Re: [xmca] university students in the zoped

From: deborah downing-wilson (ddowningw@gmail.com)
Date: Sat Oct 14 2006 - 09:00:10 PDT


Thanks Emily, Phil, Carol,

This gives me a lot to think about. I'll follow these leads and read these
articles and surface again with questions, I'm sure.

Deb

On 10/14/06, Emily Duvall <duvalleg@adelphia.net> wrote:
>
> Actually, I'm very interested in the zoped from the teacher
> perspective. It's not an area that Vygotsky wrote on, but one that I
> think needs to be explored within the context of development,
> particularly as it influences teacher education. Part of my dissertation
> work is focused on the connection between teacher learning and
> development in the zoped and student learning and development in the
> zoped. I'm currently conceptualizing these as intersecting zopeds and
> bringing in Gadamers fusion of horizons. At any rate, anything
> (articles, opinions, etc) that could contribute to thinking about this
> would be welcome. The population I'm working with are elementary
> children with learning disabilities.
> Reagrding the zoped at the university level I was thinking about the
> work by Poehner and Lantolf in L2/dynamic assessment. I know the
> population that Matt worked with were undergrads and, of course, DA is
> all about the zoped. He's currently working for CALPER at Penn State and
> would probably be happy to discuss what he knows re zopeds and working
> with undergrads. There are some other folks doing similar work at Penn
> State, as well.
>
> ~ Em
>
> Carol Macdonald wrote:
>
> > Hi Deborah
> > Phill has obviously given you good references, but I thought I might
> > give a
> > little of my own experiences of supervision. I think they are very
> > similar
> > to teacher/child dyads. Leaving aside issues of power for a moment, the
> > lecturer can point students to work that is too easy (going overy the
> > top of
> > the zoped) or too difficult, where they come in under the zoped; in both
> > cases no genuine learning occurs.
> >
> > Then there are issues of mastery and appropriation/internalisation. Some
> > students master the work for their thesis and then propmtly consign it
> to
> > the trashbin. For others, the appropiation has been so deep that it
> > affcts
> > all their subsequent work, or maybe cause them to shift their paradigm
> > for
> > the foreseeable future.
> >
> > Then there are issues of power: some students will do what one asks,
> > without resentment, assuming that the superviser has a bird's eye view
> of
> > where they are going. Others may listen to instructions and then go
> > off and
> > do exactly what they want to do: they are either dying to do some other
> > (covert) reading, or otherwise they assume the superviser cannot enter
> > into
> > their reality, but perhaps can be inducted.(Or that the superviser is so
> > stupid that they are going to ask that s'he should be replaced as
> > Internal
> > Examiner.)
> >
> > Finally, there are students coming in from other disciplines, who have
> to
> > learn the conventions of the new one, and may trip innumerable times in
> > their writing (styles). They have to trust their supervisers, and have
> a
> > sense of humour to survive, but since it is a matter of style rather
> than
> > content, this is a secondary type of zoped.
> >
> > There are other varieties such as students who are extremely competent
> > but
> > very insecure, who come anxiously with more or less perfect work, for
> > it to
> > get a stamp of approval. Naturally we find them a pain, because they
> > consume
> > lots of our time--this might be a case of (lack of) confidence in the
> > zoped. Too little might exhibit the case of obviating the zoped, with
> > genuine learning taking place, presumably with the mediation from/with
> > texts
> > almost to exclusion of people-bound dyadic learning. Too much
> > unwarrented
> > confidence can lead to learning outside the zoped under discussion, or a
> > poor performance within it.
> >
> > Actually I think these examples (which are all mine, but might be
> > shared to
> > differrent levels by my other honoured collegauges) are so interesting
> > that
> > surely somebody could write a paper about them, unless, of course,
> > Phill's
> > authors have already.
> >
> > Carol
> >
> >
> > On 10/14/06, Phil Chappell <philchappell@mac.com> wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> Dear Deborah,
> >>
> >> Attached are two papers that may be helpful - both in language
> >> teacher education and from the Modern Language Journal.
> >>
> >> Regards,
> >>
> >> Phil
> >>
> >>
> >> On 14/10/2006, at 11:20 AM, deborah downing-wilson wrote:
> >>
> >> > I'm just beginning to look at undergrad development in informal
> >> > mentored
> >> > service learning environments (Fifth Dimension After-school
> >> > programs) and
> >> > would like to use the ZPD model to evaluate the quality of the
> >> > professor/undergrad relationship in contrast to the conventional
> >> > lecturer/listener dynamic. There is some literature available on
> >> > adult
> >> > learners in zopeds, but neither this nor the work regularly done with
> >> > children directly addresses university learning.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > On 10/13/06, Emily Duvall <duvalleg@adelphia.net> wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> Are you looking for something in particular as in dynamic
> >> >> assessment or
> >> >> a particular domain such as foreign language, ... ?
> >> >>
> >> >> deborah downing-wilson wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> > Can anyone point me toward literature or research applying the
> >> >> zoped
> >> >> > model
> >> >> > to professor/university student relationships?
> >> >> >
> >> >>
> >> >> --
> >> >> He only earns his freedom and his life, who takes them every day
> >> >> by storm.
> >> >> -- Johann Wolfgang Goethe
> >> >>
> >> >> Emily Duvall
> >> >> Doctoral Candidate (ABD) / Graduate Assistant-Instructor
> >> >> Language and Literacy Education (LLED)
> >> >> Department of Curriculum and Instruction
> >> >> College of Education
> >> >> Penn State University
> >> >> 256 Chambers Bldg.
> >> >> University Park , PA 16802
> >> >> 814-861-3315 (home)
> >> >> 814-404-6175 (cell)
> >> >> 814-863-4511 (office)
> >> >> FAX: 814-863-7602
> >> >> edd130@psu.edu
> >> >>
> >> >> _______________________________________________
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> >> >>
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > --
> >> > Deborah Downing-Wilson
> >> > _______________________________________________
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> >>
> >>
> >>
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-- 
Deborah Downing-Wilson
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