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Re: [xmca] Rudolf Steiner



Well if our govt is to be believed, the Holy Grail is available on eBay. All you need is the information to make an informed choice.

a

David Preiss wrote:

And the question that complements this one is whether schools have the human and intellectual resources (not to say financial resources or time available) to be able to indulge in critical thinking... and not to turn their work in just blind reduction of complexity.

David
still looking for the holy grail


On Jan 10, 2010, at 9:30 PM, Andy Blunden wrote:

Yes, and one of the other devil-and-the-deep-blue-sea questions is:

On the one hand, a practice organized around the rigid application of a once-good idea which is way outside of the ethos of everyday life (sectarianism);

On the other hand, the norms of the "really existing democracy" which is the taken-for-granted normality.

To stand against the stream usually means to cling tightly to an eccentric idea, and hold on no matter what anyone else thinks or does.

That's why I think the question raised by Jay is so important - how to enter into reality critically?

Andy

David Preiss wrote:
Taking into consideration all the posts on this thread, it seems that finding a school that balances the development of higher psychological processes, consideration of teachers and students' humanity and its privileged role as cultural transmitters / renovators is more difficult than finding the holy grail. Probably, a Waldorf-life school is as distant from what many of us here may consider a reasonable school as the more conventional schools we commonly criticize are, with all their unidimensional emphasis on overachievement, ranking / discrimination of students and encapsulated knowledge. And that for those of us that have the cursed "privilege" or the illusion of choice: most of the parents in the world are forced to send their kids to horrible places where even raising this question is out of place and where concerns of everyday survival rank first in the list of priorities.
Alas!
David
On Jan 10, 2010, at 1:00 PM, Leif Strandberg wrote:
I remember the first time I visited a Waldorf school in Sweden. It was 1978, and I was impressed of the calm atmosphere, the dancing (eurytmi) the painting (wet in wet), their interconnectedness with environment, vegetarian food, alternative medicine, water cleaning etcetera.

When I visited this particular school (it is the most famous one here in Sweden, outside the town Soedertaelje, founded 1949, and has been supported, and with regular inspection, since then) last year, more than 30 years after my first impressions, I saw exactly the same thing (!) They were doing the same things!

so, the creativity in Waldorf schools must have some limits ;-)

I am not saying that these schools are bad for children - but from a CHAT-perspective.... let's say... we have at least a lot to talk about

They are dedicated to greek ideas about temperaments, Goethe and Rosseau... and the natural child

I prefer Villon, Rabelais, Voltaire and Diderot.... and Vygotsky... and cultural-historical children performing together, doing what's not yet here

You can watch some pictures of their beautiful architecture on:

http://www.antroposofi.info/jaerna/

Leif - not so waldorfian - and absolutely not a Steinerian
and nowadays not even a vegetarian

10 jan 2010 kl. 14.18 skrev arthur@fi.uu.nl:

A Dutch perspective on your question Andy:

Unlike in the USA and UK, Steiner schools are subsidized by the Dutch
government, just as Montessori, Jenaplan, Kees Boeke, Dalton etc. Hence
they fall under regular inspection. As a kid I attended a very good
Steiner school (7-12 yrs), which worked for me, for several reasons also
mentioned by others (using head, heart & hands, safe environment, no
attainment pressure, much attention for nature, creativity etc). But as with all schools, there are very good and very bad ones in our country.

Steiner is indeed off mainstream, yet it is interesting how influential
his anthroposophy has been in several areas of life:
- health care (there are anthroposophic doctors and medicine)
- organic food (biologisch-dynamisch with strict rules for growing and
treating the soil)
- finance (a Dutch bank, Triodos, based its principles on anthroposophy,
and was lately awarded as the most sustainable bank here).
- and of course education

A PhD student from Groningen University made a comparison of children's play in regular and Steiner schools. Another PhD student discovered poor results for maths in secondary education but a positive attitude towards
learning (Hilde Steenbergen).

Btw, I think Steiner's early work in philosophy - much less contentious than his later work - might be interesting to anyone interested in Hegel, Marx etc from a 1900 perspective (he had a PhD in philosophy). He had a very non-materialistic interpretation of Hegel etc. I don't know his work
on Goethe very well.

Arthur

I have been researching Goethe and his scientific ideas, and
after a long time I came across a book which tells in detail
of how his ideas originated and explains them very clearly
and convincingly. The point I am interested in of course is
the Urphaenomen, a.k.a., unit of analysis, and as Goethe and
Davydov both insist, a unit of analysis which is given to
the senses.

The author of the book is *Rudolph Steiner*, the same
Rudolph Steiner who started up Steiner Schools. I can get an
idea of his life and work from Wikipedia and so on, and it
certainly is way off the mainstream, if I could put it that
way. However, I would  be interested in a brief response
from xmca-ers on the success or otherwise of his schools.

Andy
--
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hegel Summer School
http://www.ethicalpolitics.org/seminars/hss10.htm
Hegel, Goethe and the Planet: 13 February 2010.

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David Preiss
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--
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hegel Summer School
http://www.ethicalpolitics.org/seminars/hss10.htm
Hegel, Goethe and the Planet: 13 February 2010.

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David Preiss
 http://web.mac.com/ddpreiss/





--
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hegel Summer School
http://www.ethicalpolitics.org/seminars/hss10.htm
Hegel, Goethe and the Planet: 13 February 2010.

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