Re: [xmca] Humans and nature

thank you David, I did not know this book; it seems very interesting
to me.

by the way: I thought that 'affordance' has been introduced by J.
Gibson--not by Bateson,

greetings,

Michalis Kontopodis

research associate
humboldt university berlin
tel.: +49 (0) 30 2093 3716
fax.: +49 (0) 30 2093 3739
http://www.csal.de
http://www.iscar.org/de/culthistanthpsy/

On Mar 21, 2008, at 11:45 PM, David Kellogg wrote:

> Sorry, Michalis! Too much English language teaching "insider talk".
> In my little village, EVERYBODY knows van Lier (but then hardly
> anyone knows Vygotsky!)
>
> The van Lier in question is Leo van Lier. He's Dutch all right, but
> he's a professor at the Monterey Institute of International Studies.
> The book is:
>
> The Ecology and Semiotics of Language Learning, Boston, Dordrecht,
> New York and London: Kluwer Academic.
>
> As the title suggests, it's very Batesonian: lots of stuff on
> "affordances". But beware--this book costs a LOT of money and it's
> VERY badly edited. Get it through the library if humanly possible.
> The Peircean analysis of Volosinov in on p. 114, but there's a VERY
> good gloss of Peircean signs on pp. 61-73.
>
> David Kellogg
> Seoul National University of Education
>
> Michalis Kontopodis <michalis.kontopodis@staff.hu-berlin.de> wrote:
> Thank you David,
>
> is this the publication you refered to: Van Lier, Eva 2004:
> Straattaal. Neerlandica Extra Muros. February 2004. ?
>
> I would be interested in doing some historical investigation on the
> origins and uses of the concept of mediation in 19th and early 20th
> century, which would probably be the link between all these works. At
> the moment I am in vacation (for the next two weeks) and do not have
> access to any library, so I will later come back to this.
>
> with thankful regards,
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Michalis Kontopodis
>
> research associate
> humboldt university berlin
> tel.: +49 (0) 30 2093 3716
> fax.: +49 (0) 30 2093 3739
> http://www.csal.de
> http://www.iscar.org/de/culthistanthpsy/
>
>
>
>
> On Mar 21, 2008, at 12:24 AM, David Kellogg wrote:
>
>> Dear Michalis,
>>
>> I think there isn't any direct evidence for a Peircean influence.
>> But I also think it's there.
>>
>> One POSSIBLE conduit is Volosinov. van Lier (2004) has pointed out
>> that Volosinov's analysis of "Well!" in "Discourse in Art and
>> Discourse in Life" (the appendix to his book on Freudianism) is
>> reducible with almost no remainder to a Peircean one.
>>
>> Andy would say this is because of their common Hegelian origin.
>> Peirce and Volosinov are cousins in the same generation like apes
>> and humans; the latter is not descended from the former. That's
>> probably so. But still, as Marx would say, "the anatomy of man is
>> the key to the anatomy of the ape".
>>
>> David Kellogg
>> Seoul National University of Education
>>
>>
>>
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Received on Wed Mar 26 01:44 PDT 2008