Diane,
While I would question the cultural element of Freud somewhat, I am finding
Butler's discussion in *Bodies..." very interesting. I think she importantly
elaborates both Freud ansd Lacan. While we can point toward where CHAT
diverged from psychoanalysis the other way works too. I believe Vygotsky
took his model of internalization from Freud, Elkonin's elaboration of the
"affective sphere" - motive was motivated by synthesizing Piaget and Freud.
Luria too has a very long history with psychoanalysis.
In particular the whole discussion about signified / signifind is proving
very interesting to me. Both Walkerdine and Butler use this extensively.
Just to say I think there was an important relationship there and one that
can be useful to consider for the future of CHAT.
In particular for me is how it can offer a way to theorize the individual
(subject) that is not isolated from the cultural-historical. I am personally
finding myself being less satisfied with developmentalism on each passing
day, and for me theorists like Walkerdine, Butler etc. and the way they
theorize the subject has something important to offer CHAT.
NATE
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-----Original Message-----
From: Diane Hodges [mailto:dhodges@ceo.cudenver.edu]
Sent: Monday, May 08, 2000 7:49 PM
To: xmca@weber.ucsd.edu
Subject: Re(2): psychoanalysis and...CHAT
First, thanks very much Daniel, for the reference to Media Arts at the
Univ of Arizona - thanks very much indeed.
I've been reading Pedro's paper on CHAT and psychotherapy, to understand
better
the critique of psychoanalysis, and have a few thoughts, questions -
Freud's theory was specifically social, in that the ways libido drives
manifest
are constructed by the social contexts where people live - language,
speech,
symbols (tools) were all significant structures of the ways
these behaviors might manifest -
as well, by these behaviors of the psychic structure's (external)
manifestations being socially organized, they were absolutely cultural,
and Freud's own exile from
Germany was a part of his own interests in collective psychosis, or what
I might call ideology -
so, I have trouble seeing how psychoanalysis is not materialistic, in that
the manifestations of psychic drives, such as desire, are
socially-culturally enacted
through the common language of a person's context ...
in treating mental health problems such as schizophrenia and paranoia, I
think
there are better methods available than analysis,
but as an interpretive tool, I am still not convinced analysis cannot meet
the needs of
CHAT theory - since all inner-processes emerge in kinds of behavior,
whether in
denial or repression, and since all these processes are unavoidably
organized within and by the socio-cultural context that provides the
person with the tools
with which to express herself -
what concerns me is the context of psychotherapy, where, for example,
women suffer depression at a much higher rate than men, and women's
depression is
strongly connected to patriarchal structures that oppress, and are
internalized;
anorexia-nervosa has been explicitly connected to relations of girls with
their fathers, and the greater emotional and verbal abuse that takes place
from the father,
the greater the likelihood of the girl developing an eating disorder -
this points to specific gender issues that Western society condones
inadvertently
within its denial of a patriarchal structure - so, when attempting to
normalize a client
in a psychotherapeutic context, is there not a risk of denying the ways
cultures
structure and define gender norms?
again, i think psychoanalysis benefits these questions because it deals
specifically with sexuality, and in a society where sexuality is so
complex, certainly any CHAT paradigm needs to consider sex/gender in its
applications -
finally, i find psychoanalysis, concerned so explicitly with language,
pliable in
the working of interpretation and in the ways i might use these ideas for
understanding a complex situation, or institutional effect on gender - I
am not sure that Freud is a literal methodology, so much as a schematic of
symbolic possibilities - while Vygotsky might have read Freud a certain
way, as conflicting
with Marxist materialism and dialectics, the current uses of
psychoanalysis
are far more elaborated -
i found your writing quite fascinating, (she said ingratiatingly) but
wonder if you could address some of these issues of interpretation and
sexuality/gender?
or do you think CHAT has the capacity to do so?
diane
**********************************************************************
:point where everything listens.
and i slow down, learning how to
enter - implicate and unspoken (still) heart-of-the-world.
(Daphne Marlatt, "Coming to you")
***********************************************************************
diane celia hodges
university of british columbia, centre for the study of curriculum and
instruction
==================== ==================== =======================
university of colorado, denver, school of education
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