[Xmca-l] Re: "sociocultural psychology" ?

Wed May 13 08:38:35 PDT 2020

Thank you Anthony for the interesting question and link. The way I see this
issue is that Vygotskian work attempts to understand human activity
multi-dimensionally (or even better holistically, trying to reunite what
the emergence of various parochial disciplines have pulled apart for
analysis of the separate dimensions).  The different terms that Veresov
points out as contending are simply foregrounding those sets of components
that are most salient to the particular analyst at that moment.  To those
we might add other elements that Vygotsky was interested in such as
consciousness and language and experience and mediation (and even economics
and human knowledge and education lurk in the background, as well as human
neurodiversity as well as materialities of the experienced world).  That is
the wonder of Vygotsky, even though he may have developed some of the
components more than others and he was acting nominally as a
psychologist--yet his approach allows the integration of all these
components.

I therefore use different conjunctions of terms depending on what I am
talking about, and I see activity as the overarching term--though this does
not necessarily mean triangles all the time.  Rather activity is humans in
motion, mobilizing multiple internal and external resources in situations.

While I would like some stability in terms, right now our different
concerns and issues leave salience mutable. And I am not yet comfortable in
being terminally enlisted into another scholar's transient saliencies.

BTW, I see another related, parallel attempt at reintegrating the social
sciences in the pragmatist project which has at times been in communication
with the activity theory project (see my paper "Practically Human").  This
project also never settled on a coherent set of terms and stable concepts.

Chuck
----
די פאַרייניקטע שטאַטן איז אַ פאָלק פון ימאַגראַנץ
الولايات المتحدة هي أمة من المهاجرين
Los Estados Unidos es una nación de inmigrantes.
The U.S. is a nation of immigrants.
History will judge.
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On Wed, May 13, 2020 at 8:08 AM Anthony Barra <anthonymbarra@gmail.com>
wrote:

