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*To*: "eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity" <xmca-l@mailman.ucsd.edu>*Subject*: [Xmca-l] Re: Maths and science in Russia*From*: Ulvi İçil <ulvi.icil@gmail.com>*Date*: Mon, 22 Dec 2014 01:57:28 +0200*In-reply-to*: <A35E4398-DC27-49C7-9953-83CEC7275D2D@umich.edu>*List-archive*: <https://mailman.ucsd.edu/mailman/private/xmca-l>*List-help*: <mailto:xmca-l-request@mailman.ucsd.edu?subject=help>*List-id*: "eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity" <xmca-l.mailman.ucsd.edu>*List-post*: <mailto:xmca-l@mailman.ucsd.edu>*List-subscribe*: <https://mailman.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/xmca-l>, <mailto:xmca-l-request@mailman.ucsd.edu?subject=subscribe>*List-unsubscribe*: <https://mailman.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/xmca-l>, <mailto:xmca-l-request@mailman.ucsd.edu?subject=unsubscribe>*References*: <CABjfC8KQyGQiv=5pyRR6z8Jof0KroEdm03VwE43y_md0zzfN7Q@mail.gmail.com> <CAG1MBOH9B-yZVdu8N5BV157p4z9MpGxUsMQDtPrmgZDs2_Vyag@mail.gmail.com> <CABjfC8JUhGqkzh9hBLCwVvU_NV3c1yssVs77SNAZvMgZjpV9eA@mail.gmail.com> <626322EE-DC59-4C94-A4AD-5C54F6045589@umich.edu> <CABjfC8LxROkbW+FGwso3wxG2Q-B+KBwBmpvkbseYc88qZ=ELKQ@mail.gmail.com> <A35E4398-DC27-49C7-9953-83CEC7275D2D@umich.edu>*Reply-to*: "eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity" <xmca-l@mailman.ucsd.edu>*Sender*: <xmca-l-bounces+comm-xmca=mail.ucsd.edu@mailman.ucsd.edu>

Thank you very much Ed. 2014-12-22 1:53 GMT+02:00 Ed Wall <ewall@umich.edu>: > Ulvi > > Yes, Russia has and I suspect continues to be more successful > that the US in 8th grade and that, I think, might call in question seeming > US success in 4th grade (there are perhaps complicating factors). At least, > a number of people think so which is, as I said before, one reason for > recent reform efforts in the US. > > As regards the Russian mathematics curriculum, you might want to > take a look at a 1980 4th grade Russian mathematics text > > ftp://math.stanford.edu/pub/papers/milgram/russian-grade-4-problems.pdf > > This is significantly beyond, in places, what is taught to US 4th graders > and may, in part, speak to what happens by 8th grade. > > You might want to take a look at Russian Mathematics Education: History > and World Significance (Schmittau has a chapter). > > Ed > > On Dec 21, 2014, at 5:09 PM, Ulvi İçil wrote: > > > Thanks Ed. > > > > The picture I attached earlier may have misled me. In the below link. > > > > You seem to be right, Russia does not seem to be particularly successful. > > > > But according to this > > > > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trends_in_International_Mathematics_and_Science_Study > > . > > > > Countries' scores with flags. > > > > Russia seems still to be successful than US at TIMSS2011 for eight grade. > > > > On the other hand, I suppose that there is a considerable deterioration, > > decentralization and processes alike in Russia after 1990. > > > > About Piaget dominance in US and England; > > > > can it be thought that Piaget's dominance is hindering math curriculum to > > be a developed one because it does not take into account early > development > > of abstract thinking in children? > > > > My question about Russia's actual math curriculum is still open. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2014-12-22 0:48 GMT+02:00 Ed Wall <ewall@umich.edu>: > > > >> Ulvi > >> > >> According to the 2015 TIMSS, the average score of fourth graders in > >> the US is 541 where that of England and the Russian Federation is 542. I > >> know that, in general, the mathematics curriculum in the US and England > has > >> nothing much to do with Vygotsky (and yet a lot to do with Piaget). A > >> number of mathematics educators think that the math curriculum in the > early > >> grades in the US is not particularly successful (hat is one of the > reasons > >> behind some recent reform efforts in the US). Why do you think, given > these > >> average scores (and, of course, there are questions about TIMSS), the > >> curriculum in Russia is "quite successful?" > >> > >> Ed Wall > >> On Dec 21, 2014, at 4:15 PM, Ulvi İçil wrote: > >> > >>> Thanks Huw. > >>> Yes, I know in Davydov it is called learning activity but my question > was > >>> aimed at the curriculum situation in Russia, current math curriculum > >>> applied in Russia's primary schools? > >>> What is this curriculum? Is it the one proposed by Davydov or bearing > >>> another name? > >>> And to put it in terms of Vygotsky, is the curriculum currently > applied, > >>> and which seems to be quite successful, has anything to do with > >> Vygotskian > >>> theory in Russia and in other countries where maths seems to be a > >>> successful discipline in primary years. > >>> > >>> Best, > >>> Ulvi > >>> > >>> > >>> 2014-12-22 0:01 GMT+02:00 Huw Lloyd <huw.softdesigns@gmail.com>: > >>> > >>>> Ulvi, > >>>> > >>>> The essential 'method' is to facilitate students' own experimentation > >> with > >>>> methods. This is called learning activity. > >>>> > >>>> Huw > >>>> > >>>> On 21 December 2014 at 12:15, Ulvi İçil <ulvi.icil@gmail.com> wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>> Hello, > >>>>> > >>>>> I know there are some works comparing Russia (Davydov's curriculum) > and > >>>> US, > >>>>> and even some works done in US with an application of Davydov's, e.g. > >> by > >>>>> Schmittau. > >>>>> > >>>>> I would like to know, not in detail, but just in general, which main > >>>>> factors lie behind this success in Russia, it is Davydov, or Zarkov > or > >>>> any > >>>>> other scholar's method. > >>>>> > >>>>> Thanks in advance, > >>>>> > >>>>> Ulvi > >>>>> > >>>> > >> > >> > >> > > >

**Follow-Ups**:**[Xmca-l] Re: Maths and science in Russia***From:*Ed Wall <ewall@umich.edu>

**References**:**[Xmca-l] Maths and science in Russia***From:*Ulvi İçil <ulvi.icil@gmail.com>

**[Xmca-l] Re: Maths and science in Russia***From:*Huw Lloyd <huw.softdesigns@gmail.com>

**[Xmca-l] Re: Maths and science in Russia***From:*Ulvi İçil <ulvi.icil@gmail.com>

**[Xmca-l] Re: Maths and science in Russia***From:*Ed Wall <ewall@umich.edu>

**[Xmca-l] Re: Maths and science in Russia***From:*Ulvi İçil <ulvi.icil@gmail.com>

**[Xmca-l] Re: Maths and science in Russia***From:*Ed Wall <ewall@umich.edu>

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