[Xmca-l] Re: Vygotskian Passage

[HENRY SHONERD]

Interesting! I read paragraph 118 in David’s link to the reading where Vygotsky describes some of Arseniev’s observations of indigenous functional systems in the far reaches of Russia’s east  and have watched about half an hour of the Kursowa film that David also gives a link for, Dersu the Trapper. According to Wikipedia, the film is in Russian, but the link is to the film dubbed in Spanish and subtitled in English. The dubbed voice of Dersu is in a very proper Castillian Spanish, a prestige dialect of Spanish, but the subtitles are a sort of stereotypically piginized variety of English, not unlike the speech of Tonto in epoisodes of the Lone Ranger. The subtitles were a clumsy, but effective, way to portray the speech of an indigenous person able to communicate with the Russians, just right for an English reading audience. One wonders if Spanish-speaking listeners were at least a little puzzled by Dersu sounding more like Don Quijote than Sancho Panza. 

We have lots of Native Americans here in New Mexico, among them the Pueblos. In 1680, the Pueblos banded staged an uprising against Spanish soldiers, settlers and priests, who had been doing their best to get rich and save souls since their arrival in the “New World” over a century earlier. The uprising was a great success, because each of the Pueblos, often hundreds of miles from each other, began the action on exactly the same day. How did they synchronize the action?:  Knots in a rope carried by Pueblo runners from Pueblo to Pueblo in advance of the uprising. The runners undid a knot each day and each Pueblo they visited would “copy” the rope. On the day there were no knots in either the original or the copies, the attack started. The Spanish came back later and re-established their order within a hundred years, but the Pueblo rebellion was a proud moment in the history of New Mexico. Functional systems at work. 

Henry






> On Jun 14, 2016, at 2:49 PM, Glassman, Michael <glassman.13@osu.edu> wrote:
> 
> David,
> 
> Yes, I think that's it.  I must have been merging this description with the strings used for memory described by Leontiev Bella pointed to.
> 
> Thanks so much, this solves one mystery in my life.  I wish they could all be answered so quickly.
> 
> Thanks so much,
> 
> Michael
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu [mailto:xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu] On Behalf Of David Kellogg
> Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2016 4:36 PM
> To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity <xmca-l@mailman.ucsd.edu>
> Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Vygotskian Passage
> 
> Michael:
> 
> I think you are actually thinking of an incident that Vygotsky describes from the work of V.K. Arsen'ev. It's on p. 50 of Vol. Four of the Collected Works, and you can read it here:
> 
> https://www.marxists.org/archive/vygotsky/works/1931/research-method.htm
> 
> See paragraph 118. There's also a footnote about it in "Concrete Psychology" (see number 14).
> 
> By some accounts, Vygosky was in correspondence with Arsen'ev, who wrote "Dersu the Trapper". Akira Kurasawa made this book into a wonderful movie, which you can see here.
> 
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5QYxy2HkpJ0&list=PL0dYx2N3BTuRcLGyHXBszwNgSy-0GoAfM
> 
> David Kellogg
> Macquarie University
> 
> 
> 
> On Wed, Jun 15, 2016 at 4:32 AM, Glassman, Michael <glassman.13@osu.edu>
> wrote:
> 
>> Thanks Bella.  The passage I remember, or think I remember, was 
>> definitely along the same lines.
>> 
>> Michael
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu [mailto:
>> xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu] On Behalf Of Bella Kotik-Friedgut
>> Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2016 2:46 PM
>> To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity <xmca-l@mailman.ucsd.edu>
>> Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Vygotskian Passage
>> 
>> The picture attached is from the book of Leontiev A.N. The development 
>> Mind of a chapter on the historical development of higher forms of memory.
>> p.301
>> 
>> Sincerely yours Bella Kotik-Friedgut
>> 
>> On Tue, Jun 14, 2016 at 8:50 PM, Glassman, Michael 
>> <glassman.13@osu.edu>
>> wrote:
>> 
>>> 
>>> I wonder if somebody might be able to help me.  I seem to remember a 
>>> passage from Vygotsky where he describes a person going between 
>>> villages, I think to deliver messages.  He uses some type of 
>>> external symbol system, maybe tying strings around his finger.  Does 
>>> anybody know if that really exists and if so where.
>>> 
>>> Thanks in advance to anybody who might be able to help.
>>> 
>>> Michael
>>> 
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>