[Xmca-l] Re: Cultural historical

[Glassman, Michael]

Hi David,

So are you completely throwing out the Pragmatist view of language, that is was developed by humans to meet needs within their particular development canals? (pace Waddington). Are you taking a Chomskina view?

As far as Vygotsky, I have a bias as seeing him have strong affiliations with the American pragmatist of the early 20th century.

What would the cultural historical view be (the reason it might be okay to keep the subject line).

Michael

-----Original Message-----
From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu [mailto:xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu] On Behalf Of David H Kirshner
Sent: Monday, March 19, 2018 10:57 AM
To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity <xmca-l@mailman.ucsd.edu>
Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Cultural historical

I hope this question is addressed. 
Language is different from technology in the sense that it has not been designed by humans (who still struggle to understand it's structures). 
Of course, a rock which is used as a weapon also has not been designed by humans.
Still, in picking up a rock to use as a weapon, the wielder is cognizant of its size and shape, and uses it deliberatively and strategically. 
In some cases, language is used in a similar deliberative and strategic sense to accomplish ends. But as I understand it, the Vygotskian understanding of language as a tool references language in its non-deliberative and strategic deployment, so the usual prescriptions that apply to understanding tools and technologies does not apply.  
David


-----Original Message-----
From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu <xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu> On Behalf Of Glassman, Michael
Sent: Monday, March 19, 2018 9:13 AM
To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity <xmca-l@mailman.ucsd.edu>
Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Cultural historical

Isn't spoken language a technology?

Michael

-----Original Message-----
From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu [mailto:xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu] On Behalf Of Andy Blunden
Sent: Monday, March 19, 2018 9:08 AM
To: xmca-l@mailman.ucsd.edu
Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Cultural historical

The thing that intrigues me  is that it seems that spoken language pre-dates (at 150-350,000 years ago) the rapid development in technology.
I thought the migration patterns were pretty well settled by now, and that "hobbit" found in Flores is a diversion),

Andy

------------------------------------------------------------
Andy Blunden
ttp://www.ethicalpolitics.org/ablunden/index.htm
On 19/03/2018 11:50 PM, David Kellogg wrote:
> Somewhere in the discussion of Monica and Fernando's article, Fernando 
> made the remark that history does not know "ifs". Similarly, Monica 
> implied at one point that large technological changes must be taken as 
> given; they are not something over which humans have control. But even 
> if we accept the "Out of Africa" story which this article undermines, 
> we are left with the apparently conscious decision of early hominids 
> to leave the home continent, something none of the other great apes ever determined upon.
> Vygotsky remarked that rudiments of all four forms of higher 
> behavior--instinct, enculturation, creativity, and free will that is 
> none of these--appear even in infancy. So it appears that free will 
> was always part of anthropogenesis, and consequently that 
> history--including present history--knows nothing but ifs. We just 
> don't see the others because we are sitting in one of them.
>
> David Kellogg
> Sangmyung University
>
> Recent Article in *Early Years*
>
> The question of questions: Hasan’s critiques, Vygotsky’s crises, and 
> the child’s first interrogatives 
> <https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/09575146.2018.1431874>
>
> Free e-print available at:
> https://www.tandfonline.com/eprint/6EeWMigjFARavQjDJjcW/full
>
>
> On Mon, Mar 19, 2018 at 7:33 AM, mike cole <mcole@ucsd.edu> wrote:
>
>> This synoptic story of the current state of research on human origins 
>> seems relevant to the cultural-historical folks around.
>> mike
>>
>> https://www.sapiens.org/evolution/human-evolution-
>> australia-asia/?utm_source=SAPIENS.org+Subscribers&utm_
>> campaign=1b31c25316-Email+Blast+12.22.2017&utm_medium=
>> email&utm_term=0_18b7e41cd8-1b31c25316-199570669
>>