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[Xmca-l] Re: Trump's speech and Perezhivanie



Greg,

As Marc has made clear, we can talk about perezhivanie with reference to Trump's capture of the Presidency at several different levels.

I chose to interpret the directions very literally and discussed listening to the Inauguration Speech as an experience, that is, as one of innumerable perezhivaniya in my life through which my view on things has been formed. As Helena points out, listening to this speech would be a different experience for men and women who live with industrial decline, and have been humiliated countless times by professionals like Hillary picking on their way of speaking. But this speech is only one moment in an experience for them which will be decades long. It is doubtful if this Speech will be a very significant moment in the perezhivanie of a Trump voter. The crucial moment will be some incident when suddenly the whole episode takes on a new meaning, perhaps betrayal, perhaps life-changing redemption, who can tell?

The perezhivanie of listening to Trump's speech is not going to be a fully developed perezhivanie because if you knew he was a conman what you heard only confirmed that; if you thought he was the saviour of the nation, the Speech confirms that too. It is the experience which does not confirm but overthrows one's view which belong to perezhivanie. Such a moment (e.g. the announcement from the medical professional that you do not have access to the procedure needed to save your life) is not in itself the perezhivanie, which includes the process of digesting this news and re-organising your life accordingly.

There is, as Mike referred to, also the issue of a collective perezhivanie, of the entire nation discovering what Trump's election is all about and overcoming it. Give America a decade or so. The Vietnam War is something comparable, I think.

Andy

------------------------------------------------------------
Andy Blunden
http://home.mira.net/~andy
http://www.brill.com/products/book/origins-collective-decision-making
On 22/01/2017 6:21 PM, Greg Thompson wrote:
Loving everything I'm seeing on facebook about the marches today around the
country and around the world. Really inspiring stuff, particularly after
what happened yesterday. And yes, there is a feeling, a mood here that
gives me great hope. (and thanks Peg for the sign slogan, I posted it to my
fb page).

But back to the nasty business that Alfredo proposed we deal with, here is
a description of some of Mr. Trump's words:
"Mr. Trump on Friday described the nation as a landscape of “rusted-out
factories scattered like tombstones” and inner cities infested with crime,
gangs and drugs."
I wonder, for whom might this resonate?

Similarly, who would accept the premise of this statement:
"The American carnage stops right here and stops right now,"
I fear that this is striking a nerve with many people's perezhivanie
abuilding over the past 10 years or so (I'm still a little unsure of how
best to use perezhivanie, help please). Anyway, I'm still wondering about
the circumstances and experiences of Trump sympathizers. Some of you out
there must have some first-hand contact with such folks.

But perhaps this is getting too far afield from CHAT since it seems like it
starts to get into an area of communication theory called Media Ecology -
the media environments of people in various places (The problem of the
(media) environment?).

Alfredo, Peg, Helena, Andy, maybe you guys can give us some advice about
how to go about treating Trump's speech in a CHAT kind of way? How to
proceed with this endeavor?

-greg




On Sat, Jan 21, 2017 at 9:48 PM, Helena Worthen <helenaworthen@gmail.com>
wrote:

Hello -

I hope we pause and consider Alfredo’s suggestion.  Thank you, Alfredo for
the phrase “gut feeling of true tragedy.” Can we work with that?

How, given the xmca medium of long-chain texts from voices all over the
world, would we carry out such a project? Let me see if I can say Alfredo’s
proposal in my own words: to read Trump’s speech at his inauguration and
ask, “Who could find this speech hopeful, inspiring, uplifting, comforting?
Who would listen to it and think, ‘I am glad I voted for this man and I am
glad he is my President.’”  But also ask, “Who could find this speech
horrifying and frightening? This man Trump is lying to us all and I am sick
to think that he is my President.” The social situation — like the
alcoholic mother in the case with the three children each with a different
perezvhanie - is the same for both people who are listening to the speech,
but the people (like the children) respond differently.

This sounds to me like a project for going out and finding strangers to
talk with. Thank you, Greg, for bringing attention to Arlie Hochschild's
book, Strangers in their Own Land. I have only read the first chapter of
it, but I think this is what she is trying to do: give us insight into the
person who might find the inauguration speech something other than a case
of a celebrity clown practicing The Big Lie.

Joe and I spent today at the Women’s March in Oakland, California. The
police estimated 60,000 people there. Although there was supposed to be
first a march and then a rally, there were too many people to fit into the
streets between the starting point of the march and the destination, so
many marchers never got to the end. However, that didn’t seem to be a
problem. there were all kinds of small (200 person) gatherings going on all
over the place. The mood was cheerful, mainstream, determined, friendly —
tremendous variety of signs including the one that Peg saw in DC about
regulating women’s bodies but not corporations. I actually feel better
right now than I did yesterday at this time. There sure were a lot of us
out there. So my perezvhanie has been expanded by a day on the street.

