[Xmca-l] Re: units of analysis? LSV versus ANL

[Huw Lloyd]

The ANL's translation was:

"The child, therefore, appears before us primarily as a subject of the
mate- rial process of life. In the process of his development, he
encounters ready- made, historically established conditions that determine
his existence as a social being. Among these conditions, he encounters the
fact of language, which is the medium of the “spiritual relations”
established with it and con- stitutes an essential condition for the
development of his social and intellec- tual consciousness. Thus,
Vygotsky’s proposition that consciousness is a product of the child’s
verbal communication under conditions of his activity and in relation to
the material reality that surrounds him must be turned around: the
consciousness of a child is a product of his human activity in relation to
objective reality, taking place *under conditions of language* and under
conditions of verbal communication."

You (Martin) wrote:

> I see a difference, Huw. I just don't see the difference that the
> difference makes.  And ANL cannot be correct: for one thing, in various
> texts LSV writes about the character of consciousness in preverbal
> children, and of how consciousness  is transformed by the acquisition of
> language. This would hardly be possible if language were a necessary
> condition for consciousness.


So you're saying: That transformation of consciousness would not be
possible if language were a necessary condition for consciousness.

ANL is asserting that LSV is not being coherent in this paper with respect
to materialist formulations.  He is saying that it is weak.  He is also
saying that the word is not the source of consciousness.  So what are
saying that ANL cannot be right about?

Best,
Huw