[Xmca-l] Re: (non)grieving scholarship

Wed Feb 28 18:09:46 PST 2018

(oh, and I didn't mean to be exclusive in pointing to Michael's work, there
are many others on the list who would fit this description!)

On Wed, Feb 28, 2018 at 7:08 PM, Greg Thompson <greg.a.thompson@gmail.com>
wrote:

> Yes, Michael, totally agreed. And I see you as a rare exception to the
> production mill. Whereas you manage to prolifically produce important
> writings, much of what is published is, to my mind, written too hurriedly
> and lacks the quality and importance of publications like yours.
> -greg
>
>
> On Wed, Feb 28, 2018 at 5:33 PM, Wolff-Michael Roth <
> wolffmichael.roth@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Greg, not all people will think being publishing machines. Some, like
>> myself, enjoy spending many hours a day writing, analyzing etc. and
>> turning
>> all of this into peer-reviewed articles.
>>
>> I referred to my earliest experience before, when I was told I would not
>> make tenure; and I felt I would not be able to make the 2 articles or so
>> per year in high quality journals.
>>
>> But after an absence from academia, it changed. I started doing research
>> for myself initially, and then wrote it up. From then on, it was
>> different,
>> writing was something I wanted to do, and the more I did, the better I got
>> at it. (Not that the peer-review process would have gotten easier.)
>>
>> I do admit, though, that the system as set up right now then tends to
>> reward people who publish more than others, and in "better" journals.
>>
>> And it depends on context. In the department that I am affiliated with,
>> there are people promoted and tenured without at least a handful of
>> articles in commonly recognized journals. And if you are happy with an
>> average increase in your salary, you don't have to get stressed in our
>> place either.
>>
>> Michael
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 28, 2018 at 4:04 PM, Greg Thompson <greg.a.thompson@gmail.com
>> >
>> wrote:
>>
>> > I once toyed with the idea of "slow scholarship" and I remain entirely
>> > convinced that this is a virtue. But once I was entered into the
>> > competition/race of academia, it was all about how fast you can get to
>> the
>> > finish line (aka "publications").
>> >
>> > Perhaps there is something good about this (assuming that it is better
>> to
>> > publish something than to not publish anything), but it also has the
>> > nefarious effect of turning scholars into cogs in publishing factories.
>> >
>> > And, continuing in this cynical spirit, I might add that the Science
>> > article about "Slow" actually seems to be making the same case for
>> speed -
>> > maybe it isn't a sprint, but it is still a race and first one to the
>> finish
>> > line wins, so you better pick up the pace! Fast!
>> >
>> > And re: the man whispering in his ear as he runs:
>> > "We see how in this way the mode of production and the means of
>> production
>> > are continually transformed, revolutionised, *how the division of
>> labour is
>> > necessarily followed by greater divisions of labour, the application of
>> > machinery by still greater application of machinery, work on a large
>> scale
>> > by work on a still larger scale.*
>> >
>> > "That is the law which again and again throws bourgeois production out
>> of
>> > its old course and which compels capital to intensify the productive
>> forces
>> > of labour, *because *it has intensified them, it, the law which gives
>> > capital no rest and continually whispers in its ear: 'Go on! Go on!'"
>> > (Marx - Wage Labour and Capital).
>> >
>> > -greg
>> >
>> > On Wed, Feb 28, 2018 at 3:11 PM, Wolff-Michael Roth <
>> > wolffmichael.roth@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> > > Hi all,
>> > > this article "In praise of slow" appears to be fitting the discussion.
>> > The
>> > > author uses a nice analogy with running. Michael
>> > > http://science.sciencemag.org/content/359/6375/602
>> > >
>> > > On Mon, Feb 26, 2018 at 8:40 AM, Huw Lloyd <huw.softdesigns@gmail.com
>> >
>> > > wrote:
>> > >
>> > > > "Assessing their abilities and accomplishments in this regard was a
>> > > matter
>> > > > of judgment and so could not be quantified; it could be exercised
>> only
>> > by
>> > > > those capable of it."
>> > > >
>> > > > I would say, "cannot be quantified simply".
>> > > >
>> > > > Best,
>> > > > Huw
>> > > >
>> > > > On 26 February 2018 at 15:05, Greg Thompson <
>> greg.a.thompson@gmail.com
>> > >
>> > > > wrote:
>> > > >
>> > > > > And here is a nice article that speaks to the bureaucratic logic
>> > that I
>> > > > was
>> > > > > mentioning (the author refers to "the all-administrative
>> > institution"):
>> > > > > https://lareviewofbooks.org/article/whose-university-is-it-
>> anyway/#!
>> > > > >
>> > > > > A quote from it:
>> > > > > "The revolution is over and the administrators have won. But the
>> > > > > persistence of traditional structures and language has led some to
>> > > think
>> > > > > that the fight over the institution is now just beginning. This
>> is a
>> > > > > mistake. As with most revolutions, open conflict occurs only after
>> > real
>> > > > > power has already changed hands."
>> > > > >
>> > > > > -greg
>> > > > >
>> > > > > On Sun, Feb 25, 2018 at 6:27 PM, Martin Packer <
>> mpacker@cantab.net>
>> > > > wrote:
>> > > > >
>> > > > > > On STEM and social science:
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > <<https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/24/opinion/sunday/
>> > > > > > doctors-revolt-bernard-lown.html?action=click&pgtype=
>> > > > > > Homepage&clickSource=story-heading&module=opinion-c-col-
>> > > > > > left-region&region=opinion-c-col-left-region&WT.nav=
>> > > > > > opinion-c-col-left-region <https://www.nytimes.com/2018/
>> > > > > > 02/24/opinion/sunday/doctors-revolt-bernard-lown.html?
