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Re: [xmca] LSV's use of metaphor
Thanks for all that Robert.
As I mentioned, I am interested in LSV's metaphors of development and I have
stored up some to
put together and present back to the group to think about,
Just to respond to the bruner staircase metaphor and its embodiment in the
interesting graphic:
Spirals result when you put a circle into motion. I think that the idea of a
spiral of development has to be very old indeed. It is all over catholicism.
For example, T.S. Eliot, in *Little Giddings" *writes
We shall not cease from exploration
And the end of all our exploring
Will be to arrive where we started
And know the place for the first time
I have been thinking that the "penetration/sticking into" combined with the
"spinning around its axis" ideas could be usefully combined, especially when
one of the examples the Russian dictionary gives is poking yourself with a
stick! And the two examples given in the authoritative Dal dictionary
following the "growth" branch of vryashchivanie" bear some thought.
1. An ingrown toenail.
2. A hut being absorbed by the earth.
How is it that the toe and whether and how it is encased in leather part of
the day influences the ingrowing process?
The hut, made of brick and beam and metal fittings cannot be absorbed by the
earth as if it was like the mixing of two bags of sugar. The beams and metal
fittings would, in more a pierce mode than an absorbative mode be
incorporated, grow into, be asorbed by the earth. The earth would, in the
short run at least, be modified by what it absorbed. The process can last a
long time. See a classic archeological site or visit Verdun.
So we need time going both directions, "inside out and outside in" (where
inside and outside are themselves complex relational concepts) and parts of
the process (the metal beams vs the mud walls) disintegrating and being
absorbed into, with minimal structural change) the earth below the hut.
Metaphorically speaking.
mike
PS-- The diagram you sent is itself worth extensive discussion as a
potential embodiment of the idea of developmental instruction.
On Sat, Oct 9, 2010 at 11:47 AM, Robert Lake <boblake@georgiasouthern.edu>wrote:
> Mike,
> Here is a link to an interesting and simple illustration of Bruner's
> "spiral" curriculum at work.
>
>
> http://projects.coe.uga.edu/epltt/images/5/59/Cognitive_9.gif
>
>
>
>
> RL
>
>
> Robert Lake Ed.D.
> Assistant Professor
> Social Foundations of Education
> Dept. of Curriculum, Foundations, and Reading
> Georgia Southern University
> P. O. Box 8144
> Phone: (912) 478-5125
> Fax: (912) 478-5382
> Statesboro, GA 30460
>
> "Democracy must be born anew in every generation and education is its
> midwife".
> -John Dewey
>
> >>> mike cole 10/07/10 10:20 PM >>>
> You need to say more for me, Robert. How would that work?
>
> Spirals. Now there is an interesting geometric shape to consider. How did
> Bruner deploy it?
>
> mike
>
> On Thu, Oct 7, 2010 at 6:38 PM, Robert Lake wrote:
>
> > David,
> > Could the dialectical relationship between personal metaphor creation and
> > the processes involved in the "assimilation of terminology" provide an
> > example of Vygotsky's quest for synthesis between the disparate views of
> > early 20th century psychology? Or perhaps to use Bruner's metaphor of
> the
> > spiral staircase........need I say more?
> > RL
> >
> > Robert Lake Ed.D.
> > Assistant Professor
> > Social Foundations of Education
> > Dept. of Curriculum, Foundations, and Reading
> > Georgia Southern University
> > P. O. Box 8144
> > Phone: (912) 478-5125
> > Fax: (912) 478-5382
> > Statesboro, GA 30460
> >
> > "Democracy must be born anew in every generation and education is its
> > midwife".
> > -John Dewey
> >
> > >>> David Kellogg 10/07/10 8:07 PM >>>
> > Vygotsky's metaphors are many and varied: peas in a sack (child
> concepts),
> > guerrilla warfare vs. prolonged seige (theoretical vs. empirical
> research),
> > and my all-time favorite, "science concepts do not drop into the child's
> > mouth like a flock of already roasted-pigeons".
> >
> > But it seems to me that any discussion of his use of analogy should
> include
> > his discussion of the LIMITS of metaphor. This is in the context of his
> > analogy between the learning of scientific concepts and the learing of
> > foreign language words, which can be found, in the Minick translation, in
> > Volume One, p. 223, of the Collected Works. Here's OUR translation:
> >
> > "In substance, our analogy always treats the development of two aspects
> of
> > a single and same process by their psychological nature: verbal thinking.
> In
> > the one case, that of the foreign language, what comes into the forefront
> is
> > the external, sonorous, phasal* properties of verbal thinking; in the
> other,
> > the development of scientific concepts, it is the semantic process of the
> > same process. For this reason the assimilation of a foreign language
> > doubtless requires, even though in a minimal measure, the mastery of the
> > semantic aspect of the foreign language, just as the development of
> > scientific concept requires, even to a minimal extent, some effort to
> master
> > scientific language, the symbols of science, which intervene in an
> evident
> > fashion during the assimilation of terminology and symbolic systems, such
> as
> > that of arithmetic. For this reason, one might expect from the very
> > beginning that we might find the analogy that we are developing here. Yet
> we
> > know
> > that the development of the phasal and semantic aspects of language do
> not
> > repeat themselves but follow specific ways, and so we must expect that
> our
> > analogy will prove to be incomplete like any other analogy and that the
> > assimilation of a foreign language with respect to the maternal tongue
> shall
> > present resemblances to the development of scientific concepts with
> respect
> > to that of everyday concepts in some determined relations, while in
> others
> > there will be profound differences."
