[Date Prev][Date Next][Thread Prev][Thread Next][Date Index][Thread Index]

[Xmca-l] Re: Fun &Games



Some insight from Calvin and Hobbes (series of 3 strips)...

[image: Inline image 1][image: Inline image 2][image: Inline image 4]

On Thu, Aug 20, 2015 at 2:05 PM, David Kellogg <dkellogg60@gmail.com> wrote:

> Wolfgang Koehler, the Gestalt psychologist whose work on chimpanzees so
> impressed Vygotsky (see, inter alia, Chapter Four of Thinking and Speech),
> remarked that contrary to what Mark Twain said humans are not the only
> species that laughs. Chimpanzees on Tenerife where he worked used to offer
> food to his hens, and then, when the hens tried to eat it, they would pull
> the food away and eat it themselves with a huffing sound, which Koehler
> interpreted as laughter. Anyone who watches elementary school children
> having fun notices almost right away that one of the most elementary forms
> of fun is not at all collusion between subversives against the higher
> powers but precisely the opposite: individualistic acts of aggression and
> aggrandizement precisely against children perceived to be more helpless,
> who offer "fun" with impunity.
>
> So I think the real question, as always, is how higher forms develop (and
> actually, Greg, I was quite serious when I said that I thought imaginary
> situations and abstract rules represented developmentally higher forms of
> play). One possibility that occurs to me is a kind of "self parody". That
> is, if you are looking for fun with impunity, one of the few really
> reliable sources might be making fun of yourself. Self-directed fun then
> becomes something like self-directed speech, something that is
> internalizable as a kind of imaginary situation or even an imaginary self.
>
> But there are always limits to impunity. Over the last few days I've been
> watching with horror the cell phone videos made from apartment windows in
> Tianjin, where twenty tons of TNT went up in a huge fireball that was both
> immediately lethal to over a hundred people and toxic to countless others
> in the long term. The cell phone videos always have sound tracks filled
> with laughter and obscenities (in both Chinese and English--some were made
> by locals and some by expatriates). And the sort of things that people
> exclaim when they are having fun. And then the shock wave shatters the
> apartment window and there is blood everywhere.
>
> David Kellogg
>
>
>
> On Thu, Aug 20, 2015 at 2:21 AM, Rod Parker-Rees <
> R.Parker-Rees@plymouth.ac.uk> wrote:
>
> > I think the relationships between play, playfulness, enjoyment and fun
> are
> > important features of social and cultural interactions but slippery and
> > resistant to any kind of definition. Indeed I suspect that we enjoy
> > playfulness and fun partly because it reminds us that seemingly rigid
> rules
> > and constraints can be played with and loosened up. I think there is a
> kind
> > of exuberant playfulness, just one of the layered meanings of fun listed
> in
> > Robert's post, which depends on interaction- when two or more people
> > recognise that they are engaging in a shared exchange of playful
> > interactions they can enter into an escalating spiral, as the 'loosening'
> > of conventional constraints allows them to reveal more of themselves to
> > each other. The mix of enjoyment with a touch of riskiness can build to
> > exuberant hilarity which can also reinforce a feeling of trust between
> the
> > 'players'. Though not always- it can sometimes veer off into teasing and
> > 'making fun OF' someone.
> >
> > I wonder whether the sense of the riskiness of fun might play a part in
> > the negative connotations usually now associated with 'collusion'. People
> > who WORK together (collaborate) are socially safe but people who PLAY
> > together (collude) are socially dangerous because they encourage each
> other
> > to loosen the hold of social constraints and expectations. Which may be
> > more fun for the players than for others outside their circle.
> >
> > All the best,
> >
> > Rod
> >
> > On 19 Aug 2015 5:22 pm, mike cole <mcole@ucsd.edu> wrote:
> > My queries were going in a direction with yours, Rolf. Play is a leading
> > activity in LSV-Elkonin-Leontiev. But somehow developmental psychologists
> > do not
> > appear to make use of the term and I do not know who does.
> >
> > Robert's etymology is certainly interesting. Modern usage seems to still