> Interesting question (and follow-ups) here.  Thanks, Andy.
>
> While not 100% related, I wonder if this brief, 2-minute excerpt adds any
> value: https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sT4uktowa-M__;!!Mih3wA!UhKa4f0rCaFbK573eepABBebep9QDP87JqQVUnd9uIfxETz6hRUnOR46PYaTgoSPMfyTXw$ 
> <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sT4uktowa-M__;!!Mih3wA!WLyceskZQL4AGQL-pVuwd-RH-yfvzQvsIVerMU367Nw8BZjwVLHdZ94SZfyfIX_sfjyW7w$> "Pros
> and Cons of (terminological) Diversity"
>
> As a non-expert, I can empathize with Nikolai's main point, but I'm not so
> sure the cons outweigh the pros here.
>
> But what WOULD happen if a terminological consensus was formed -- could
> Vygotsky's theory (and methodology), in fact, be definitively defined?  If
> so, would the benefits of doing so outweigh the constraints?
> I'm guessing this is an old conversation, and maybe even stale, but I'm
> more outsider than insider and don't really know.
>
> Thank you for any insight.
>
> Anthony
>
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, May 13, 2020 at 10:19 AM Martin Packer <mpacker@cantab.net> wrote:
>
>> I had assumed you were looking for uses earlier than Jim Wertsch’s, Andy.
>>
>> Jim used the term in titles in 1989 too. And in the introduction to this
>> book he, along with Pablo del Rio and Amelia Alvarez, explain why in their
>> view it’s the best term:
>>
>> Wertsch, J. V., del Río, P., & Alvarez, A. (Eds.). (1995). *Sociocultural
>> studies of mind.* Cambridge University Press.
>>
>>
>> Martin
>>
>>
>>
>> On May 12, 2020, at 11:13 PM, Andy Blunden <andyb@marxists.org> wrote:
>>
>> Thanks to everyone for their help. It all went into the mix. Indeed, the
>> term seems to have migrated from Spanish to English and the word
>> "sociocultural" became popular in 1990, and it seems that Jim Wertsch is
>> the fellow who triggered the explosion in "sociocultural psychology" with "Voices
>> of the mind : a sociocultural approach to mediated action
>> <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.worldcat.org/title/voices-of-the-mind-a-sociocultural-approach-to-mediated-action/oclc/797855062&referer=brief_results__;!!Mih3wA!WsWX2sD5ZfUnBEp3uLEVG7T0NliMnbPpuJl6VOoxtiFfKP5msJWjbZPFaCQ6jDWDMZtFSg$>"
>> published by Harvard University Press in 1991.
>>
>> Although "sociocultural" seems to be most widely associated with "context
>> dependence," Wertsch's reference to "mediated action" in the title of this
>> book makes it clear that for him "context" referred to the signs and
>> artefacts mediating action.
>>
>> Thanks again to all
>>
>> Andy
>> ------------------------------
>> *Andy Blunden*
>> Hegel for Social Movements
>> <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://brill.com/view/title/54574__;!!Mih3wA!WsWX2sD5ZfUnBEp3uLEVG7T0NliMnbPpuJl6VOoxtiFfKP5msJWjbZPFaCQ6jDWcr53a1g$>
>> Home Page
>> <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.ethicalpolitics.org/ablunden/index.htm__;!!Mih3wA!WsWX2sD5ZfUnBEp3uLEVG7T0NliMnbPpuJl6VOoxtiFfKP5msJWjbZPFaCQ6jDW3ivveVA$>
>> On 13/05/2020 12:26 pm, David Kellogg wrote:
>>
>> Andy--
>>
>> Go to to the Google N-gram site itself.
>> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://books.google.com/ngrams__;!!Mih3wA!UhKa4f0rCaFbK573eepABBebep9QDP87JqQVUnd9uIfxETz6hRUnOR46PYaTgoSH87e-IA$ 
>> <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://books.google.com/ngrams__;!!Mih3wA!Wt7qmS7sdvLo3anWG71NQFUJMvyFBqEy-mStjfAI_HEUpY8D8dQt5zHkl12Ld90MDkv2Mw$>
>> Then do your own n-gram for "sociocultural psychology". If you set the
>> years you'll get better granularity in the document search.
>> On the bottom of the n-gram, there are some dates in blue--when you click
>> on them, you should get a list of all the books used in the search.
>>
>> dk
>>
>>
>>
>> David Kellogg
>> Sangmyung University
>>
>> New Article: Ruqaiya Hasan, in memoriam: A manual and a manifesto.
>> Outlines, Spring 2020
>> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://tidsskrift.dk/outlines/article/view/116238/167607__;!!Mih3wA!UhKa4f0rCaFbK573eepABBebep9QDP87JqQVUnd9uIfxETz6hRUnOR46PYaTgoSnpt5NbA$ 
>> <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://tidsskrift.dk/outlines/article/view/116238/167607__;!!Mih3wA!Wt7qmS7sdvLo3anWG71NQFUJMvyFBqEy-mStjfAI_HEUpY8D8dQt5zHkl12Ld92Vl0flPg$>
>>
>> New Translation with Nikolai Veresov: *L.S. Vygotsky's Pedological Works* *Volume
>> One: Foundations of Pedology*"
>>  https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.springer.com/gp/book/9789811505270__;!!Mih3wA!UhKa4f0rCaFbK573eepABBebep9QDP87JqQVUnd9uIfxETz6hRUnOR46PYaTgoSHxk_2lA$ 
>> <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.springer.com/gp/book/9789811505270__;!!Mih3wA!Wt7qmS7sdvLo3anWG71NQFUJMvyFBqEy-mStjfAI_HEUpY8D8dQt5zHkl12Ld92EeQenpA$>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Wed, May 13, 2020 at 11:17 AM Martin Packer <mpacker@cantab.net>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> The earliest use of the term ‘sociocultural’ I’ve been able to find in
