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[Xmca-l] Re: Black Underachievement, etc.


I am a bit pessimistic.   I believe liberation from the vagaries of capitalist oppression can only come from the outside,  i.e., the earth itself fighting against the accumulative logic of capitalism, islamic fundamentalism,  etc. ..as educators we participate, contrary to Freire's dialogical pedagogy, in facilitating the oppression of the masses.  

Dr. Paul C. Mocombe
The Mocombeian Foundation, Inc.

-------- Original message --------
From: "valerie A. Wilkinson" <vwilk@inf.shizuoka.ac.jp> 
Date: 11/07/2013  6:28 PM  (GMT-05:00) 
To: "'eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity'" <xmca-l@mailman.ucsd.edu> 
Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Black Underachievement, etc. 
Members of XMCA forum (with special thanks to the discussion of Dr. Paul
Macombe and Carol Macdonald),
I must apologize for my "kamikaze dive" into a discussion of Tomlin,
Mocombe, and Wright's article.
I feel that we haven't really begun to discuss this article, but how can we
discuss it if I haven't read it?  Then if I read it, how can I speak to it?
Carol Macdonald, in her brief note below, opened an avenue with the line
"because in apartheid people was asked to stay with their "origins" in
separate physical spaces, as you no doubt know." This is not just Africa,
but Brazil, and India, etc.  This is closely connected with something I have
personally read and can talk about, The Pedagogy of Oppression. Paolo
Freire. We can see the constraints of oppression, of people hobbled and
burdened in the "legitimate" SLAVERY of capitalism. We educators must speak
about how to enhance the learning environment and enable individual children
to better themselves and the community - not design cunning ways to keep
"our brothers" down.  The proposed reflection on " Marxian conceptions of
identity construction within capitalist relations of production with the
Wittgensteinian notion of "languagegames" to offer a more appropriate
relational framework" sketches in the field and the framework for discussion
in this Extended Mind, Culture, Activity forum.
I am a full time teacher, challenged by my own environment, experiencing the
constraints of oppression new to me in an environment of a dominant culture
to which I am an immigrant.  I want to join this conversation so I hunt for
the connections using framing provided by General Systems Theory and my own
educational background and life experience.  I'm afraid I am rude and
ignorant, but I do not mean to be. Thank you.

-----Original Message-----
From: xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu
[mailto:xmca-l-bounces@mailman.ucsd.edu] On Behalf Of Carol Macdonald
Sent: Tuesday, November 05, 2013 9:28 PM
To: Dr. Paul C. Mocombe; eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity
Subject: [Xmca-l] Re: Black Underachievement, etc.

That is a valid point Paul.  There is now a movement which entails using
indigenous pedagogy - it started in the early eighties, but has not really
taken root.

Unfortunately in South Africa at that time, we could not facilitate the
developing of such, because in apartheid people was asked to stay with their
"origins" in separate physical spaces, as you no doubt know. Western ways
were ALL. With very small children statring out in literacy, (Grade 1) we
could start with culturally consonant pedagogy, such as the language
experience approach.  In one regio, there was what called a "mixed approach"
which I wrote about.

Black people   here generally wanted to buy in to western pedagogy and
western lifestyles, with conspicuous consumption and so on. There is now a
revaluing of "indigenous knowledge systems" (IKS), but it hasn't percolated
into formal education.

Sorry I can't articulate this paradigm in the same way as Andy and Paul, but
I do hope that I have made a valid point.