> > have a bit of that tricksterism dwelling within it.
> >
> > And, like Helen, the way this confused semantic space is organized in
> > different languages is fascinating. I have been playing with
> > english-russian and then checking various options for backtranslationg.
> >
> > A tangled web, me thinks.
> >
> > I have this feeling that imagination plays different roles in the two
> > domains, however they turn out to be constituted.
> >
> > mike
> >
> >
> >
> > That's great, Robert.
> >
> > I have been playing with translations and back-translations between
> Russian
> > and English.
> >
> > On Wed, Aug 19, 2015 at 7:30 AM, Robert Lake <
> boblake@georgiasouthern.edu>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > It is interesting (and fun) to look up word origins in the OED.
> > > which reveals a significant cultural/historically shaped evolution.
> > > See below.
> > > *Robert*
> > >
> > > *Oxford English Dictionary*
> > >
> > > *Etymology:*  probably < fun *v.*
> > > <http://www.oed.com/view/Entry/75468#eid3558958>
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > †*1.* A cheat or trick; a hoax, a practical joke.
> > >
> > > 1699   B. E. *New Dict. Canting Crew*   *Fun*, a Cheat or slippery
> Trick.
> > >
> > > 1719   in T. D'Urfey *Wit & Mirth* V. 259   A Hackney Coachman he did
> buy
> > > her, And was not this a very good Fun.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >  *2.*
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >  *a.* Diversion, amusement, sport; also, boisterous jocularity or
> gaiety,
> > > drollery. Also, a source or cause of amusement or pleasure.(Johnson
> 1755
> > > stigmatizes it as ‘a low cant word’; in present use it is merely
> somewhat
> > > familiar.)
> > >
> > > 1727   Swift *Misc. Epit. By-words*   Tho' he talk'd much of virtue,
> his
> > > head always run Upon something or other she found better fun.
> > >
> > > 1749   H. Fielding *Tom Jones* III. ix. vi. 354   Partridge..was a
> great
> > > Lover of what is called Fun.
> > >
> > > 1751   E. Moore *Gil Blas* Prol. sig. A3,   Don't mind me tho'— For all
> > my
> > > Fun and Jokes.
> > >
> > > 1767   H. Brooke *Fool of Quality* I. 99   Vindex..looked smilingly
> about
> > > him with much fun in his face.
> > >
> > > *a*1774   A. Tucker *Light of Nature Pursued* (1777) III. iii. 10   It
> is
> > > fun to them to break off an ornament, or disfigure a statue.
> > >
> > > 1790   R. Burns *Tam o' Shanter* in *Poems & Songs* (1968) II. 561
>  The
> > > mirth and fun grew fast and furious.
> > >
> > > 1836   Dickens *Pickwick Papers* (1837) ii. 7   ‘What's the fun?’ said
> a
> > > rather tall thin young man.
> > >
> > > 1845   S. C. Hall *Bk. Gems* 90   His wit and humour delightful, when
> it
> > > does not degenerate into ‘fun’.
> > >
> > > 1849   E. E. Napier *Excursions Southern Afr.* II. 331   Being better
> > > mounted than the rest of his troop, [he] pushed on to see more of the
> > fun.
> > >
> > > 1887   M. Shearman *Athletics & Football* 325   Most footballers play
> for
> > > the fun and the fun alone.
> > >
> > > 1889   J. K. Jerome *Idle Thoughts* 42   There is no fun in doing
> nothing
> > > when you have nothing to do.
> > >
> > > 1891   S. Baring-Gould *In Troubadour-land* iv. 50,   I do not see the
> > fun
> > > of going to hotels of the first class.
> > >
> > > 1934   *Punch* 9 May 526/1   A Rector in an unapostolic fury is rather
> > fun.
> > >
> > > 1954   *Economist* 20 Mar.   His book has all the charm of science
> > fiction;
> > > it is enormous fun.
> > >
> > > 1958   *Listener* 25 Dec. 1085/1   The clothes were Jacobean, and fun
> to
> > > wear.
> > >
> > > *(Hide quotations)*
> > > <
> > >
> >
> http://www.oed.com/view/Entry/75467?rskey=SpD3uz&result=1&isAdvanced=false
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >  *b.* Phr. *to make fun of* , *poke fun at* (a person, etc.): to
> > > ridicule. *for or in
> > > fun* : as a joke, sportively, not seriously. *(he, it is) good, great
> > fun*
> > > :
> > > a source of much amusement. *like fun*: energetically, very quickly,
> > > vigorously. *what fun!* how very amusing! *for the fun of the thing*:
> for
> > > amusement; *to have fun (with)* : to enjoy (a process); *spec.* to have
> > > sexual intercourse.
> > >
> > > 1737   H. Walpole *Corr.* (1820) I. 17,   I can't help making fun of
> > > myself.
> > >
> > > 1826   M. M. Sherwood *Lady of Manor* (ed. 2) IV. xxi. 247   Then you
> > won't