>> > > > > > action=click&pgtype=Homepage&clickSource=story-heading&
>> > > > > > module=opinion-c-col-left-region&region=opinion-c-col-
>> > > > > > left-region&WT.nav=opinion-c-col-left-region>>>
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > On measures of learning:
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > <https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/23/opinion/sunday/colleges-
>> > > > > > measure-learning-outcomes.html?action=click&pgtype=
>> > > > > > Homepage&clickSource=story-heading&module=opinion-c-col-
>> > > > > > left-region&region=opinion-c-col-left-region&WT.nav=
>> > > > > > opinion-c-col-left-region <https://www.nytimes.com/2018/
>> > > > > > 02/23/opinion/sunday/colleges-measure-learning-outcomes.
>> > > > > > html?action=click&pgtype=Homepage&clickSource=story-
>> > > > > > heading&module=opinion-c-col-left-region&region=opinion-c-
>> > > > > > col-left-region&WT.nav=opinion-c-col-left-region>>
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > Martin
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > > On Feb 25, 2018, at 8:15 PM, Glassman, Michael <
>> > > glassman.13@osu.edu>
>> > > > > > wrote:
>> > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > Hi Huw,
>> > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > Perhaps the opposite is also true though.  STEM researchers
>> can
>> > > > better
>> > > > > > understand what they are doing if they are well versed in the
>> > social
>> > > > > > sciences. Understand the history and the meaning of what they
>> are
>> > > doing
>> > > > > so
>> > > > > > they do not act as androids (sorry, been watching the Aliens
>> > trilogy
>> > > of
>> > > > > > late). Perhaps we made the wrong calculation. We have lost
>> control
>> > of
>> > > > our
>> > > > > > great STEM innovations because the people using them don't
>> > understand
>> > > > the
>> > > > > > social webs that they create.  So we have people pushing xMOOCs
>> > > > (whatever
>> > > > > > happened to MOOCs anyway) as saving education (and also a
>> bundle so
>> > > > > > everybody gets tax cuts, wheeee!), saying that they are good
>> > because
>> > > > they
>> > > > > > can reach many, the proverbial long tail, with great education
>> > > > (Harvard,
>> > > > > > Stanford).  Yet nobody asks the question, "Why is this a good
>> > thing."
>> > > > > There
>> > > > > > really isn't much supporting this in earlier distance education.
>> > > There
>> > > > > is
>> > > > > > actually more evidence of how dangerous it is (Participatory
>> Action
>> > > > > > Research).
>> > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > Michael
>> > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > -----Original Message-----
>> > > > > > > From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu [mailto:xmca-l-bounces@
>> > > > > > mailman.ucsd.edu] On Behalf Of Huw Lloyd
>> > > > > > > Sent: Sunday, February 25, 2018 7:32 PM
>> > > > > > > To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity <xmca-l@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> >
>> > > > > > > Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: (non)grieving scholarship
>> > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > I would ask, what makes you think you have an ecology (or
>> niche)?
>> > > It
>> > > > > > seems that the notion of topologically derived ecologies is
>> still
>> > > > bandied
>> > > > > > about since Bronfenbrenner (1977), though I do not know whether
>> he
>> > > > > managed
>> > > > > > to refine (overhaul and improve) his notions into something
>> > > integrated
>> > > > > and
>> > > > > > agent-centric. One does not provide an ecology or an
>> environment.
>> > The
>> > > > > > environment is different for everyone, a simple consideration
>> of a
>> > > > > > rock-face or climbing wall is sufficient to grasp this -- the so
>> > > called
>> > > > > > environment (the rock face) is different to each climber, their
>> > > > > environment
>> > > > > > is that which is appropriate to them which includes contexts
>> well
>> > > > beyond
>> > > > > > what is established in an institution. From what I can gauge,
>> > > > > historically,
>> > > > > > slack was deliberately introduced into courses to afford
>> personal
>> > > > > enquiry.
>> > > > > > > There was the basic work and then there was the genuine
>> enquiry.
>> > > Who
>> > > > in
>> > > > > > their right mind wants to write an exam essay on a question they
>> > are
>> > > > > > expected to pre-write and repeat by memory? Why would someone
>> who
>> > > > enjoys
>> > > > > > thinking about their subject want to go through that kind of
>> > > > impoverished
>> > > > > > tedium? These systems are obviously geared for "delivery".
>> > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > Perhaps the biggest cultural shift can be achieved through
>> > > > instituting
>> > > > > > joint and personal enquiry. A teacher that stands before their
>> > class
>> > > > and
>> > > > > > delivers their subject inevitably obscures and obstructs the
>> > process
>> > > of
>> > > > > > enquiry, although many students will have learnt from a young
>> age
>> > > that
>> > > > > this
>> > > > > > is what to expect and demand. Engagement with genuine problems
>> > rather
>> > > > > than
>> > > > > > what students are expected to do is the basic orientational
>> issue.
>> > > > > Dispose
>> > > > > > of grades, then anyone who isn't interested is free to go home.
>> > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > The advance of STEM research is probably a good thing for
>> social
>> > > > > science.
>> > > > > > > For productive work, social science must understand the
>> structure
>> > > of
>> > > > > > STEM based work, in addition to bureaucratic processes and
>> > > > circumstances
>> > > > > > for creative work. Sticking one's head in the sand over
>> STEM-like
>> > > > > research
>> > > > > > serves merely to perpetuate the impoverished side of social
>> > science.
>> > > It
>> > > > > > reminds me of the scene in Pirsig's Zen and the Art of
>> Motorcycle
>> > > > > > Maintenance in which a couple lack the wherewithal to fix a
>> > dripping
>> > > > > faucet
>> > > > > > that gives them grief and instead choose to ignore it. Though it
>> > was
>> > > a
>> > > > > very
>> > > > > > long time ago, Pirsig's book may have contributed to my
>> > understanding
>> > > > of
>> > > > > > quality and might be thought of as an exploration of some social
>> > > issues
>> > > > > > pertaining to technical enterprises. Another good text to
>> > appreciate
>> > > > > > quality more directly, probably outside the formal area of
>> STEM, is
>> > > > > > Alshuller's Innovation Algorithm.
>> > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > Warm regards to you Henry, Greg, Alfredo.
>> > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > Best,
>> > > > > > > Huw
>> > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > On 25 February 2018 at 22:39, Alfredo Jornet Gil <
>> > > > a.j.gil@iped.uio.no>
>> > > > > > > wrote:
>> > > > > > >
>> > > > > > >> Greg, Huw, and others, I do often get worried that in the
>> > formals
>> > > > and
>> > > > > > >> informal meetings at our department (department of
>> education),
>> > > > > > >> conversations tend to focus on the "micro" developments that
>> you
>> > > > > > >> mention (students, grades, getting a next grant, getting that
>> > > paper
>> > > > > > >> published, making sure you've got enough) most of the time,
>> and
>> > > not
>> > > > so
>> > > > > > >> much on what society we would like to have, and how our
>> > > institution
>> > > > > > >> could/should contribute to that. I do not have any
>> suggestions
>> > on
>> > > > the
>> > > > > > >> type of studies that you ask about—dealing with how
>> ecologies of
>> > > > > > >> scholarship in academia lead to given developmental
>> > dynamics—other
>> > > > > > >> than the classical studies in STS, like Latour & Woolgar's on
>> > > > > > >> laboratory life, or S. L. Star's. But when I look forward at
>> > what
>> > > > lies
>> > > > > > >> between me (or anyone in my institution) and a change in the
>> way
>> > > > this
>> > > > > > >> institution has impact in the life of many, what I see is
>> lots
>> > of
>> > > > > > >> routines, habits, documents, and paperwork entangled in the
>> > > middle,
>> > > > > > >> such that the idea "mediation all the way through" makes all
>> the
>> > > > > > >> sense. And seeing things that way (from the ecological
>> > > perspective),
>> > > > > > >> makes the possibility of changing things to look actually
>> > > feasible,
>> > > > or
>> > > > > > >> more accurately perhaps, imagine-able. I'd like to continue
>> > being
>> > > > part
>> > > > > > >> of the ecology to be able to be also be part of its changing
>> > it. I
>> > > > > > >> hope others will bring more specific literature to bear. I am
>> > > > already
>> > > > > > downloading some of Peter Sloterdijk's to read.
>> > > > > > >>
>> > > > > > >> Alfredo
>> > > > > > >>
>> > > > > > >>
>> > > > > > >>
>> > > > > > >> ________________________________________
>> > > > > > >> From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> > > > > > >> <xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu> on behalf of Greg Thompson
>> > > > > > >> <greg.a.thompson@gmail.com>
>> > > > > > >> Sent: 24 February 2018 17:45
>> > > > > > >> To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity
>> > > > > > >> Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: (non)grieving scholarship
>> > > > > > >>
>> > > > > > >> I appreciate Huw's concern about academia and the push to
>> orient
>> > > to
>> > > > a
>> > > > > > >> broader and more systemic concern with "development". I think
>> > that
>> > > > > > >> this is what institutions of higher education are supposed to
>> > > have,
>> > > > > > >> right? - at the very least a concern for the development of
>> > > > individual
>> > > > > > >> "students", but also, one would hope, a concern for
>> > "development"
>> > > > at a
>> > > > > > >> longer timescale (e.g., how to be a better society, a better
>> > > world).
>> > > > > > >> They certainly tout these in their promo materials.
>> > > > > > >>
>> > > > > > >> And yet, in practice, these institutions often fall back on
>> > > > > > >> bureaucratic or economic logics. Bureaucratic logic goes
>> > something
>> > > > > > >> like, "just publish (in "good" (i.e., high impact factor)
>> > > journals),
>> > > > > > >> who cares what you publish so long as we can count it to
>> > determine
>> > > > its
>> > > > > > (and your) 'value'(!)".
>> > > > > > >>
>> > > > > > >> As for the economic logic, I was just talking with Rick
>> Shweder
>> > > the
>> > > > > > >> other day about this issue and he expressed the concern about
>> > the
>> > > > push
>> > > > > > >> towards STEM education at the expense of all else and the way
>> > that
>> > > > > > >> STEM buildings are slowly starting to take over his campus
>> (the
>> > > > > > >> University of Chicago - a place that was long held to be a
>> hold
>> > > out
>> > > > of
>> > > > > > >> liberal arts education - apparently they now have an
>> engineering
>> > > > > > >> program). He suggested that this is tied to an early 80's
>> court
>> > > > > > >> decision that gave universities ownership of patents
>> developed
>> > on
>> > > > > their
>> > > > > > campuses.
>> > > > > > >>
>> > > > > > >> To my mind, this calls to mind a concern with ecologies of
>> > > > development
>> > > > > > >> (across the shorter and longer timescales). What are the
>> > ecologies
>> > > > > > >> (social, economic, political, etc.) within which development
>> (at
>> > > > these
>> > > > > > >> various
>> > > > > > >> timescales) occurs in our world today? This is really a
>> question
>> > > of
>> > > > > > >> what is possible and/or what is likely with regard to
>> becoming.
>> > > What
>> > > > > > >> are the forms of life and forms of development that are
>> > > sustainable
>> > > > > > >> given the larger ecologies in which that development happens?
>> > > > > > >>
>> > > > > > >> And for thinking through that problem, I've had a hard time
>> > > thinking
>> > > > > > >> of anyone who has better thought through this problem than
>> Marx
>> > -
>> > > at
>> > > > > > >> the longer timescale of development, that is (Vygotsky
>> would, of
>> > > > > > >> course, be better at thinking through development at the
>> shorter
>> > > > > > >> timescale of ontogeny).
>> > > > > > >>
>> > > > > > >> I'd love to hear others' thoughts on those who have studied
>> > > > activities
>> > > > > > >> that can begin to shed light on these ecologies of
>> development
>> > > > > > >> (particularly at the longer timescale). Any
>> > thoughts/suggestions?