Helena


Helena Worthen
helenaworthen@gmail.com
Berkeley, CA 94707
Blog about US and Viet Nam: helenaworthen.wordpress.com



On Jan 21, 2017, at 5:47 PM, Greg Thompson <greg.a.thompson@gmail.com>
wrote:
Alfredo,
I find this to be a fantastic suggestion.

One interesting analysis that helps us understand the
circumstances/context
in which many people experience Trump's speech as beautiful, even
hopeful,
is this book:
http://thenewpress.com/books/strangers-their-own-land

Democracy Now did a nice interview with her as well:
https://www.democracynow.org/2016/9/28/what_drives_trump_
supporters_sociologist_arlie
In the book (and the interview) Hochschild engages with, among others,
the
question of why someone who has had been directly deleteriously affected
by
the impact of fracking and oil production would support politicians who
are
against government regulation of those industries. She appears to deal
with
the situation very thoughtfully and compassionately, helping those of us
who can't understand Trump supporters see how they might have a different
experience of what Trump has to say.

Hopefully this doesn't take too far off track, but seems relevant to
really
consider the circumstances of Trump supporters in order to understand
their
experiences.

Just a thought.

-greg



On Sat, Jan 21, 2017 at 6:29 PM, <lpscholar2@gmail.com> wrote:

Alfredo,
I will share an impression I had as I listened to a particular group
being
interviewed who were inspired by the Trump speech.
The group were ‘the biker’s for Trump’. I asked what symbolic form they
were inhabiting or living out? The answer i came up with was the modern
symbolic of being ‘On the Road Again’ and distancing from the perceived
limitations of social con/striction. Then Thelma and Louise came to
mind.
Now how does this modern American cultural imaginary of being on the
road
again  inter/sect with Trump’s speech.
Trump said now there is only the future. No doubling back. The form
changes, but there is a deeper (layered) imaginary being expressed that
is
shared between the biker’s for Trump and Trump’s speech. This symbolic
(taking multiple forms) is profoundly anti-historical in rhetoric. It
creates ‘dramatic places’ in which people ‘fall into’ and become
animated
and encouraged and re-enchanted and re-vitalized. There is a re/lease
from
perceived constraints.

Alfredo, My impression watching the inauguration and the motivating
dramatic place Trump opens for some while sending a shudder down the
spine
for others. The myth of escape from the shackles of history runs deep
as a
symbolic imaginary that takes multiple ‘forms’ in the American dream.

This is only one quick pass through as an impression.

Sent from my Windows 10 phone

From: Alfredo Jornet Gil
Sent: January 21, 2017 12:46 PM
To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity
Subject: [Xmca-l] Trump's speech and Perezhivanie

Dear Helena, Andy, all,


Unfortunately, I have not been able to find the time to watch the movie
Fate of a Man, but I have followed the very interesting analyses and
conversations about it. I am opening this thread as connexions between
those analyses, perezhivanie, and current tragic social and political
situation in the US and elsewhere. This also connects with the article
that
Mike shared on the position of the Learning Sciences with regard to this
situation (how happy I was to see this initiative!).


In particular, I wanted to pick up on Helena's very true comment that
"the
US is going to have to produce some works of scholarship or art, or
both,
that attempt to explain what is happening now here in the US -- for
example, this afternoon, under President Trump."


Yesterday, we saw at home Trump's speech. Although we had followed
Trump's
campaign and its denigrating tenor, it was yesterday, for the first
time,
that my wife and me got this gut feeling of true tragedy, of a real
*drama*
as we heard those empty, but to recover the prior article for
discussion,
hollowed and hollowing words coming out of that mouth. It came upon us
that
there may be lots of people for whom those words are not hollowed, but
actually encouraging, rich, beautiful. How can you hear that as beauty?


So, I was wondering, and in following up with our 2016 MCA Issue 4
discussion,  whether we could not actually conduct an analysis of the
sort
Marc offers in his article of the perezhivanie. Just as Vygotsky
explains
how 3 different children experience the situation of an alcoholic mother
differently, could not we perform an analysis ?of that perezhivanie in
which a person experiences yesterday's situation as one of
encouragement,
of freedom and hope. Would that not be a way to try to understand what
is
going on? This would not be a piece of art, but could be something we
could
do to try to understand and change this situation.

We could then contrast that perezhivanie with the one many of as have,
in
which the situation is experience as a real TRAGEDY. I think in the
first
case, there is no hope for change, there is contempt; in the second,
hearing those words as hollowed and hollowing require that you live the
situation as a doubled situation in which you experienced it from a very
different developmental stage. One in which the speech sounds as a case
of
involution.

Should we find the transcribed speech and perform such analysis?


Going now to support the Woman's march here in Victoria BC.

Alfredo





--
Gregory A. Thompson, Ph.D.
Assistant Professor
Department of Anthropology
880 Spencer W. Kimball Tower
Brigham Young University
Provo, UT 84602
http://byu.academia.edu/GregoryThompson