> > > make fun of me, will you?
> > >
> > > 1834   S. Smith *Sel. Lett. Major Jack Downing* ix. 24   They put their
> > > hats on and began to laugh like fun.
> > >
> > > 1840   T. Hood *Up Rhine* 145   The American..in a dry way began to
> ‘poke
> > > his fun’ at the unfortunate traveller.
> > >
> > > 1848   J. R. Lowell *Biglow Papers* 1st Ser. iv. 98   Stickin' together
> > > like fun.
> > >
> > > 1848   E. C. Gaskell *Mary Barton* I. v. 73   Carsons' mill is blazing
> > away
> > > like fun.
> > >
> > > 1849   E. Bulwer-Lytton *Caxtons* I. i. iv. 29   You would be very
> sorry
> > if
> > > your mamma was to..break it for fun.
> > >
> > > 1857   T. Hughes *Tom Brown's School Days* ii. iii. 273   The bolts
> went
> > to
> > > like fun.
> > >
> > > 1860   T. P. Thompson *Audi Alteram Partem* III. cxxvi. 82   Who knows
> > but
> > > Volunteer Rifles may make a campaign in the Holy Land, and mount guard
> > over
> > > the production of the holy fire at Easter? ‘What fun!’
> > >
> > > 1871   B. Jowett tr. Plato *Dialogues* I. 145   He may pretend in fun
> > that
> > > he has a bad memory.
> > >
> > > 1876   M. M. Grant *Sun-maid* I. iii. 104   The races are great fun.
> > >
> > > 1877   *Independent* 19 July 15/2   Little Tad commissioned lieutenant
> by
> > > Stanton, ‘just for the fun of the thing’.
> > >
> > > 1891   N. Gould *Double Event* 1   He's such good fun, and he's so
> > > obliging.
> > >
> > > 1893   J. S. Farmer & W. E. Henley *Slang* III. 86/2   *To have* (or
> > *do*)
> > > *a
> > > bit of fun*, to procure or enjoy the sexual favour.
> > >
> > > 1895   H. A. Kennedy in *19th Cent.* Aug. 331,   I suppose the
> > wood-carver
> > > was poking fun at him?
> > >
> > > 1903   M. Beerbohm *Around Theatres* (1924) I. 425   Amateur mimes..go
> in
> > > for private theatricals..just for the fun of the thing.
> > >
> > > 1958   *Times Lit. Suppl.* 7 Feb. 73/4   The clerks..get their own back
> > by
> > > unmasking frauds and..having fun with the low standard of French
> > commercial
> > > honesty.
> > >
> > > 1961   M. Dickens *Heart of London* ii. 198   Ambrosia had pushed Edgar
> > and
> > > the girl in there with the admonition to have some fun, dears.
> > >
> > > *(Hide quotations)*
> > > <
> > >
> >
> http://www.oed.com/view/Entry/75467?rskey=SpD3uz&result=1&isAdvanced=false
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >  *c.* Exciting goings-on. Also *fun and games*, freq. used ironically;
> > > *spec.* amatory play. *colloq.*
> > >
> > > 1879   W. J. Barry *Up & Down* vii. 51   We..had a good passage to
> > > Hong-Kong. When we arrived, the first Chinese war with Britain had
> broken
> > > out, and there was every appearance of plenty of fun to be shortly had
> > with
> > > the Chinkies.
> > >
> > > 1897   *Daily News* 13 Sept. 7/1   The engineer officers who are
> engaged
> > in
> > > carrying out some of the Sirdar's plans get much more than their fair
> > share
> > > of ‘the fun’.
> > >
> > > 1898   *Westm. Gaz.* 28 Oct. 3/1   It is possible that there may be
> rare
> > > fun by-and-by on the Nile.
> > >
> > > 1920   ‘Sapper’ *Bull-dog Drummond* vi. 155   We've had lots of fun and
> > > games since I last saw you.
> > >
> > > 1940   N. Mitford *Pigeon Pie* iii. 66   Farther on, however, you come
> to
> > > jolly fun and games—great notices.
> > >
> > > 1948   E. Partridge *Dict. Forces' Slang* 78   *Fun and games*, any
> sort
> > of
> > > brush with the enemy at sea.
> > >
> > > 1948   ‘N. Shute’ *No Highway* iii. 70   ‘Fun and games,’ he said. ‘The
> > > boffin's going mad.’
> > >
> > > 1952   E. Grierson *Reputation for Song* xxix. 260   Beneath the
> orderly
> > > conduct of her bar there was always present the possibility of ‘fun and
> > > games’.
> > >
> > > 1954   C. Armstrong *Better to eat You* ii. 22   If it happened because
> > > somebody is having fun-and-games with Miss Sarah Shepherd, somebody is
> > > going to be sorry.
> > >
> > > 1966   J. Porter *Sour Cream* v. 59,   I headed the car in the
> direction
> > of
> > > the coast road. We had the usual fun and games with the local drivers.
> > >
> > > 1970   *Globe & Mail (Toronto) *26 Sept. B3/3   Mr. Brown also expects
> > the
> > > fun and games of tax haven subsidiaries to disappear with the new
> > > legislation.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Wed, Aug 19, 2015 at 10:17 AM, Andrew Babson <ababson@umich.edu>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > > Mike, first as an aside, I tried to post this earlier and it got