>> > > I
>> > > > > > >> would imagine this work considering various kinds of
>> > institutions
>> > > > that
>> > > > > > >> run the gamut - from venture capitalist firms to non-profits
>> to
>> > > > > > >> governmental institutions to institutions of higher
>> education. I
>> > > > would
>> > > > > > >> presume that each of these kinds of institutions would have a
>> > > local
>> > > > > > >> ecology within which they work, but I am tempted to imagine
>> some
>> > > > kind
>> > > > > > >> of global meta-ecology (perhaps Marx's "global
>> > > > > > >> capitalism"?) within which each of these local ecologies
>> > operates.
>> > > > I'd
>> > > > > > >> be curious about actual research that has been done
>> documenting
>> > > the
>> > > > > > >> nature of these ecologies - e.g., what kinds of resources are
>> > > > > > >> available to be exploited? What kinds of possibilities are
>> there
>> > > for
>> > > > > > >> different forms of life? What institutional organisms can
>> > thrive?
>> > > > > > >> Which are dying off? (and just to be clear, I am intending a
>> > > > > > >> biological/evolutionary nature of the metaphor).
>> > > > > > >>
>> > > > > > >> It seems that this kind of work would be most likely to have
>> > been
>> > > > done
>> > > > > > >> by folks in the CHAT world, but perhaps the scale (of time
>> and
>> > > > space)
>> > > > > > >> is a bit beyond the scales that CHAT folks prefer to
>> consider?
>> > > > > > >>
>> > > > > > >> (I should add that I've recently discovered the work of Peter
>> > > > > > >> Sloterdijk's Bubbles trilogy and am curious if anyone has any
>> > > > thoughts
>> > > > > > >> on the value of his approach - it seems to fit very well with
>> > Marx
>> > > > and
>> > > > > > >> with CHAT/Vygotsky, my only initial concern was that he
>> seems to
>> > > > fly a
>> > > > > > >> little fast and loose with pyschoanalytics at times - not a
>> > > serious
>> > > > > > >> problem, but perhaps in a few places).
>> > > > > > >>
>> > > > > > >> Sympathetically,
>> > > > > > >> greg
>> > > > > > >>
>> > > > > > >>
>> > > > > > >>
>> > > > > > >>
>> > > > > > >> On Tue, Feb 20, 2018 at 1:57 PM, Huw Lloyd <
>> > > > huw.softdesigns@gmail.com
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > >> wrote:
>> > > > > > >>
>> > > > > > >>> Well, I would say there is more to it than simply
>> > > transfer-ability,
>> > > > > > >>> which might be thought of as a good bureaucratic
>> requirement.
>> > > > Really
>> > > > > > >>> what is required is genuine development -- reorganisation of
>> > > > thought
>> > > > > > >>> and
>> > > > > > >> learning.
>> > > > > > >>> That is what is significant at a personal level, which is
>> also
>> > > the
>> > > > > > >>> basis
>> > > > > > >> of
>> > > > > > >>> insights and creative work (i.e. personal knowledge rather
>> than
>> > > > > > >>> second
>> > > > > > >> hand
>> > > > > > >>> knowledge). The researcher in the blog article does not
>> evince
>> > > this
>> > > > > > >>> (with allusions to the nature of her training). There is the
>> > > > history
>> > > > > > >>> school children learn, which largely concerns the use of
>> > memory,
>> > > > and
>> > > > > > >>> then there
>> > > > > > >> is
>> > > > > > >>> the history of conditions, relations and processes, which
>> > > concerns
>> > > > > > >>> protracted thought. This developmental emphasis is what is
>> > > lacking
>> > > > > > >>> in institutions which is why I have frequently pointed it
>> out.
>> > > > > > >>>
>> > > > > > >>> This principle apples to "secure" jobs too. The jobs I have
>> > > walked
>> > > > > > >>> away from have been due to the overly narrow scope, where I
>> > felt
>> > > it
>> > > > > > >>> was necessary to be far more ambitious to achieve modest
>> > > > > > >>> satisfaction, an ambition which included achieving the wider
>> > > scope
>> > > > > > >>> within the norms established. Similar issues pertain to my
>> > > > > > >>> peripheral engagement with academia. Twenty years ago, after
>> > > > > > >>> completing a masters in cognitive
>> > > > > > >> science
>> > > > > > >>> (a good year), I decided against pursuing any further formal
>> > > > > > >>> education
>> > > > > > >> with
>> > > > > > >>> any immediacy due to my sense that what I was encountering
>> in
>> > the
>> > > > > > >>> subject (and related subjects) was fundamentally wrong or
>> > > > > > >>> inadequate, but I couldn't quite discern what that was. So,
>> for
>> > > me,
>> > > > > > >>> I had no interest in furthering the academic course at the
>> > time,
>> > > > > > >>> because I was concerned with understanding, doing,
>> discovering
>> > > and
>> > > > > > >>> development, not being a "good researcher". I was and am
>> > > > > > >>> uninterested in the trappings of academia, what it looks
>> like
>> > > from
>> > > > > > >>> the outside (with dubious ethics of promoting those in
>> society
>> > > who
>> > > > > > >>> least need it) -- hence I am not too bothered about where
>> the
>> > > > > > >>> experiences come from. After all, if you want sound
>> knowledge
>> > > then
>> > > > > > >>> it should be validated in places where it counts (in
>> action),
>> > not
>> > > > in
>> > > > > > an echo chamber of words.
