >> > Can anyone help?
> > > > >> > mike
> > > > >> > _______________________________________________
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