> > > rejected,
> > > > so, updating my contact info now. A sign I should get more active
> here?
> > > >
> > > > Thanks for the great question, which is relevant to an approach
> > > > I am developing for analyzing interactional choices of young people.
> On
> > > > another level of analysis, we can think of the wide range of
> ideologies
> > > of
> > > > life course stages, specifically how certain kinds of play and fun
> are
> > > > expected of accepted at certain ages; and also how those ideologies
> are
> > > > different and similar culturally and historically.
> > > >
> > > > For what I'm working on the first interactional level is more
> relevant
> > > > to class, culture and education and the latter about youth and
> culture
> > > > across the lifespan. The twain do meet in that we often think of
> > > > experimentation, dynamism, flexibility and freedom when we think of
> > play
> > > > and also when we think of youth, whether referring to childhood or
> > young
> > > > adulthood.
> > > >
> > > > It's not a big step to consider where "fun" might fit in this
> > > conversation.
> > > > As an LSE anthro grad I can't also help but think of the relation of
> > this
> > > > conversation to Maurice Bloch's work in Madagascar on the
> constitution
> > of
> > > > the body and how it is expected to change through and after life,
> > namely
> > > as
> > > > we get older we get bonier and therefore closer to the ancestors who
> > are
> > > > physically only bone. It's interesting to think of how far we can or
> > > should
> > > > carry these analogic ideological constructions---the young spirit
> like
> > > > cartilage and the old spirit like bone---and how they relate to the
> > > above!
> > > >
> > > > Andrew
> > > >
> > > > ---------------
> > > >
> > > > Andrew Babson, Ph.D.
> > > > Lecturer
> > > > Graduate School of Education
> > > > University of Pennsylvania
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Monday, August 17, 2015, mike cole <mcole@ucsd.edu> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > I have been led to wonder -- what is the relationship between
> having
> > > fun
> > > > > and playing.  How do they differ? Does their relationship, if they
> > are
> > > > not
> > > > > reducible one to the other, change over the course of development?
> > Odd
> > > > how
> > > > > the category of fun is absent from developmental discourse.
> > > > > Mike
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > >
> > > > > It is the dilemma of psychology to deal as a natural science with
> an
> > > > > object that creates history. Ernst Boesch
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > sent from my phone
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Robert Lake  Ed.D.
> > > Associate Professor
> > > Social Foundations of Education
> > > Dept. of Curriculum, Foundations, and Reading
> > > Georgia Southern University
> > > Secretary/Treasurer-AERA- Paulo Freire Special Interest Group
> > > P. O. Box 8144
> > > Phone: (912) 478-0355
> > > Fax: (912) 478-5382
> > > Statesboro, GA  30460
> > > *He not busy being born is busy dying.*
> > > Bob Dylan (1964).
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> >
> > It is the dilemma of psychology to deal as a natural science with an
> > object that creates history. Ernst Boesch
> > ________________________________
> > [http://www.plymouth.ac.uk/images/email_footer.gif]<
> > http://www.plymouth.ac.uk/worldclass>
> >
> > This email and any files with it are confidential and intended solely for
> > the use of the recipient to whom it is addressed. If you are not the
> > intended recipient then copying, distribution or other use of the
> > information contained is strictly prohibited and you should not rely on
> it.
> > If you have received this email in error please let the sender know
> > immediately and delete it from your system(s). Internet emails are not
> > necessarily secure. While we take every care, Plymouth University accepts
> > no responsibility for viruses and it is your responsibility to scan
> emails
> > and their attachments. Plymouth University does not accept responsibility
> > for any changes made after it was sent. Nothing in this email or its
> > attachments constitutes an order for goods or services unless accompanied
> > by an official order form.
> >
> >
>

PNG image

PNG image

PNG image