Re: [xmca] Another Claim That LSV Did Not Originate the ZPD

                        Once again mike you have reiterated the important
influence history has upon the development of a person's thinking,
contradictory or not.

eric

      To: "eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity" <xmca@weber.ucsd.edu>
      cc:
      bcc:
      Subject: Re: [xmca] Another Claim That LSV Did Not Originate the
ZPD
"Mike Cole" <lchcmike@gmail.com>
Sent by: xmca-bounces@weber.ucsd.edu
01/21/2008 09:55 AM PST
Please respond to mcole <font size=-1></font>

I am pretty certain that one of Homer's assistant lute players was the
first
to articulate
the idea of a zone of proximal development. But no one knew how to write it
down so they
had to depend upon singing tales, and we know how unreliable that is.

They say that Geothe was the first to suggest that "*Everything has
been **thought
of before*,* but the difficulty is to think of it again" ... under the
right
circumstances (added by someone's alter ego).*

actually I think it was Goethe's mother, a remarkable woman, who first said
that, but she
was probably paraphrasing someone else.Vico perhaps? Or her own mom?

If I were looking for antecedents of academic pedigree the Valsiner book on
guided mind might be a place to look.

mlk
(happily, for this day, my initials in Russian)

On Jan 21, 2008 9:12 AM, Peter Smagorinsky <smago@uga.edu> wrote:

> David et al., Google turns up some interesting possibilities on Meumann:
> http://www.springerlink.com/content/tr1602w137117l42/
>
>
http://links.jstor.org/sici?sici=0002-9556(192304)34%3A2%3C271%3AEM1%3E2.0.C
>
O%3B2-W<http://links.jstor.org/sici?sici=0002-9556%28192304%2934%3A2%3C271%3AEM1%3E2.0.CO%3B2-W>
>
>
http://www.bestwebbuys.com/Bibliographie_Ernst_Meumann-ISBN_9783883090337.ht
> ml?isrc=b-search
> http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ernst_Meumann
> same page translated into English by a machine:
>
>
http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=de&u=http://de.wikipedia.org/
>
>
wiki/Ernst_Meumann&sa=X&oi=translate&resnum=2&ct=result&prev=/search%3Fq%3DE
> rnst%2BMeumann%2B%26hl%3Den%26rlz%3D1T4SKPB_enUS234US234
> http://www.bautz.de/bbkl/m/meumann_e.shtml
> same page translated into English by a machine:
>
>
http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=de&u=http://www.bautz.de/bbkl
>
>
/m/meumann_e.shtml&sa=X&oi=translate&resnum=3&ct=result&prev=/search%3Fq%3DE
> rnst%2BMeumann%2B%26hl%3Den%26rlz%3D1T4SKPB_enUS234US234
>
>
>
>
> Peter Smagorinsky
> The University of Georgia
> 125 Aderhold Hall
> Athens, GA 30602
> smago@uga.edu/phone:706-542-4507
> http://www.coe.uga.edu/lle/faculty/smagorinsky/index.html
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: xmca-bounces@weber.ucsd.edu [mailto:xmca-bounces@weber.ucsd.edu] On
> Behalf Of David Kellogg
> Sent: Monday, January 21, 2008 11:42 AM
> To: xcma
> Subject: [xmca] Another Claim That LSV Did Not Originate the ZPD
>
> Last night I was reading the new book by M.E. Gredler and C.C. Shields,
> "Vygotsky's Legacy: A foundation for research and practice" (New York and
> London: Guilford Press).
>
> On p. 84 they write:
>
> "Vygotsky referred to the second diagnostic task as that of identifying
> the child's ZPDs (p. 201), a concept from Ernst Meumann and other
> psychologists."
>
> The p. 201 reference is apparently to vol. 5 of the Collected Works.
> There
> is no reference to Meumann and of course nothing to "other
psychologists".
>
> This is not the first time I've seen the claim that LSV did not
originate
> the ZPD. We find similar in
>
> Gillen, J. 2000: Versions of Vygotsky. British Journal of Educational
> Studies 48 (2), 183-198.
>
> And also in Peter Langford's book:
>
> Langford, P.E. 2005: Vygotsky¡¯s developmental and educational
> psychology.
> Hove and New York: Psychology Press.
>
> But neither Gillen nor Langford actually named a name. Does anyone know
> anything about Ernst Meumann and why he might be considered the
originator
> of the ZPD?
>
> David Kellogg
> Seoul National University of Education
>
>
> ---------------------------------
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Received on Tue Jan 22 14:27 PST 2008