>> > > > > > >>>
>> > > > > > >>>> From my (developmental) perspective academia appears to be
>> > > > > > >>>> chockfull of
>> > > > > > >>> unproductive thinking. The lack of systems understanding in
>> the
>> > > > > > >>> social sciences (which has been pointed out by key persons
>> for
>> > > two
>> > > > > > >>> generations)
>> > > > > > >> I
>> > > > > > >>> find to be quite incredible. This, as far as I can see, is
>> the
>> > > > > > >>> panacea to the stasis and lethargy that I have seen in
>> certain
>> > > > > > >>> institutions, where there are people in secure jobs with no
>> > > > interest
>> > > > > > >>> in revitalising an institution (perhaps the same people who
>> > rely
>> > > > > > >>> upon their status for authority). In the UK, in the social
>> > > > sciences,
>> > > > > > >>> the whole social science infrastructure is built upon a
>> notion
>> > of
>> > > > > > >>> quality that is ignorant of systems -- that is the degree to
>> > > which
>> > > > > > >>> unproductive thinking has
>> > > > > > >> penetrated
>> > > > > > >>> social science.
>> > > > > > >>>
>> > > > > > >>> Yet there is much more to it still. Recently I have also
>> come
>> > to
>> > > a
>> > > > > > >>> surprising awareness that developmental prerogatives have
>> > rather
>> > > a
>> > > > > > >>> significant amount in common with spiritual ones. So I would
>> > > offer
>> > > > > > >> broader
>> > > > > > >>> advice than Michael's of staying clear of hardship. It may
>> be
>> > > that
>> > > > > > >>> in
>> > > > > > >> that
>> > > > > > >>> "nadir" something surprising may be discovered. For anyone
>> > with a
>> > > > > > >>> passion "job security" is not a goal, at best it is a means
>> to
>> > an
>> > > > > > >>> ends, at worst
>> > > > > > >> it
>> > > > > > >>> is an obstacle.
>> > > > > > >>>
>> > > > > > >>> Over and out. :)
>> > > > > > >>>
>> > > > > > >>> Best,
>> > > > > > >>> Huw
>> > > > > > >>>
>> > > > > > >>> On 20 February 2018 at 07:12, Alfredo Jornet Gil
>> > > > > > >>> <a.j.gil@iped.uio.no>
>> > > > > > >>> wrote:
>> > > > > > >>>
>> > > > > > >>>> Huw, Helena, and all,
>> > > > > > >>>>
>> > > > > > >>>> thanks to you both for taking the discussion where I was
>> > hoping
>> > > it
>> > > > > > >>>> to
>> > > > > > >> go
>> > > > > > >>>> further: first, towards a reflection on the nature of
>> training
>> > > > > > >>>> academic scholars go through as it concerns the classical
>> > > problem
>> > > > > > >>>> of learning "transfer"; and then, as it regards the
>> question
>> > of
>> > > > > > >>>> academic freedom
>> > > > > > >>> (which
>> > > > > > >>>> actually may be the same question, just taken in a language
>> > more
>> > > > > > >> adequate
>> > > > > > >>>> to an ecological understanding of the problem). This is
>> > > absolutely
>> > > > > > >>>> not
>> > > > > > >>> just
>> > > > > > >>>> an individual problem. And, on that matter, I should be
>> clear
>> > > that
>> > > > > > >>>> I
>> > > > > > >> am a
>> > > > > > >>>> privileged in a privileged land, where, despite all
>> > uncertainty
>> > > > > > >>>> and
>> > > > > > >> pains
>> > > > > > >>>> that my family have gone and go through, I have today a
>> good
>> > > > > > >>>> background
>> > > > > > >>> and
>> > > > > > >>>> network, and probably better prospects than the majority of
>> > > junior
>> > > > > > >>> scholars
>> > > > > > >>>> out there. Not that I have earned this privilege for
>> nothing:
>> > my
>> > > > > > >> migrant
>> > > > > > >>>> history and that of my family is all connected to an effort
>> > and
>> > > > > > >>>> quest
>> > > > > > >> to
>> > > > > > >>>> get better chances of academic opportunity in this market
>> > Helena
>> > > > > > >>>> talks about. But my personal story, as that of the
>> historian
>> > in
>> > > > > > >>>> the article shared or of my French astronomer friend, are
>> > > relevant
>> > > > > > >>>> in as far as
>> > > > > > >> they
>> > > > > > >>>> help us reflect on just those questions. They really also
>> make
>> > > one
>> > > > > > >> wonder
>> > > > > > >>>> on the sense of the term "academic freedom", for the latter
>> > term
>> > > > > > >>>> cannot
>> > > > > > >>> be
>> > > > > > >>>> about doing whatever research you want to do independently
>> of
>> > > some
>> > > > > > >> market
>> > > > > > >>>> conditions and societal needs and economy. We may then pose
>> > the
>> > > > > > >>> questions,
>> > > > > > >>>> what type of "freedom" is the "freedom" current systems (of
>> > > > > > >>>> incentives,
>> > > > > > >>> of
>> > > > > > >>>> ISI lists) afford, and what type of system could allow for
>> > > another
>> > > > > > >>> meaning
>> > > > > > >>>> of the term "freedom"?
>> > > > > > >>>>
>> > > > > > >>>> Not to get too abstract, I guess that those reflections
>> may be
>> > > > > > >>>> best pondered along concrete cases, if people is willing to
>> > take
>> > > > > > >>>> on Helena's suggestion to share particular stories of all
>> that
>> > > > > > >>>> goes into getting
>> > > > > > >> into
>> > > > > > >>>> secured academic job positions, or else, of pursuing
>> > > (in)dependent
>> > > > > > >>> careers
>> > > > > > >>>> outside/at the borders of/across academia.