> >
> > And it seems to me that there's a very SIMPLE explanation for the failure
> > of the analogy, too. Every foreign language represents, in the final
> > analysis, somebody ELSE'S everyday concepts.
> >
> > David Kellogg
> > Seoul National University of Education
> >
> > --- On Thu, 10/7/10, Achilles Delari Junior wrote:
> >
> >
> > From: Achilles Delari Junior
> > Subject: RE: [xmca] LSV's use of metaphor
> > To: xmca@weber.ucsd.edu
> > Date: Thursday, October 7, 2010, 4:37 PM
> >
> >
> >
> > Well...
> >
> > I also remember that in 1929 Vygotsky compared old psychological views
> with
> > the "Comedia del'Arte", because the fixed roles of the psychic functions
> > compared to the fixed roles of the characters in that kind of drama...
> This
> > is at the paper "Concrete human psychology" in English it was published
> at
> > Soviet Psychology, 1989, v. 17, n. 2 - but I don't have my copy of the
> > English version here anymore.... only a Portuguese version. In the same
> text
> > is present also the metaphor about consciousness as telephonist in
> contrast
> > and complementation to Pavlovian metaphor about brain as telephonic
> central,
> > if I remember well... This same subject was repeatead at the book "The
> > history of development of higher mental functions" from 1931 (In Spanish
> > edition of the Works, as in Russian, it is the Volume III)... A metaphor
> > with trains and rails was used as well, in reflexological discussion, for
> a
> > comparison with Sherrignton's contributions about much more afferent ways
> > (rails) than efferent ones... but by memory I don't know more if this is
> > at that reflexological text from 1924 or from 1925... (Consciousness as
> > problem of behavior psychology). In the Psychology of Art, certainly he
> also
> > repeat the Sherington formulation, but I am not so sure about where was
> the
> > "train metaphor"... If you have interest in this "train" metaphor, I can
> > localize the actual sources, for this too...
> >
> > Best.
> >
> > Achilles.
> >
> >
> > > Date: Thu, 7 Oct 2010 15:05:08 -0700
> > > Subject: Re: [xmca] LSV's use of metaphor
> > > From: lchcmike@gmail.com
> > > To: xmca@weber.ucsd.edu
> > >
> > > Woa, not so sure about the train track metaphor. The train moves freely
> > up
> > > and down a pre-scribed
> > > track and the only thing that can vary "independently" is speed! Brrrr.
> > > mike
> > >
> > > On Thu, Oct 7, 2010 at 2:20 PM, Colette Murphy wrote:
> > >
> > > > One that I like a lot:
> > > >
> > > > According to Vygotsky the teacher should be the track upon which the
> > train
> > > > coaches move freely and independently. The track only gives the
> coaches
> > the
> > > > direction of their own movement.
> > > > (Vygotsky, A Reawakened Star:
> > > > http://www.marxist.com/science-old/vygotsky_501.html)
> > > >
> > > > Best
> > > >
> > > > Colette
> > > >
> > > > Dr Colette Murphy
> > > > Senior Lecturer
> > > > School of Education
> > > > 69 University St
> > > > Queen's University
> > > > Belfast BT7 1HL
> > > >
> > > > tel: 02890975953
> > > > ________________________________________
> > > > From: xmca-bounces@weber.ucsd.edu [xmca-bounces@weber.ucsd.edu] On
> > Behalf
> > > > Of Robert Lake [boblake@georgiasouthern.edu]
> > > > Sent: 07 October 2010 21:15
> > > > To: Culture Activity eXtended Mind
> > > > Subject: [xmca] LSV's use of metaphor
> > > >
> > > > Hi Everyone,
> > > > I am gathering the use of metaphors in Vygotsky's work for a
> > publication
> > > > and want to be sure to include as many as possible.
> > > > without any knowledge of Russian along with the fact that I have
> > > > only recently begun a serious investigation of his work.
> > > >
> > > > In her essay on Vygotsky on Thinking and Speaking in the Cambridge
> > > > companion to Vygotsky,(2007) Vera John-Steiner cites some of
> Vygotsky's
> > most
> > > > famous examples, i.e. inner speech as "speech turning inward";
> thought
> > as a
> > > > "cloud shedding a shower of words"; "consciousness is reflected in a
> > word in
> > > > a word as the sun in a drop of water". (p.151).
> > > >
> > > > Yes I know "tool" is a controversial example to some people :-).
> > > >
> > > > Can you folks think of any others ?
> > > >
> > > > Thank-you in advance for any help with this.
> > > > Robert Lake
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Robert Lake Ed.D.
> > > > Assistant Professor
> > > > Social Foundations of Education
> > > > Dept. of Curriculum, Foundations, and Reading
> > > > Georgia Southern University
> > > > P. O. Box 8144
> > > > Phone: (912) 478-5125
> > > > Fax: (912) 478-5382
> > > > Statesboro, GA 30460
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Democracy must be born anew in every generation, and education is
> its
> > > > midwife.
> > > > -John Dewey.
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > xmca mailing list
> > > > xmca@weber.ucsd.edu
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