Dear Eugene,
I don't know why XMCA is so quiet, probably everyone is preparing for
the new school year.
About "lichnost" -- its use and connotation is very similar in
Serbian/Croatian/Bosnian language to the Russian and Portuguese. There
is a very strong emotional , non rational component -- sometimes also
"felt" as a "core" of an individual, and something that is not
"developed/developing", but almost like someone's 'nature". There is
also a strong ethical or moral aspect of the term: in the expressions:
"yaka lichnost" -- a "strong character" -- someone with very high moral
standards and qualities., or "povodlyiva lichnost" -- someone who is
easily corrupted, or can be easily swayed to follow someone else's
(usually not very clear, or morally OK) initiative.
An interesting sideline: etymologically, "lichnost" originates from the
same root - "lik" -- which is also in English word "like" (similar) and
"likeness", and in Serbian word "lice" -- which means both "Face" and
"Character" (as in theatrical role).
I think that this problem -- the problem of translating specific
terminology from one language to another -- maybe can be overcome when
the international community of scholars builds a specific terminology
related to this particular theoretical orientation. It does sound like
an impossible task because we need these imprecise concepts (or fuzzy
concepts) even to begin building a theory, but I think it is possible
precisely because we are aware of these differences and are learning
from each other.
What do you think?
Ana
Eugene Matusov wrote:
> Dear XMCA-ers-
>
>
>
> A month ago we had a discussion about Russian notion of lichnost' . I
> asked my friend and colleague Eugene Subbotsky to help with a good
> reference since he is a specialist in this area. I remember that he
> wrote a book on lichnost' in the USSR. Below is his response with the
> reference (notice that lichnost' has been translated in English as
> "personality").
>
>
>
> Translation is a real big problem for such notions because they are
> culturally bounded. Recently I was reading an article criticizing work
> of Paulo Freire for being too rational and intellectual. The article
> was talking about Freire's notion "conscientation" (sp?). I was very
> surprised about that critique because for me "conscience" ("sovest'"
> in Russian) does not associated with rationalism and intellectualism.
>
>
>
> I clarified this issue when I talked with my American and Brazilian
> graduate students (thanks Mark and Carolina!) who revealed that these
> words have very different meanings in Portuguese and English. As far a
> I understand them, Portuguese meaning of the term, like Russian,
> focused on holistic feelings of injustice when a person did something
> wrong or something wrong going in the world. Here are examples of
> Russian use of the term of "sovest'" translated in English as
> "conscience" from Russian-English dictionary published in USSR, "smb.
> has pangs of conscience", "he has a bad/guilty conscience", "abandon
> conscience", "conscience began to prick him", "to act against one's
> conscience", "with an easy/clear conscience". As I was explained,
> English notion of "conscience" connotes with an intellectual state of
> being aware of something rather than with a holistic feeling of
> injustice. Here is how WorldNet (Princeton University) defines the term:
>
>
>
> conscience
>
>
>
> n 1: motivation deriving logically from ethical or moral principles
> that govern a person's thoughts and actions [syn: scruples, moral
> sense, sense of right and wrong] 2: conformity to one's own sense of
> right conduct: "a person of unflagging conscience" 3: a feeling of
> shame when you do something immoral; "he has no conscience about his
> cruelty"
>
>
>
>
>
> Source: WordNet ® 1.6, © 1997 Princeton University
>
>
>
> This is very far from the Russian notion. For example, Russian tzar
> Ivan the Terrible who tortured and killed indiscriminately a lot of
> people prayed almost every night because "conscience began to prick
> him" (according to some historical account). This holistic personal
> feeling ("conscience") of doing wrong was nothing to do with his
> intellectual state of being aware of what he was doing wrong. Rather
> it emerged despite his rationalization and justification of his
> murder. My Brazilian student told me that Portuguese notion of
> "conscience" is a very similar to Russian (I wish I could speak
> Portuguese!). If we have Portuguese (Spanish, French, Italian, German,
> iZulu, Japanese, and etc.) speaking people on XMCA I wonder the
> meaning of the term "conscience" is in these language.
>
>
>
> By the way, both Russian and Brazilian/Portuguese notions of
> conscience have a lot to do with Russian notion of "lichnost'" while
> English version is not. If our interpretation is correct, what makes
> situation with Paulo Freire's writing even more difficult that the
> English and Portuguese words have the same Latin root despite
> different cultural meanings... Without knowing these cultural
> different ways of how the term is used, English speaking readers may
> lose important ideas of Paulo Freire. What do you think?
>
>
>
> It is very quiet at XMCA... I wonder why...
>
>
>
> Take care,
>
>
>
> Eugene
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Eugene Subbotsky [mailto:e.subbotsky@lancaster.ac.uk]
> Sent: Monday, August 25, 2003 7:55 AM
> To: ematusov@UDel.Edu
> Subject: Re: lichnost'/self-actualization
>
>
>
> Dear Eugene
>
> I believe the book you mean is "The birth of personality. The
>
> development of independent and moral behaviour in preschool children.
>
> Harvester Wheatsheaf, 1993. I saw it in the library of the UCSD, San
>
> Diego.
>
> Yours sincerely
>
> Eugene
>
> On Monday, August 11, 2003, at 02:17 am, Eugene Matusov wrote:
>
>
>
>> Dear Peter and everybody-
>
>>
>
>> I wonder if Il'enkov wrote on this issue. Also, I remember that Eugene
>
>> Subbotsky wrote a book about development of lichnost'. I wonder if it
>
>> is
>
>> translated in English (Eugene, can you help?).
>
>>
>
>> Take care,
>
>>
>
>> Eugene
>
>>
>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>
>>> From: Peter Moxhay [mailto:moxhap@portlandschools.org]
>
>>> Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 1:29 PM
>
>>> To: xmca@weber.ucsd.edu
>
>>> Subject: Re: lichnost'/self-actualization
>
>>>
>
>>> Eugene wrote:
>
>>>
>
>>>> I'd define it as "in-world-actualization" (cf. "self-actualization").
>
>>>> In the
>
>>>> concept of lichnost', one has to listen to the world rather than self
>
>>>> to
>
>>>> unfold one's potentials.
>
>>>>
>
>>>
>
>>> I have a recent book with a couple of essays by Dmitrii Leontiev
>
>>> precisely
>
>>> on "self-actualization" (transliterated into Russian). He talks about
>
>>> "self-actualization" of "lichnostei," but has references mostly to
>
>>> Western authors and one to LSV (none to his famous grandfather).
>
>>>
>
>>> I'd be interested, Eugene, to hear if you have written anything on
>
>>> this
>
>>> subject, or
>
>>> if you can point to references that might bridge the concepts of
>
>>> personality, lichnost', self-actualization, in-world-actualization,
>
>>> etc
>
>>> .
>
>>>
>
>>> Peter
>
>>
>
>>
>
-- ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Ana Marjanovic-Shane (215) 843-2909 (home) (267) 334-2905 (mobile)
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