>> > > > > > >>>>
>> > > > > > >>>> Alfredo
>> > > > > > >>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>
>> > > > > > >>>> ________________________________________
>> > > > > > >>>> From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> > > > > > >>>> <xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> > > > > > >>>
>> > > > > > >>>> on behalf of Helena Worthen <helenaworthen@gmail.com>
>> > > > > > >>>> Sent: 19 February 2018 19:19
>> > > > > > >>>> To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity
>> > > > > > >>>> Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: (non)grieving scholarship
>> > > > > > >>>>
>> > > > > > >>>> In the interests of widening the discussion:
>> > > > > > >>>>
>> > > > > > >>>> I’ve described my work history before on this list —
>> > basically,
>> > > > > > >>>> moving from teaching literature and writing (with
>> stopovers in
>> > > > > > >>>> landscape architecture and theater production) to concern
>> > about
>> > > > > > >>>> the working conditions of teachers, especially academics in
>> > > higher
>> > > > > > >>>> education, the
>> > > > > > >> 75%
>> > > > > > >>>> who are contingent/adjuncts. The concern is both for the
>> > people
>> > > > > > >> employed
>> > > > > > >>>> this way and for the integrity of the institutions that
>> employ
>> > > > > > >>>> them. I eventually engaged this concern by working with and
>> > for
>> > > > > > >>>> the labor
>> > > > > > >>> movement,
>> > > > > > >>>> ending up first working for the garment/apparel workers
>> union
>> > in
>> > > > > > >>>> Philadelphia and then at the Labor Educaiton Program at
>> the U
>> > of
>> > > > > > >>> Illinois,
>> > > > > > >>>> from which I retired in 2010.
>> > > > > > >>>>
>> > > > > > >>>> The new twist to this story is about the employment of
>> > academics
>> > > > > > >>>> on short-term contracts in Viet Nam, under conditions that
>> > seem
>> > > to
>> > > > > > >>>> be increasingly frequent in the “developing” world, where
>> the
>> > > > > > >>>> market for education is booming. University World News
>> > > http://www
>> > > > .
>> > > > > > >>>> universityworldnews.com/  tracks this phenomenon and
>> includes
>> > > > > > >> occasinal
>> > > > > > >>>> critical articles about the competition for rankings. The
>> > > > > > >>>> university
>> > > > > > >>> where
>> > > > > > >>>> my husband and I have been teaching on and off since 2015,
>> Ton
>> > > Duc
>> > > > > > >> Thang
>> > > > > > >>> in
>> > > > > > >>>> Ho Chi Minh City, recruits professors from all over the
>> world
>> > > with
>> > > > > > >>>> a promise of $2,000 per month US — but extending their
>> > contracts
>> > > > > > >>>> depends
>> > > > > > >> on
>> > > > > > >>>> producing articles published in journals on the ISI list;
>> the
>> > > > > > >>>> nature of this list is worth taking a look at. The impact
>> of
>> > > this
>> > > > > > >>>> practice on the culture and student body is not all bad.
>> > > > > > >>>>
>> > > > > > >>>> My point here is to place the issue of the challenge of
>> > getting
>> > > a
>> > > > > > >>>> tenure-track job in a global context. This is not just an
>> > > > > > >>>> individual problem.
>> > > > > > >>>>
>> > > > > > >>>> I’m willing to go further down this line of discussion.
>> > However,
>> > > > > > >>> academics
>> > > > > > >>>> are often reluctant to reveal and compare their working
>> > > conditions
>> > > > > > >>>> on
>> > > > > > >> an
>> > > > > > >>>> “academic” discussion list. Maybe by putting up the issue
>> of
>> > > what
>> > > > > > >>> academic
>> > > > > > >>>> freedom requires, and how these requirements fare in the
>> > global
>> > > > > > >>>> market
>> > > > > > >>> for
>> > > > > > >>>> higher education, we can shed the embarassment of revealing
>> > > > > > >>>> information about our own experiences with getting the
>> brass
>> > > ring
>> > > > > > >>>> of a full-time, secure job.
>> > > > > > >>>>
>> > > > > > >>>> Let’s see if anyone picks up on this. Maybe I’m being too
>> > vague.
>> > > > > > >>>>
>> > > > > > >>>> Helena Worthen
>> > > > > > >>>> helenaworthen@gmail.com
>> > > > > > >>>> Berkeley, CA 94707 510-828-2745
>> > > > > > >>>> Blog US/ Viet Nam:
>> > > > > > >>>> helenaworthen.wordpress.com
>> > > > > > >>>> skype: helena.worthen1
>> > > > > > >>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>> On Feb 19, 2018, at 9:19 AM, Huw Lloyd
>> > > > > > >>>>> <huw.softdesigns@gmail.com>
>> > > > > > >>>> wrote:
>> > > > > > >>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>> The article describes accumulating large amounts of
>> knowledge
>> > > > > > >>> pertaining
>> > > > > > >>>> to
>> > > > > > >>>>> history, which (the author maintains) cannot be turned to
>> > other
>> > > > > > >>>> endeavours.
>> > > > > > >>>>> This, no doubt, is true for her. If, however, her
>> approach to
>> > > > > > >> studying
>> > > > > > >>>>> history had been systemic, then there would have been a
>> > > powerful
>> > > > > > >>>>> form
>> > > > > > >>> of
>> > > > > > >>>>> re-application and continuity in any work that was turned
>> to.
>> > > > > > >>>>> Perhaps
>> > > > > > >>> the
>> > > > > > >>>>> same can be said for "phd/postdoc training". If it cannot
>> be
>> > > > > > >>>>> reused
>> > > > > > >> or
>> > > > > > >>>>> isn't enabling, what, substantively, is it?
>> > > > > > >>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>> Best,
>> > > > > > >>>>> Huw
>> > > > > > >>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>> On 18 February 2018 at 18:32, Alfredo Jornet Gil <
>> > > > > > >> a.j.gil@iped.uio.no>
>> > > > > > >>>>> wrote:
>> > > > > > >>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>> Really inspiring words and work, Francine. I do see
>> > community
>> > > > > > >> colleges
>> > > > > > >>>> and
>> > > > > > >>>>>> many other educational settings apart from universities
>> as
>> > > > > > >>>>>> really
>> > > > > > >>>> valuable
>> > > > > > >>>>>> and exciting opportunities; the PhD and following postdoc
>> > etc
>> > > > > > >> training
>> > > > > > >>>> in
>> > > > > > >>>>>> universities, however, tend to be very much targeted
>> > towards a
>> > > > > > >>>>>> very
>> > > > > > >>>> narrow
>> > > > > > >>>>>> spectrum of positions, or at least that's been my
>> > experience.
