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Re: [xmca] Francois Cooren



Huw, thanks for the return to Montreal.

Yeah, I am a fan of processual views that favor relations over substance,
and in that way of thinking, "organizations" are not essential things
(elements), but exist only in and by the processes the constitute them.
Communication is the primary means by which these organizations are
(re)produced, and that is where I am optimistic about the MSOC's approach.

As for your question about "thoughts around the distribution of
appreciating different problems in the process of emerging roles?", I must
confess that I don't follow the question. I don't know the MSOC school well
enough to recognize their language, so maybe you are using their language?

Some clarification of the question would be helpful to me.
-greg

On Tue, Jun 5, 2012 at 5:26 AM, Huw Lloyd <huw.softdesigns@gmail.com> wrote:

> On 5 June 2012 04:56, Joseph Gilbert <joeg4us@roadrunner.com> wrote:
>
> Greg,
>
> Re your Montreal question, did you have any thoughts around the
> distribution of appreciating different problems in the process of emerging
> roles?  On a smaller, and perhaps simpler, scale I recall situations where
> problems had been setup for children to stumble upon, but that were
> seemingly not registered by them.  A difficult problem left standing would
> amount to... what?  A conversation and vocabulary around site boundaries?
>
> The suggestion that  'communication is the "site and surface" of
> organizations' seems productive, though I'm not taking this as
> comprehensive, rather as a reference to communicational exchange. If we
> want to be comprehensive then I think we need to include the organisational
> behaviour within the circumference of communication.
>
> Huw
>
>
> >
> >                Joseph
> >
> > On Jun 4, 2012, at 5:01 PM, Huw Lloyd wrote:
> >
> > > They're of no consequence for those deaf to reason.  ;)
> > >
> > > Huw
> > >
> > > On 4 June 2012 10:53, Andy Blunden <ablunden@mira.net> wrote:
> > >
> > >> And here's about deaf-blind people:
> > >> http://www.marxists.org/**archive/meshcheryakov/**awakening/index.htm
> <
> > http://www.marxists.org/archive/meshcheryakov/awakening/index.htm>
> > >>
> > >> Andy
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> Peter Smagorinsky wrote:
> > >>
> > >>> According to Gallaudet University (which is for deaf people),
> > >>> http://research.gallaudet.edu/**Demographics/deaf-US.php<
> > http://research.gallaudet.edu/Demographics/deaf-US.php>
> > >>> There are a number of listings of deaf people of influence, e.g.,
> > >>> http://www.start-american-**
> > sign-language.com/famous-deaf-**people.html<
> > http://www.start-american-sign-language.com/famous-deaf-people.html>
> > >>> http://www.op97.org/teach-**learn/documents/**PeopleWhoAreDeaf.pdf<
> > http://www.op97.org/teach-learn/documents/PeopleWhoAreDeaf.pdf>
> > >>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/**List_of_deaf_people<
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_deaf_people>
> > >>> http://www.deafpeople.com/
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>> -----Original Message-----
> > >>> From: xmca-bounces@weber.ucsd.edu [mailto:xmca-bounces@weber.**
> > ucsd.edu<xmca-bounces@weber.ucsd.edu>]
> > >>> On Behalf Of Joseph Gilbert
> > >>> Sent: Sunday, June 03, 2012 6:12 PM
> > >>> To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity
> > >>> Subject: Re: [xmca] Francois Cooren
> > >>>
> > >>> Peter,
> > >>> What percentage of any population is deaf and what influence do they
> > >>> exert upon the world-view of their society?
> > >>>
> > >>>               Joseph
> > >>>
> > >>> On Jun 3, 2012, at 3:00 PM, Peter Smagorinsky wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>> I also wonder, what about deaf people?
> > >>>>
> > >>>> -----Original Message-----
> > >>>> From: xmca-bounces@weber.ucsd.edu [mailto:xmca-
> > bounces@weber.ucsd.edu]
> > >>>> On Behalf Of Vera John-Steiner
> > >>>> Sent: Sunday, June 03, 2012 5:54 PM
> > >>>> To: 'eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity'
> > >>>> Subject: RE: [xmca] Francois Cooren
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Hi Joseph
> > >>>> I wonder whether the ultimate finality of the word--"everything is
> > >>>> relative to the word"--provides a too narrow, monistic view.
