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Re: [xmca] Levy-Bruhl, concrete psychology and "primitivism"

Martin, to supplement your analysis below, could you attach, or copy to text the slide you used at ISCAR quoting the babalawo teaching his client about the astral? It can be read but not all at once in the Vimeo - which I highly recommend, btw (only 20 minutes long) - thank you Andy for putting that up and pointing it out. 
The astral is a very interesting concept.  I cannot think of an  
equivalent word in English, or even a quick definition for the term -  
yet your presentation gives me just enough to get an intuitive sense  
of it.  The meaning is familiar - but I don't have clear words for  
it.  What is your take on what the concept of the astral is to a  
babalawo and others who use the term?

And what an imposing translation job this kind of research must  
require - across modes of production, continents, eras, classes - and  
of course, languages.  No wonder so few researchers try to do  
something like this!  It must be extremely difficult to translate  
concepts across such expanses in time, space, class and mind.  It  
grossly oversimplifies the task to just describe it as the challenge  
of translating a localized, religious and mostly oral use of Spanish  
to written and formal CHAT-ese English - but that begins to give a  
flavor of how complex it must be.  I salute you, Martin, and all those  
in CHAT, with Mike as the great-granddad, who have been doing this  
remarkable kind of work.  It is one of the cutting-edge aspects of CHAT.

What intrigues me about the astral is how psychologically *concrete*  
this concept seems to be in the lives of the people interested in the  
Oruba and Santaria religions.  Its concreteness strikes me in at least  
two ways.

One is the role of the concept of the astral in making lifestyle  
choices about loaning out personal belongings such as clothing,  
towels, soap.  You point to the solidity of the babalawo's argument.   
My intuition is telling me he can do this because of the concreteness  
of the concept of the astral he is relying on and explaining.

Another aspect of concreteness I think I detect is the role of the  
concept of the astral as part of what is apparently an elaborate  
system of psychological and social concepts that can be used to  
describe, explain and predict human behavior.  I think of that  
endeavor as 'concrete' because I can't think of anything people like  
to talk about more!   And the concept of the astral seems to clearly  
enable that kind of conversation.  (And it is much catchier than  
"higher mental functions," don't you think?)

The babalawo describes the astral as luck, as stability, as being  
potentially negative, of having your astral or your luck stolen, as  
enveloping or being enveloped, etc.  Many complex possibilities and  
configurations are indicated in a single stream of explanations.  Like  
concepts such as karma, soul, aura, etc. there seems to be some long- 
developed knowledge about the nature of human relations contained in  
the concept of the astral.  But I can't quite put this implicit  
knowledge into explicit words.

- Steve


On Feb 21, 2012, at 1:57 PM, Martin Packer wrote:


I was hoping someone might analyze this passage for me, but I guess  
I'll have to do it myself!

Much of the babalawo's talk takes the form of advice,  
recommendations, obligations for the future conduct of the client.  
What she has to do, or ought to do, includes “go to the church and  
make mass for you deceased relatives,” “look after your mother, by  
phone,” “arrange a sacrifice,” “pray,” “wear your hair loose,” and  
so on. In the excerpt above, the advice is to stop lending her  
clothes.

It is worth considering in detail the way this advice is offered. In  
this excerpt it is grounded in what “Orula says” (93) but  
immediately a warrant is added: “because that is stealing your  
luck” (we have translated suerte as ‘luck,’ but it could equally be  
‘fate’). This is then clarified, and then the babalawo recommends to  
the client that she make her own observation; if she does so, she  
will see that her sister, who on occasion uses her clothes, is  
happy, content, while she, the client, is not (94-96). This is  
presented as an empirical demonstration of the Orula’s point: due to  
the fact that her sister has worn her clothes, the client’s astral  
has been stolen. It also counters a possible rebuttal: the “If not…”  
can be glossed as “If you don’t believe me, consider this…” The  
consequence of this is that the client is unhappy, while her sister  
is happy. The babalawo then offers additional clarification,  
“because…” one can wash ones clothes a hundred times, the astral of  
the person who wore them cannot be removed (96-98). This displays a  
counter to a possible qualification that the loss of one’s astral  
might be prevented by the simple expedient of washing the clothes  
that have been borrowed. Then he adds what could be taken as an  
appeal to his authority, or a confirmation that he himself lives by  
the advice he is offering to her: “We, the religious, don’t loan our  
clothing…” (98). This functions as backing to the validity of the  
central claims. He elaborates further; not only clothing should not  
be shared, but also shoes, towels, soap. Nor do they do the  
reciprocal: they don’t “wear the clothes of another person” (101),  
this countering the possible objection that if the effect works one  
way, it ought to work in the opposite direction, but this has not  
been mentioned.

The passage displays a complex and subtle argumentative  
organization. It starts with the central claim, then a warrant  
(“because…”), then a more explicit statement of the mechanism that  
is claimed to be operating (“wear someone’s clothes… steals their  
luck”), then it counters a possible rebuttal, then counters a  
possible qualification. Then a backing is provided, and a further  
warrant. Finally, another possible qualification is countered.

Recall Toulmin's model of argument:


<Toulmin.pdf>
On Feb 21, 2012, at 9:54 AM, Martin Packer wrote:


Steve mentioned the presentation I gave at ISCAR, on a study  
conducted by a student here in Colombia (Silvia Tibaduisa) of the  
babalawo. I discussed an excerpt from a divination session; here it  
is:

Let me ask a little question. You live in a aparte-studio... in an  
apartment, with other people. What person wears your clothing?

Yes. Sometimes my cousin or my sister uses them


Orula says not to lend your clothes any more, because that is  
stealing your luck. That the person who wears someone’s clothes  
steals their astral, steals their luck. If not, make an observation  
yourself, of how your cousin lives and how you live. She's all  
happy, all content, and you’re not. That is how someone’s luck,  
stability, leaves them. Because [when] one lends their astral,  
although one washes it 100 times, it takes holds of the astral of  
the other person as well, and if it’s a negative astral, it also  
includes one. We, the religious, don’t loan our clothing, we don’t  
bathe with the same towel or the same soap. We don’t lend  
underwear, socks, shoes, anything. Because these are one's personal  
things and that takes hold of your astral. Nor wear the clothes of  
another person.

The English reads a little oddly because I prefer literalish  
translations. There are a number of interesting characteristics to  
this exchange, but I want to focus on the reasoning involved. I  
would suggest that it is perfectly recognizable to us. Substitute a  
more familiar premise: not "when someone wears your clothes they  
steal your astral" but "when someone uses your toothbrush they give  
you bacteria" and the rest follows logically, doesn't it?

Martin

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