>> > > I
>> > > > > > >>>>>> am
>> > > > > > >>> very
>> > > > > > >>>>>> happy that this thread may widen that scope and make
>> visible
>> > > > > > >>>>>> other
>> > > > > > >>>> paths.
>> > > > > > >>>>>> And as Mike suggested, it would be very interesting to
>> hear
>> > > > > > >>>>>> from
>> > > > > > >>> several
>> > > > > > >>>>>> others who have followed distinct trajectories apart from
>> > the
>> > > > > > >>>>>> phd-postdoc-assist/assoc. prof-prof, and yet made a
>> career
>> > in
>> > > > > > >>>>>> touch
>> > > > > > >>> with
>> > > > > > >>>>>> most of what was developed in the junior (phd and few
>> later)
>> > > > > years.
>> > > > > > >>>>>> Thanks!
>> > > > > > >>>>>> Alfredo
>> > > > > > >>>>>> ________________________________________
>> > > > > > >>>>>> From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> > > > > <xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.
>> > > > > > >>> edu>
>> > > > > > >>>>>> on behalf of Larry Smolucha <lsmolucha@hotmail.com>
>> > > > > > >>>>>> Sent: 18 February 2018 06:20
>> > > > > > >>>>>> To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity
>> > > > > > >>>>>> Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: (non)grieving scholarship
>> > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>> Message from Francine Smolucha on a scholar's life with
>> or
>> > > > > > >>>>>> without
>> > > > > > >>>> academia
>> > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>> Alfredo,
>> > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>> There are other jobs that pay well (sometimes with tenure
>> > and
>> > > > > > >>>>>> early retirement benefits) - besides professorships at
>> four
>> > > > > > >>>>>> year colleges
>> > > > > > >>> and
>> > > > > > >>>>>> universities.  Administrative and support staff positions
>> > pay
>> > > > > well.
>> > > > > > >>> And
>> > > > > > >>>>>> don't overlook community colleges, technical colleges,
>> and
>> > > > > > >>>>>> public
>> > > > > > >>> grade
>> > > > > > >>>>>> schools and high schools. There is also the private
>> sector
>> > and
>> > > > > > >>>> government
>> > > > > > >>>>>> jobs.
>> > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>> As a 'low status' community college professor, I managed
>> to
>> > > > > > >> translate
>> > > > > > >>>>>> Vygotsky's
>> > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>> overlooked writings on creativity (back in the 1980's)
>> and
>> > > > > > >> introduced
>> > > > > > >>>> his
>> > > > > > >>>>>> theory of creativity to academia.  I got early
>> retirement at
>> > > > > > >>>>>> age 53
>> > > > > > >>> and
>> > > > > > >>>>>> continue to write and publish. While my Ph.D from the
>> > > > > > >>>>>> University of
>> > > > > > >>>> Chicago
>> > > > > > >>>>>> gave me academic bona fides, it was the quality of the
>> > > > > > >>>>>> scholarly
>> > > > > > >> work
>> > > > > > >>>> that
>> > > > > > >>>>>> ultimately mattered.
>> > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>> I was always inspired by the harsh circumstances of
>> > Vygotsky's
>> > > > > > >>>>>> life
>> > > > > > >>> and
>> > > > > > >>>>>> how he still kept on writing.
>> > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>> [When I felt really sorry for myself, I would actually
>> say
>> > > > > > >>>>>> "Well at
>> > > > > > >>>> least
>> > > > > > >>>>>> I am not coughing up blood"]
>> > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>> So many of his works were not published in his lifetime,
>> he
>> > > did
>> > > > > not
>> > > > > > >>>>>> collect a royalties check, and    they say he was
>> depressed
>> > at
>> > > > the
>> > > > > > >> end
>> > > > > > >>>> of
>> > > > > > >>>>>> his life.
>> > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>> I leave you with this quote from an ancient Sufi mystic -
>> > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>> You can't always get what you want but you can get what
>> you
>> > > > > > >>>>>> need
>> > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>> .
>> > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>> ________________________________
>> > > > > > >>>>>> From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> > > > > <xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.
>> > > > > > >>> edu>
>> > > > > > >>>>>> on behalf of mike cole <mcole@ucsd.edu>
>> > > > > > >>>>>> Sent: Saturday, February 17, 2018 7:07 PM
>> > > > > > >>>>>> To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity
>> > > > > > >>>>>> Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: (non)grieving scholarship
>> > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>> Yours is a quandary shared by your generation, Alfredo.
>> > > > > > >>>>>> Being allowed to teach and conduct research in a quality
>> > > > > > >>>>>> institution
>> > > > > > >>> is
>> > > > > > >>>> a
>> > > > > > >>>>>> great privilege and an
>> > > > > > >>>>>> increasingly rarer possibility.
>> > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>> There are several people on this list who have organized
>> > their
>> > > > > > >>>>>> lives
>> > > > > > >>> to
>> > > > > > >>>> be
>> > > > > > >>>>>> independent scholars
>> > > > > > >>>>>> while staying connected to the core institutions of
>> > > > > > >>>>>> disciplinary
>> > > > > > >>>> training.
>> > > > > > >>>>>> It might be nice to hear
>> > > > > > >>>>>> the variety out there.
>> > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>> It appears pretty certain that the situation is going to
>> get
>> > > > > > >>>>>> worse before/if it gets better.
>> > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>> What can the collective experience of xmca come up with
>> that
>> > > > > > >>>>>> would
>> > > > > > >> be
>> > > > > > >>>>>> useful to the many
>> > > > > > >>>>>> of you caught in this meat grinder?
>> > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>> mike
>> > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>> On Sat, Feb 17, 2018 at 4:49 PM, Alfredo Jornet Gil <
>> > > > > > >>>> a.j.gil@iped.uio.no>
>> > > > > > >>>>>> wrote:
>> > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>>> Good luck then, Wagner!
>> > > > > > >>>>>>> A
>> > > > > > >>>>>>> ________________________________________
>> > > > > > >>>>>>> From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu
>> > > > > > >> <xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.
>> > > > > > >>> edu
>> > > > > > >>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>>> on behalf of Wagner Luiz Schmit <
>> wagner.schmit@gmail.com>
>> > > > > > >>>>>>> Sent: 18 February 2018 01:07
>> > > > > > >>>>>>> To: eXtended Mind, Culture Activity
>> > > > > > >>>>>>> Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: (non)grieving scholarship
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>>> This just hit me in the spot...
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>>> Wagner
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>>> On Feb 17, 2018 9:48 PM, "Alfredo Jornet Gil"
>> > > > > > >>>>>>> <a.j.gil@iped.uio.no
>> > > > > > >>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>> wrote:
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> I have not been able to contribute to this list as
>> much as
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> I'd
>> > > > > > >> like
>> > > > > > >>> to
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> lately, among other things, because I need to find a
>> job,
>> > > and
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> I
>> > > > > > >> need
>> > > > > > >>>> to
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> make sure that I have checked all those boxes that
>> > selection
>> > > > > > >>>> committees
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> will check (enough first-authored publications? in good
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> enough
>> > > > > > >>>>>> journals?
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> enough leadership in projects? teaching? supervising?
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> acquiring
>> > > > > > >>> funds?
>> > > > > > >>>>>>> more
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> than all others candidates? and more than
>> > > > > > >>> favoured-for-whatever-other-
>> > > > > > >>>>>>> reasons
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> candidates?). So I have been doing all I can these
>> weeks
>> > to
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> fill
>> > > > > > >> up
>> > > > > > >>> a
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> competitive CV, for my contract is about to expire.
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> And, although I did not think that it was particularly
>> > well
>> > > > > > >> written,
>> > > > > > >>>> it
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> was both relieving and discouraging to read this
>> article
>> > > (see
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> link
>> > > > > > >>>>>> below,
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> which I take from the facebook wall of a colleague who
>> I
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> think
>> > > > > > >> also
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> subscribes this list). The article makes visible the
>> pain
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> scholars
>> > > > > > >>> go
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> through when, after so many years of digging and
>> digging
>> > and
>> > > > > > >>> digging a
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> little (but deep!) hole, may after all have to leave it
>> > and
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> find
>> > > > > > >>> some
>> > > > > > >>>>>>> other
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> thing to do. In Canada, I met a French astronomer who
>> was
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> moving
>> > > > > > >>>>>> through
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> the world with his lovely family, short-term project
>> after
>> > > > > > >>> short-term
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> project, getting better and better at what he worked on
>> > > > > > >> (apparently
>> > > > > > >>> he
>> > > > > > >>>>>>> was
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> among the few who had expertise in computer modeling
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> simulating
>> > > > > > >> some
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> astronomic events) , and finally having to step out
>> > academia
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> last
>> > > > > > >>> year
>> > > > > > >>>>>> to
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> find something else to do, for his family no longer
>> could
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> stand
>> > > > > > >> the
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> constant uncertainty and travelling. It could be me
>> soon.
>> > > And
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> that
>> > > > > > >>> may
>> > > > > > >>>>>>> not
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> be a bad thing, or even a thing in itself, but the
>> story
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> seems to
>> > > > > > >> be
>> > > > > > >>>>>>> quite
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> endemic to academia and may be interesting to some of
>> you:
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> https://www.chronicle.com/article/Why-Everybody-Loses-
>> > > When/24
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> 2560
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> Alfredo
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>
>> > > > > > >>>>
>> > > > > > >>>
>> > > > > > >>
>> > > > > > >>
>> > > > > > >>
>> > > > > > >> --
>> > > > > > >> Gregory A. Thompson, Ph.D.
>> > > > > > >> Assistant Professor
>> > > > > > >> Department of Anthropology
>> > > > > > >> 880 Spencer W. Kimball Tower
>> > > > > > >> Brigham Young University
>> > > > > > >> Provo, UT 84602
>> > > > > > >> WEBSITE: greg.a.thompson.byu.edu
>> > > > > > >> http://byu.academia.edu/GregoryThompson
>> > > > > > >>
>> > > > > > >
>> > > > > > >
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > > > --
>> > > > > Gregory A. Thompson, Ph.D.
>> > > > > Assistant Professor
>> > > > > Department of Anthropology
>> > > > > 880 Spencer W. Kimball Tower
>> > > > > Brigham Young University
>> > > > > Provo, UT 84602
>> > > > > WEBSITE: greg.a.thompson.byu.edu
>> > > > > http://byu.academia.edu/GregoryThompson
>> > > > >
>> > > >
>> > >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > Gregory A. Thompson, Ph.D.
>> > Assistant Professor
>> > Department of Anthropology
>> > 880 Spencer W. Kimball Tower
>> > Brigham Young University
>> > Provo, UT 84602
>> > WEBSITE: greg.a.thompson.byu.edu
>> > http://byu.academia.edu/GregoryThompson
>> >
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Gregory A. Thompson, Ph.D.
> Assistant Professor
> Department of Anthropology
> 880 Spencer W. Kimball Tower
> Brigham Young University
> Provo, UT 84602
> WEBSITE: greg.a.thompson.byu.edu
> http://byu.academia.edu/GregoryThompson
>

-- 
Gregory A. Thompson, Ph.D.
Assistant Professor
Department of Anthropology
880 Spencer W. Kimball Tower
Brigham Young University
Provo, UT 84602
WEBSITE: greg.a.thompson.byu.edu
http://byu.academia.edu/GregoryThompson