Re: [xmca] On the shape of the zpd and message in a bottle

[Carol Macdonald <carolmacdon@gmail.com>]

David
I think you requirement is too strong. This means that children have to have
scientific concepts, for one thing.

And we don't have a conscious grasp of grammar, otherwise linguists would be
out of a job.  One of my students taught parts of speech using the acronym
NAPPIVAC with grade 10 girls,  and it was a real aha! experience, as they
couldn't do the parts of speech before.

However when we learn a second language formally in school (best seen in
secondary school), the teacher uses scientific concepts from L1 to get to
L2. Belyov showed us this in the earlier sixties, with very good outcomes.

Carol

2009/6/8 <ERIC.RAMBERG@spps.org>

> David:
>
> you wrote:
>
> "But what do children do? Ontogenetically, word meanings develop in an
> empirical, factual manner; the links between meanings merely mirroring the
> links between objects. But until concepts can be related to OTHER
> concepts, rather than simply related to objects, conscious grammar cannot
> emerge."
>
> To make such a bold statement, IMHO, removes the goal orientated aspect of
> Vygotsky's triangle.  Does the relational aspect of concepts point towards
> problem solving?
>
> eric
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