[Xmca-l] Re: vygotsky's theory and symbolic interactionism

Tue Apr 1 18:27:46 PDT 2014

An interesting article. But language is controlling only when it is invisible. Yielding to the power of language to control beliefs and recall, to trigger associations and prime opinions (the latter a much-practiced art in our poll-saturated world), the thing I take away from Dr. Boroditsky's paper is the degree to which (contra Saussure and the stronger version of Sapir-Whorf) language bends, even as it shapes. 

I am playing around of course. But that is one of the things that is the mark (I think) of a certain degree of freedom, even in the bars of existing narratives, myths, words, and genres. That is for me what makes the Krazy Kat cartoons (one of which I linked to in a preceding response) a source of inspiration.

Having played in the library and classroom, I will leave you to your deeper play....

Cheers,
Doug

________________________________
 From: mike cole <lchcmike@gmail.com>
To: "eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity" <xmca-l@mailman.ucsd.edu> 
Sent: Tuesday, April 1, 2014 3:56 PM
Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: vygotsky's theory and symbolic interactionism

A followup on this bit of lint from the thread that led us to
language/thought.
The attached article is a summary of a lot of work by Lera Borditzky who is
here at UCSD. Her website is full of interesting articles, but this brief
one from Scientific American seems relevant to Michael's post concerning
language/labelling and dual stimulation. As time permits!
mike
http://psych.stanford.edu/~lera/papers/sci-am-2011.pdf

On Tue, Apr 1, 2014 at 8:27 AM, mike cole <lchcmike@gmail.com> wrote:

> Michael/Paul--- Wouldn't Vygotsky say, invoking the notion of dual
> stimulation, that if you mediate your action through a label (a cultural
> artifact par excellance) you not only act differently toward the other but
> are yourself changed (in fact, more or less literally, your position with
> respect to the other is changed) as you subordinate yourself to this "tool"
> and control yourself "from the outside" ??
>
> Greg has been writing about positioning and labelling.
>
> Vis a vis symbolic interactionism.  Kenneth Burke seems to me a productive
> person to think with. See below.
>
> mike
>
> mike
>
>
> On Tue, Apr 1, 2014 at 7:24 AM, Dr. Paul C. Mocombe <
> pmocombe@mocombeian.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi michael...yes I have checked into labeling theory...it is in doing so
>> that I cam across the similarities between vygotsky and mead
>>
>>
>> Dr. Paul C. Mocombe
>> President
>> The Mocombeian Foundation, Inc.
>> www.mocombeian.com
>> www.readingroomcurriculum.com
>> www.paulcmocombe.info
>>
>> <div>-------- Original message --------</div><div>From: "Glassman,
>> Michael" <glassman.13@osu.edu> </div><div>Date:04/01/2014  9:08 AM
>>  (GMT-05:00) </div><div>To: "eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity" <
>> xmca-l@mailman.ucsd.edu> </div><div>Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: vygotsky's
>> theory and symbolic interactionism </div><div>
>> </div>Paul,
>>
>> I think your view of symbolic interactionism (as related to Mead) as
>> being a tool of power and domination is more reflective of Mead's theory
>> than you might think.  Have you looked at labeling theory?  Also a
>> trajectory taken by Mead's students which seems pretty close to what you
>> want to day.  I'm not sure what role Vygotsky would play in this.
>>
>> Michael
>> ________________________________________
>> From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu [xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu]
>> on behalf of Dr. Paul C. Mocombe [pmocombe@mocombeian.com]
>> Sent: Tuesday, April 01, 2014 5:58 AM
>> To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity; Mike Cole
>> Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: vygotsky's theory and symbolic interactionism
>>
>> At the heart of vygotsky's and mead's work is hegels master/slave
>> dialectic as they apply it to the constitution of identity, I.e.
>> Consciousness...As though there is no consciousness/identity prior to
>> socialization via language and symbolic interaction.  This is similar to
>> the identitarian logic of frankfurt school logician theodor adorno.  I have
>> a problem with that as I view language and symbolic interaction as always
>> an element of power and domination.  In essence my research question is,
>> "is there a sui generis consciousness that exist prior to
>> socialization/domination by symbols and language.  Haitian metaphysics says
>> yes...it exists at the subatomic particle level and is just as real as the
>> i and me of language and symbolic interaction.  Zora Neale hurston in her
>> ethnographic field work in haiti was attempting to theorize about this in
>> her literature...it is the essence of who we are.  I may have to go into
>> the realm of physics to make sense of this metaphysical logic.
>>
>>
>> Dr. Paul C. Mocombe
>> President
>> The Mocombeian Foundation, Inc.
>> www.mocombeian.com
>> www.readingroomcurriculum.com
>> www.paulcmocombe.info
>>
>> <div>-------- Original message --------</div><div>From: Greg Thompson <
>> greg.a.thompson@gmail.com> </div><div>Date:03/31/2014  11:53 PM
>> (GMT-05:00) </div><div>To: Mike Cole <lchcmike@gmail.com>,"eXtended
>> Mind, Culture, Activity" <xmca-l@mailman.ucsd.edu> </div><div>Subject:
>> [Xmca-l] Re: vygotsky's theory and symbolic interactionism </div><div>
>> </div>Paul,
>> And another piece you might be interested in:
>> Winter, J. A. and Goldfield, E. C. (1991), Caregiver-Child Interaction in
>> the Development of Self: The Contributions of Vygotsky, Bruner, and Kaye
>> to
>> Mead's Theory. Symbolic Interaction, 14: 433-447.
>> doi: 10.1525/si.1991.14.4.433
>>
>> I suspect a Hegelian/Marxian root is shared between Vygotsky and Mead.
>> Mead
>> said at one point that his social psychology was an attempt to do what
>> Hegel did, with the hopes that it would be "less incorrigible." I have the
>> exact quote somewhere if you're interested.
>>
>> The Vygotsky-Hegel connections have been much debated here on XMCA, but it
>> seems that there is good reason to think that Vygotsky would have been
>> influenced by Hegel, whether directly or indirectly (quick duck - I think
>> they'll be some words flying soon in defense of one side or the other of
>> this argument...).
>>
>> I'm interested in this intersection as well, more in terms of links and
>> complementarities with Goffman and Vygotsky, but I'm happy to chat about
>> the Mead/Vygotsky link.
>>
>> -greg
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Mar 31, 2014 at 5:53 PM, mike cole <lchcmike@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> > Anne Edwards has an article on this topic in *The Cambridge Companion to
>> > Vygotsky".
>> >
>> > I have inquired of Anne, and would of anyone interested, to understand
>> > where the concept of culture appears in the Meadian framework.
>> >
>> > mike
>> >
>> >
>> > On Mon, Mar 31, 2014 at 1:09 PM, Dr. Paul C. Mocombe <
>> > pmocombe@mocombeian.com> wrote:
>> >
>> > > I am working on a paper comparing and contrasting george herbert
>> mead's
>> > > symbolic interactionism with
>> > > vygotsky's theory....any suggestions anyone?
>> > >
>> > > Dr. Paul C. Mocombe
>> > > President
>> > > The Mocombeian Foundation, Inc.
>> > > www.mocombeian.com
>> > > www.readingroomcurriculum.com
>> > > www.paulcmocombe.info
>> > >
>> > > Race and Class Distinctions within Black Communities
>> > > www.routledge.com/9780415714372
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Gregory A. Thompson, Ph.D.
>> Assistant Professor
>> Department of Anthropology
>> 883 Spencer W. Kimball Tower
>> Brigham Young University
>> Provo, UT 84602
>> http://byu.academia.edu/GregoryThompson
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>