> > >>>> Euclidean geometry is rich in proofs which are presented through
> > visual
> > >>>> abstraction. These can be explained verbally but their persuasive
> > power is
> > >>>> visual.
> > >>>> This is an interesting though wandering discussion from toes to
> > Euclid.
> > >>>> Vera
> > >>>> -----Original Message-----
> > >>>> From: xmca-bounces@weber.ucsd.edu [mailto:xmca-
> > bounces@weber.ucsd.edu]
> > >>>> On Behalf Of Joseph Gilbert
> > >>>> Sent: Sunday, June 03, 2012 3:32 PM
> > >>>> To: eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity
> > >>>> Subject: Re: [xmca] Francois Cooren
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Nothing communicates as profoundly as vocal sounds, - motions of the
> > >>>> human body -. Everything is named, - identified -, by sounds made by
> > our
> > >>>> body. Our own body-emotional goings on is the currency by which all
> > else is
> > >>>> valued. We relate to our world with our word.
> > >>>> Everything is reletive to the word. The "final word" on anything IS
> > the
> > >>>> word.
> > >>>> The only handle we have on the meaning of our world is the effect on
> > us
> > >>>> of the sounds of our words. We can prove nothing and can only feel
> our
> > >>>> vocal sounds for information of how we are affected by things. It
> > takes
> > >>>> different words to communicate different information. Bear in mind
> > that
> > >>>> words are fundamentally sounds and secondarily, referential tools.
> > When we
> > >>>> refer to a thing, the referential tool is between ourselves and the
> > thing.
> > >>>> We perceive and are affected by the tool - the word - first and
> > foremost
> > >>>> and then also by the thought of the referred-to thing. Subliminally,
> > the
> > >>>> word defines the thing:
> > >>>> Consciously, the thing defines the word.
> > >>>>
> > >>>>               Joseph Gilbert
> > >>>>
> > >>>> On Jun 2, 2012, at 8:59 PM, Greg Thompson wrote:
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>>> Anyone out there know much about Francois Cooren or the Montreal
> > School
> > >>>>> of Organizational Communication?
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>> As for the former, Cooren's book Action and Agency in Dialogue
> asks:
> > >>>>> "What if human interactants were not the only ones to be
> considered,
> > >>>>> paraphrasing Austin (1962), as "doing things with words"? That is,
> > what if
> > >>>>> other "things" could also be granted the status of agents in a
> > dialogical
> > >>>>> situation?"
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>> As for the latter, the MSOC is characterized by wikipedia as:
> > >>>>> "taking communication as the "site and surface" of organizations,
> > >>>>> meaning that the latter emerge from and are maintained by
> > communication
> > >>>>> processes."
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>> Both of these seem to be very important points that, I thought,
> > >>>>> articulate well with recent XMCA conversations.
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>> Anyone have any insight?
> > >>>>> Perhaps a recommendation?
> > >>>>> -greg
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>> --
> > >>>>> Gregory A. Thompson, Ph.D.
> > >>>>> Sanford I. Berman Post-Doctoral Scholar Laboratory of Comparative
> > Human
> > >>>>> Cognition Department of Communication University of California, San
> > Diego
> > >>>>> http://ucsd.academia.edu/**GregoryThompson<
> > http://ucsd.academia.edu/GregoryThompson>
> > >>>>> ______________________________**____________
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> > >>>
> > >>
> > >> --
> > >> ------------------------------**------------------------------**
> > >> ------------
> > >> *Andy Blunden*
> > >> Joint Editor MCA: http://www.tandfonline.com/**toc/hmca20/18/1<
> > http://www.tandfonline.com/toc/hmca20/18/1>
> > >> Home Page: http://home.mira.net/~andy/
> > >> Book: http://www.brill.nl/concepts
> > >>
> > >>
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> > >>
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-- 
Gregory A. Thompson, Ph.D.
Sanford I. Berman Post-Doctoral Scholar
Laboratory of Comparative Human Cognition
Department of Communication
University of California, San Diego
http://ucsd.academia.edu/GregoryThompson
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