>>> English is this:
>>>
>>> A sociocultural psychology, by Rogelio Diaz-Guerrero
>>>
>>> In "Chicano psychology", 1977 - Academic Press
>>>
>>> Diaz-Guerrero was Mexican psychologists whose publications in Spanish
>>> use the term ‘sociocultural’ frequently.
>>>
>>> The 2nd edition of Chicano Psychology is available in Google books,
>>> and Diaz-Guerrero has a chapter in it, but titled The psychological study
>>> of the Mexican.
>>>
>>> Martin
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On May 12, 2020, at 8:47 PM, Andy Blunden <andyb@marxists.org> wrote:
>>>
>>> That graph from Google shows that usage of the term took off in 1988.
>>> How do we find out who wrote what in 1988?
>>>
>>> And Google also tell us that "Sociocultural theory grew from the work
>>> of seminal psychologist Lev Vygotsky, who believed that parents,
>>> caregivers, peers, and the culture at large were responsible for developing
>>> higher-order functions. According to Vygotsky, learning has its basis in
>>> interacting with other people," together with a reference. So that is nice.
>>>
>>> Andy
>>> ------------------------------
>>> *Andy Blunden*
>>> Hegel for Social Movements
>>> <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://brill.com/view/title/54574__;!!Mih3wA!XAtiPQXEOK3tz8RHCURqNz0psvv8Js3PxWmYUmHtZyY5j_IK-RqcFDVph7-NJ5i1rCBdtQ$>
>>> Home Page
>>> <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.ethicalpolitics.org/ablunden/index.htm__;!!Mih3wA!XAtiPQXEOK3tz8RHCURqNz0psvv8Js3PxWmYUmHtZyY5j_IK-RqcFDVph7-NJ5gDytDZfw$>
>>> On 13/05/2020 11:30 am, David Kellogg wrote:
>>>
>>> Andy:
>>>
>>> I did a Google N-gram on it. You probably thought of doing this too, but
>>> here's what I got.
>>>
>>>
>>> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://books.google.com/ngrams/interactive_chart?content=sociocultural*psychology&year_start=1800&year_end=2008&corpus=15&smoothing=3&share=&direct_url=t1*3B*2Csociocultural*20psychology*3B*2Cc0__;KyUlJSUl!!Mih3wA!UhKa4f0rCaFbK573eepABBebep9QDP87JqQVUnd9uIfxETz6hRUnOR46PYaTgoS8j-I0IQ$ 
>>> <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://books.google.com/ngrams/interactive_chart?content=sociocultural*psychology&year_start=1800&year_end=2008&corpus=15&smoothing=3&share=&direct_url=t1*3B*2Csociocultural*20psychology*3B*2Cc0__;KyUlJSUl!!Mih3wA!T9TXqTQDd-8tvv5PfuxbPkx6Drdw0VlIrRNfcypZApQv2jnziHRkeAppccOVAZEmjetMCg$>"
>>> width=900 height=500 marginwidth=0 marginheight=0 hspace=0 vspace=0
>>> frameborder=0 scrolling=no
>>>
>>> So it all starts around 1960. At first I thought this probably referred
>>> to the Hanfmann and Vakar "Thought and Language", but when I looked the
>>> only books that used the term were sports psychology books. The big uptick
>>> after 1992 is Vygotsky though.
>>>
>>> Of course, this is all English only. I am sure you will find very
>>> different results in German, where "cultural historical psychology" is the
>>> trend identified with Dilthey, Spranger, and neo-Kantianism generally.
>>>
>>>
>>> David Kellogg
>>> Sangmyung University
>>>
>>> New Article: Ruqaiya Hasan, in memoriam: A manual and a manifesto.
>>> Outlines, Spring 2020
>>> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://tidsskrift.dk/outlines/article/view/116238/167607__;!!Mih3wA!UhKa4f0rCaFbK573eepABBebep9QDP87JqQVUnd9uIfxETz6hRUnOR46PYaTgoSnpt5NbA$ 
>>> <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://tidsskrift.dk/outlines/article/view/116238/167607__;!!Mih3wA!T9TXqTQDd-8tvv5PfuxbPkx6Drdw0VlIrRNfcypZApQv2jnziHRkeAppccOVAZFjmWjmLg$>
>>>
>>> New Translation with Nikolai Veresov: *L.S. Vygotsky's Pedological
>>> Works* *Volume One: Foundations of Pedology*"
>>>  https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.springer.com/gp/book/9789811505270__;!!Mih3wA!UhKa4f0rCaFbK573eepABBebep9QDP87JqQVUnd9uIfxETz6hRUnOR46PYaTgoSHxk_2lA$ 
>>> <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.springer.com/gp/book/9789811505270__;!!Mih3wA!T9TXqTQDd-8tvv5PfuxbPkx6Drdw0VlIrRNfcypZApQv2jnziHRkeAppccOVAZGMmypSYw$>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, May 12, 2020 at 10:43 PM Andy Blunden <andyb@marxists.org>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Can anyone tell me when and with whom the term "sociocultural
>>>> psychology" originated?
>>>>
>>>> Andy
>>>> --
>>>> ------------------------------
>>>> *Andy Blunden*
>>>> Hegel for Social Movements
>>>> <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://brill.com/view/title/54574__;!!Mih3wA!WBIr3_zzidcxaloVcp2qUX4U6WR3f7enQ2z2gvamcdo3Ihy82L4ZkR-PgfCDASisbYxsxw$>
>>>> Home Page
>>>> <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.ethicalpolitics.org/ablunden/index.htm__;!!Mih3wA!WBIr3_zzidcxaloVcp2qUX4U6WR3f7enQ2z2gvamcdo3Ihy82L4ZkR-PgfCDASiXKr5OJw$>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
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