[Xmca-l] Re: L2

[Martin John Packer]

To me, one important question would be what SCT is able to tell us about instruction in L2, over and above instruction in general.

Carol, I think I explained that this weekend I have had online access to no more than abstracts, except for two chapters that I already had on hand, and which I was referring to. However, if an article contains a bright new idea it really ought to be in the abstract, no?

Martin

On Nov 3, 2014, at 8:40 AM, Carol Macdonald <carolmacdon@gmail.com> wrote:

> Martin
> 
> You paint with a broad brush here: ELL is a fast growing field today,
> because "Biligual Education" has a wide range of situations/niches which
> other people have said here. (It nearly has encyclapedia status).  I do L1
> and L2 work here in Southern Africa (Grades 1-7) and one of very few
> privileged enough to be able to do it.  Even in such similar cultures as
> Namibia and South Africa there are very different perceptions about English
> as Second Language and ways of talking about it.
> 
> I think you must look at what you said - who is going to deliver their
> bright new idea in an abstract? You have to surmise that they do, because
> their concepts (small c) are in place. (We fail people here who only quote
> abstracts...).  So head to the hardcopy, comrade brother.
> 
> Having delivered my sermon, I find the SCT of ESL very disappointing. It
> seems like they are just pinning new labels on things they already knew.
> But if we have a fellow practitioner among us, please do speak up. I
> remember when I first started working on CHAT in language education in the
> late eighties, I felt I was pinning labels.
> 
> Carol
> 
> On 3 November 2014 13:50, Martin John Packer <mpacker@uniandes.edu.co>
> wrote:
> 
>> Hi David,
>> 
>> I have to teach a class on second language learning this week in my course
>> in Psychology of Language, so I've turned to Lantolf. My university library
>> webpage has been down for maintenance this weekend so I've had limited
>> access to his writing, but what I have been able to read has confused me.
>> In a couple of articles I find reasonable summaries of LSV's ideas, but
>> then Lantolf doesn't get around to applying these ideas to L2! Looking at
>> abstracts in Google Scholar it seems that he's proposing that (1) L2 is
>> learned in the ZPD (what isn't?), (2) L2 is a mediator (what isn't?), and
>> (3) private speech occurs in L2 (okay, that could be interesting). I was
>> expecting him to attribute some role to L2 in the higher functions, or to
>> suggest that L2 mediates in a specific way, or...
>> 
>> What am I missing?
>> 
>> Plus, I have a growing suspicion that most L2 research is conducted on
>> people willingly studying a foreign language in the classroom. Not much, or
>> nothing, on people who are forced to abandon their mother tongue because
>> they live somewhere where school, and/or work, is available only if they
>> speak a dominant language. I'm hoping you'll tell me I'm wrong about this!
>> 
>> Martin
>> 
>> 
>> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Carol A  Macdonald Ph D (Edin)
> Developmental psycholinguist
> Academic, Researcher,  and Editor
> Honorary Research Fellow: Department of Linguistics, Unisa