Re: [xmca] "higher psychic function"

[Huw Lloyd <huw.softdesigns@gmail.com>]

On 13 February 2012 18:17, Vera John-Steiner <vygotsky@unm.edu> wrote:

> Hi,
> I think "mediatory" is a very awkwars term and it requires quite a bit of
> knowledge about CHAT. Integrated (see David's note )
> psychological functions may work better, or possibly integrated
> psychological processes. V's point was that "higher" psychological
> functions required the unification of diverse streams of learning, culture
> and development.
>

Though integrated begs the question of how in particular, and doesn't
relate clearly to qualitative change.

HMF is simple to say and has a certain mystique.  :)

Huw


> Vera
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Huw Lloyd" <huw.softdesigns@gmail.com>
> To: "eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity" <xmca@weber.ucsd.edu>
> Sent: Monday, February 13, 2012 9:53 AM
>
> Subject: Re: [xmca] "higher psychic function"
>
>
> On 13 February 2012 16:21, Colette Murphy <c.a.murphy@qub.ac.uk> wrote:
>
>  Hugh
>> Thanks a lot for your reasoning. May I just explain that I was worried
>> that 'higher psychic function' might sound too abstract and psychological
>> for many science educators (including myself). Thus, whilst your
>> suggestion
>> makes perfect sense, I fear that it may also suffer from being too
>> abstract
>> / psychological for my current purpose. Can you make it more concrete
>> perhaps?
>>
>>
> Well it is more concrete, in the Marxian sense.
>
> Really, I would say this hinges on your reference to "scientists".   If
> they are scientists they should know, or not be shy of knowing, what a
> homology (structural comparison) is.  That a term like mediation addresses
> the phenomena as a scientific system, whereas 'higher' is indeed abstract
> and removed (but familiar from the perspective of other psychological
> theories).
>
> If a term is introduced that is not familiar, then they're atleast made
> aware that the subject may deal with unfamiliar things, rather than
> assimilating them (in the Piagetian sense) to their current understanding.
> So "Higher" may suffice, for some, from an outside perspective but it
> points in inappropriate ways.  "Mediatory" is more precise but points to
> the unknown, which is also truthful to their understanding.
>
> Huw
>
>
>  Thanks a million
>> Colette
>>
>> Dr Colette Murphy
>> Senior Lecturer
>> School of Education
>> 69 University St
>> Queen's University
>> Belfast BT7 1HL
>>
>> tel: 02890975953
>>
>> “Why is it, in spite of the fact that teaching by pouring in, learning by
>> passive absorption, are universally condemned, that they are still so
>> entrenched in practice?”
>>
>>         John Dewey Democracy in Education 1916, Page 46
>> ______________________________**__________
>> From: xmca-bounces@weber.ucsd.edu [xmca-bounces@weber.ucsd.edu] On Behalf
>> Of Huw Lloyd [huw.softdesigns@gmail.com]
>> Sent: 13 February 2012 16:08
>> To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity
>> Subject: Re: [xmca] "higher psychic function"
>>
>> On 13 February 2012 15:57, Bella Kotik-Friedgut <bella.kotik@gmail.com
>> >wrote:
>>
>> > Colette asked for  a concept  "that it be best read/understood/accepted
>> by
>> > educationalists (more specifically, science education researchers)
>> > in such a case  it seems that  "Extension of psychological mediatory
>> > function" does not fit the context Bella Kotik-.
>> >
>>
>>
>> Because.... ?
>>
>> Huw
>>
>>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On Mon, Feb 13, 2012 at 5:00 PM, Huw Lloyd <huw.softdesigns@gmail.com
>> > >wrote:
>> >
>> > > On 13 February 2012 12:09, Bella Kotik-Friedgut <
>> bella.kotik@gmail.com
>> > > >wrote:
>> > >
>> > > >  Dear Colette my off-list note returned rejected by your server, so:
>> > > >
>> > > >  I use "higher mental functions" or sometimes "higher psychological
>> > > > functions", but the first is preferable.
>> > > > --
>> > > > Sincerely yours Bella Kotik-Friedgut
>> > > >
>> > > > On Mon, Feb 13, 2012 at 1:47 PM, Colette Murphy <
>> c.a.murphy@qub.ac.uk
>> > > > >wrote:
>> > > >
>> > > > > Dear All
>> > > > > I'd be very interested to hear your views on how to
>> > edit/reword/rewrite
>> > > > > the phrase "higher psychic function" in relation to Vygotsky's CH
>> > > theory
>> > > > so
>> > > > > that it be best read/understood/accepted by educationalists (more
>> > > > > specifically, science education researchers)?
>> > > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Perhaps it would be better to use a term that pointed to the > >
>> phenomena,
>> > > such as "Extension of psychological mediatory function".  "Higher"
>> > relates
>> > > the phenomena to other psychological theories but points away from the
>> > > phenomena -- one is left considering why one function is higher than
>> > > another whilst embedding the ideas in an (unnecessary) analogical
>> > framework
>> > > of "height = abstraction" or "higher as in high church" in which case
>> one
>> > > is even further removed from a precise formulation using a > >
>> metaphorical
>> > > frame.
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > > I'm happy to engage off-list
>> > > > > if this query is better treated that way.
>> > > >
>> > >
>> > > This is clearly on-topic in many ways.
>> > >
>> > > Kind regards,
>> > > Huw
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > > > Thanks a million
>> > > > > Colette
>> > > > >
>> > > > > Dr Colette Murphy
>> > > > > Senior Lecturer
>> > > > > School of Education
>> > > > > 69 University St
>> > > > > Queen's University
>> > > > > Belfast BT7 1HL
>> > > > >
>> > > > > tel: 02890975953
>> > > > >
>> > > > > “Why is it, in spite of the fact that teaching by pouring in,
>> > learning
>> > > by
>> > > > > passive absorption, are universally condemned, that they are still
>> so
>> > > > > entrenched in practice?”
>> > > > >
>> > > > >          John Dewey Democracy in Education 1916, Page 46
>> > > > > ______________________________**__________
>> > > > > ______________________________**____________
>> > > > > _____
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>> > > > >
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>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > Sincerely yours Bella Kotik-Friedgut
>> > ______________________________**____________
>> > _____
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