Re: development: loss, destruction, transformation

From: David H Kirshner (
Date: Wed Mar 30 2005 - 06:51:54 PST

Jim Gee (1992) has an interesting section on birding communities.


 Gee, J. P. (1992). The social mind: Language, ideology, and social practice. New York: Bergin & Garvey.

Yrjö Engeström <yrjo.engestrom who-is-at>
03/30/2005 11:55 AM ZE2
Please respond to xmca

bcc: David H Kirshner/dkirsh/LSU
Subject: Re: development: loss, destruction, transformation

Dear Dorie, that is an interesting example. Coincidence: I am starting
a new project on 'wildfire activities' among humans. One central case
will be birding. The is something in the object (birds) that is all but
impossible to contain by commercial forces. I call such objects
'runaway objects'.


Dorie Evensen kirjoittaa keskiviikkona, 30. maaliskuuta 2005, kello

> While waiting for Yrjo's reply I wonder if this is relevant. I just
> heard a tidbit of Terry Gross' Fresh Air on NPR. She was talking to
> people who study the songs of birds (wrens, I think it was) - anyway,
> one spoke about studying birds in their natural environment to find if
> their travels (break aways?) affected their songs. The very young
> bird did something like a wild imitation of the father's (evidently,
> mothers don't sing) highly stylized song - but when the young (male)
> flew the home coup (usually traveling about a mile), his song took on
> the characteristics (and the refinements) of the birds in his
> neighborhood - after all, that was the territory he was wanting to
> make his mark in. His learning was definitely outside-in and
> definitely breaking away from what he was raised on (purposeful? - ok,
> I'm pushing it here).
> Dorie Evensen
> At 04:37 PM 3/29/2005, you wrote:
>> Nice to have you back, Mary.
>> Seems like we need to Yrjo's paper in front of everyone if we are
>> going to make progress
>> on this topic.
>> Yrjo-- At the end of one of my notes on this topic I said that it
>> would be good to have
>> various people who took a "breaking away perspective" give examples.
>> What are your
>> favorite examples? Do you have a pdf version of the paper we can use
>> for dicussion?
>> mike
>> On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 09:39:44 -0800, Mary Bryson <>
>> wrote:
>> > On 3/28/05 3:30 PM, "Mike Cole" <> wrote:
>> >
>> > > but if your kid did not learn to add or read, you might get
>> unhappy. :-)
>> >
>> > OK, time for me to chime in here... I was a participant in a
>> day-long
>> > participatory conference <Beyond Postmodernism> some time ago <it
>> was
>> > actually a Postmodernism Bashing carnival> and the whole group was
>> > discussing the enormous significance of a scientific model for
>> "learning to
>> > read" <back to, postmodernism bashing> and so I instigated a "break
>> away"
>> > discursive intervention --
>> > I suggested that the discussion on "learning" might more fruitfully
>> <ha ha>
>> > intersect with some

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