Hi Nate and everybody--
Nate, I'm a bit confused about your message. Can you clarify it, please?
> As far as it not being dominant, I think that's too strong. But it was
> explicitly dominating rather than the "middle class" version of the world
> where it is assumed as a natural state or progression.
>
Do I understand you correctly that you question that there was time in 19th
century when "middle class" was not dominant? I think it was. For example in
the first half of 19th century, the dominant discourse in the high Russian
society as reflected in high literature was issues of "honor" (among others)
that it seems to me belong to voice of nobility (e.g., Pushkin's "The
captain's daughter," in Chadsky "The trouble because of smartness," and in
Lermontov "The hero of our time"). In the second part of 19th century, the
discourse shifted to "eternal questions" described by Dostoevsky but you can
find them in Leo Tolstoy as well (e.g., in "War and Peace" or in
"Resurrection").
Can you elaborate about Uzbekistan, please? I do not know the history of the
region well, but it seems to me that in pre-Soviet Uzbekistan there was
non-Russian and religion-based literature (Farsi and Arabic, probably). Of
course, there was very rich oral literacy. I've heard that in different
historic time there was different rate of literacy spread in Uzbekistan. I'm
sure that the current Uzbeki nationalist renaissance is based on that
literacy and not on Russian-Soviet literacy. But I can be wrong -- it is my
guess. I'm glad to know more details about the mater. I'm not sure I follow
the analogy with Vygotsky's "genetic law" -- can you elaborate, please?
Eugene
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Nate Schmolze [mailto:schmolze@students.wisc.edu]
> Sent: Sunday, January 23, 2000 8:45 PM
> To: Xmca
> Subject: RE: Prototypical defining middle class
>
>
>
> Eugene,
>
> In some areas like "development" we do not have to go that far back to see
> it very visable and explicit. It was science or its more populus
> application
> that facilitated its naturalization.
>
> To use Star's book as an example she talks about the political tensions of
> classification when they emerged, but now they are more or less seen as
> natural. I think domestic animals and its incorporation into "scientific"
> classification was the example she used.
>
> This is one area where I think the Foucauldian historicizing can
> be useful.
> As Bruner might say it makes the familiar, unfamiliar and strange again.
>
> As far as it not being dominant, I think that's too strong. But it was
> explicitly dominating rather than the "middle class" version of the world
> where it is assumed as a natural state or progression.
>
> In some ways it can give us a more Macro view of Vygotsky's genetic law -
> what once was external (dominant) and explicit becomes
> internalized and seen
> as natural. For example, Luria's work in Uzbekistan. A few years
> ago, I was
> talking to someone who was doing research there and she mentioned in
> reclaiming their pre-soviet identity written literacy was a
> central aspect.
> The pre-soviet Uzbekistan was now a subject who was always
> literate. Now as
> I am sure your aware bringing "literacy" to the Uzbekistan was
> external and
> explicit, yet today it is seen as something pre-soviet or a naturalized
> aspect of the Uzbekistan identity. Or at least this was the story I was
> told.
>
> Nate
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Eugene Matusov [mailto:ematusov@udel.edu]
> Sent: Sunday, January 23, 2000 4:29 PM
> To: Judy Diamondstone
> Cc: XMCA
> Subject: RE: Prototypical defining middle class
>
>
> Hi Judy and everybody--
>
> Thanks, Judy, for your amendment to the list. I agree with it. I
> wonder that
> in 19th century emerging middle class did not feel as dominant and
> comfortable as it is now. I wonder if it was more critical than. Any
> evidence for that?
>
> I also really like Ricardo's idea to consider middle class a network of
> practices, roles, cultures, powers, ideologies, and values.
>
> What do you think?
>
> Eugene
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Judy Diamondstone [mailto:diamonju@rci.rutgers.edu]
> > Sent: Sunday, January 23, 2000 4:19 PM
> > To: xmca@weber.ucsd.edu
> > Subject: Re: Prototypical defining middle class
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> > >I hope I missed something in my prototypical definition of
> > middle class and
> > >people will come to add and change items on my list.
> >
> > one thing I would add to the prototype is disposition of the
> middle class,
> > specfically, since members of the middle class live in a world largely
> > designed by others like them, the structures & norms are invisible, and
> > since it has more to lose than upper and lower classes, it has
> > more stake in
> > the world as is. Fierce defense of norms; comfort with surveillance...
> >
> >
> >
> > Judith Diamondstone (732) 932-7496 Ext. 352
> > Graduate School of Education
> > Rutgers, the State University of New Jersey
> > 10 Seminary Place
> > New Brunswick, NJ 08901-1183
> >
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