On 5 November 2013 13:59, Dr. Paul C. Mocombe

> Andy,
> The question you raised is directly tied to my theoretical framework.  
> It is my recognition that the black academic achievement gap can be 
> resolved through teaching standard english and mentoring, which made 
> me realize my own embourgeoisement, which simply further ties blacks 
> to the status quo as opposed to offering a counterhegemonic solution 
> to it.  I have begun to question my own methods...and it is my 
> research into the situation facing haiti which has enlightened me 
> ..the pro-US government is pushing education and the masses are 
> pushing education on the island for the same reasons, economic gain, 
> status, and upward mobility within a world threatened by 
> overproduction, consumption, etc.  Both positions are bourgeois and do 
> not offer solutions facing haiti within the context of the limits to 
> growth metaphysics of the earth itself.  In essence I have come to 
> realize that bourgeois education does not liberate one from the status
quo, but ties them to it.
> Dr. Paul C. Mocombe
> President
> The Mocombeian Foundation, Inc.
> www.mocombeian.com
> www.readingroomcurriculum.com
> -------- Original message --------
> From: Andy Blunden <ablunden@mira.net>
> Date: 11/05/2013  6:24 AM  (GMT-05:00)
> To: "Dr. Paul C. Mocombe" <pmocombe@mocombeian.com>
> Cc: "eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity" <xmca-l@mailman.ucsd.edu>, 
> Cecile.Wright@nottingham.ac.uk,carol Tomlin <info@caroltomlin.com>
> Subject: Re: [Xmca-l] Re: Black Underachievement, etc.
> None of these changes are either lytical or critical, Paul, (or rather 
> they are both), since these concepts simply mark alternating phases in 
> a developmental process.
> Unfortunately, while my interests are mostly in the domain of 
> social-theoretical fundamentals, your article was undoubtedly voted 
> for discussion on xmca because people wanted to learn what you say 
> about Black underachievement. So let me make a seguey by pointing out 
> that your Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/mocombeian says that 
> "The Mocombeian Foundation is a Literacy Foundation founded by Dr. Paul C.
> Mocombe that offers Mocombe's Reading Room Curriculum to help 
> inner-city youth close the achievement gap." But surely this runs 
> somewhat counter to the gist of the views you have expressed in this 
> exchange. You clearly do think that Black underachievement can be 
> overcome evidently without a global catastrophe and have launched a
project to that end.
> Could you elaborate on this? I.e., first of all, on how to tackle the 
> problems highlighted in your paper whilst avoiding the traps you see 
> in the kind of approaches most valued by xmca members?
> Andy
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> --
> *Andy Blunden*
> http://home.mira.net/~andy/
> Dr. Paul C. Mocombe wrote:
> > The problem with that assessment andy is that it makes the 
> > assumption that amidst lytical changes, which I am assuming come 
> > from praxis,  the ideological structure remains oblivious to the 
> > processes taking place...it does not.  It incorporates, refutes, 
> > etc.  I think polanyi's double movement is appropriate here.  The 
> > ideological superstructure frames lytical changes within the 
> > dialectical contradictions of its discourse rendering them 
> > innocuous. ..would you say homosexuality, pan-africanism, 
> > transgenderism, are lytical changes?  If they are, what would you 
> > say about gay marriage, or the death of pan-africanism amongst black
> >
> >
> > Dr. Paul C. Mocombe
> > President
> > The Mocombeian Foundation, Inc.
> > www.mocombeian.com
> > www.readingroomcurriculum.com
> >
> >
> >
> > -------- Original message --------
> > From: Andy Blunden <ablunden@mira.net>
> > Date: 11/04/2013 7:25 PM (GMT-05:00)
> > To: "Dr. Paul C. Mocombe" <pmocombe@mocombeian.com>
> > Cc: "eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity"
> > <xmca-l@mailman.ucsd.edu>,Cecile.Wright@nottingham.ac.uk,carol 
> > Tomlin <info@caroltomlin.com>
> > Subject: Re: [Xmca-l] Re: Black Underachievement, etc.
> >
> >
> > I think the fundamental flaw of this approach, Paul, is that it 
> > takes as its fundamental units, entities which are unchanging. Yes, 
> > an ideology is by definition, self-sustaining and self-justifying. 
> > But, while it is true that history is littered with disasters, and 
> > the critical periods of social change are indeed marked by 
> > catastrophe, these crtitical phases are prepared and constituted by 
> > phases of lytical change and are inseparable from them. This general 
> > character of development teaches us that it is a mistake to separate 
> > lytical and critical phases of development. I think that in order to 
> > grasp social life as essential lysubject to change, development and 
> > transformation, one must take as a fundamental unit of analysis 
> > something which is inherently a process of development. I use "project",
others simply call it "an activity".
> >
> > Andy
> >
> http://www.academia.edu/2365533/Collaborative_Project_as_a_Concept_for
> _Interdisciplinary_Human_Science_Research
> > --------------------------------------------------------------------
> > ----
> > *Andy Blunden*
> > http://home.mira.net/~andy/
> >
> >
> > Dr. Paul C. Mocombe wrote:
> > > Andy,
> > >
> > > Unfortunately, I am in agreement with althusser.  I cannot think 
> > > of one historical case to prove the contrary.  It is necessary for 
> > > one historical frame to replace another via catastrophe and
> > >  Can we truly say that the middle class represents an alternative 
> > > to the dominant ideology of the upper-class of owners and 
> > > high-level executives?  I do not think say.  Just the same, the 
> > > argument you raise is tantamount to the hybridity discourse of 
> > > homi bhabha...and I am in agreement with spivak, hybridity is not 
> > > an alternative to the discourse of the colonizer...it is using the 
> > > discourse of the colonizer to convict them of not identifying with 
> > > their logic, which the colonized accepts and reproduces.  This is 
> > > not liberating, nor does it offer an alternative to the discourse of
the colonizer.
> > >
> > >
> > > Dr. Paul C. Mocombe
> >
> >

Carol A  Macdonald Ph D (Edin)
Developmental psycholinguist
Academic, Researcher,  and Editor
Honorary Research Fellow: Department of Linguistics, Unisa