Hi Mike,
constitutive parts of an activity system are identical non-
identities, therefore true differences, and therefore inherently lead
to indeterminacy. All the stuff and more that we find in the triangle
are of that nature; we find here qualitative change, discontinuity
Causation, determinacy, is the relation of external aspects, which
are (Hegel) indifferent to one another.
In Marx, quantity changes into quality; but as Holzkamp shows, there
need to be two types of quantitative changes to lead to a qualitative
change, that is, one dominant life form into another.
Mediation is exactly needed when causation is no longer operable.
Michael
On 20-Jan-06, at 4:37 PM, Mike Cole wrote:
Phew, this is hard to keep up with!
What is the difference between constraints and affordances and semiotic
potentials?
Lost in this music
mike
On 1/20/06, Wolff-Michael Roth <mroth@uvic.ca> wrote:
>
> Bill,
> Even in social science you got to get your relations right.
> Categories are inherently different. They can therefore not be used
> to establish a causal relation, which is framed generally in a form:
>
>
> E = kC
>
> where the equal sign already intimates that E and C are commensurable.
>
> or perhaps more generally, causation is expressed from a
> philosophical perspective as
>
>
>
> ∀x(Fx →Gx)
>
> where events of type F are followed by events of type G.
>
> Otherwise we get ourselves into a quagmire. It makes no sense to
> establish a causation between a teacher saying something and student
> killing her (like Columbine).
>
>
> Michael
>
>
>
>
> On 20-Jan-06, at 4:07 PM, bb wrote:
>
> We're doing social science, Michael, not physical science.
>
> bb
> -------------- Original message ----------------------
> From: Wolff-Michael Roth <mroth@uvic.ca>
>> Hi Bill,
>>
>> This doesn't stick. Look at any accepted use of cause and effect in
>> the science and scientific literature. It always establishes a
>> relationship between two or more factors, and this in quantitative
>> way.
>>
>> My ouch is not caused by your sticking, because there are lots of
>> stickings that do not lead to saying ouch. If you want to use this as
>> an example, then you relate the force of sticking or the depth of
>> penetration to the intensity of the pain. And then you have exactly
>> what I am talking about.
>>
>> The other is folk science.
>>
>> Michael
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 20-Jan-06, at 2:50 PM, bb wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>
>>> Hi all,
>>> it is easy to slip into a discourse that separates tools and
>>> artifacts from other things, which happens here, too. We then think
>>> in terms of "effects" that one thing has on another--but effects
>>> imply causal relations, which are quantitative rather than
>>> qualitative, which they need to be if they mediate. . .
>>
>>
>> Oh, cause and effect are not strictly quantitative. Engage in this
>> thought experiment. Suppose I stick you with a pin and you say
>> "ouch". The action of sticking with a pin is arguably the cause of
>> the action of uttering "ouch", and there is no quantitative relation
>> necessary, unless perhaps I repeat with needles of increasing size.
>>
>> cheers,
>> bb
>>
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