[Date Prev][Date Next][Thread Prev][Thread Next][Date Index][Thread Index]
Re: [xmca] need CHAT training
Dear Martin,
I sympathise as starting out in CHT based on vygotsky is not simple. firstly i suggest that you
understand the different usages of the perspective such as has been put in place by Cole, Daniels, Engestrom and
Rogoff, Gutierrez, Hedegaard etc etc. there are many usages of this initial theory and each has developed a particular
way to address the method of investigation and the analysis. if you go back into the discussion on this site with Larry
that was held in July August there were some papers distributed that might be of help. It was on a discussion on some
of the interpretations of this theory.
I have to dash off to work now but will be happy to discuss more if you ask
some further questions.
Steve thanks for all these links what a gold mine of data:)
Denise
----Message d'origine----
De: stevegabosch@me.com
Date: 08.09.2010 03:27
À: "eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity"<xmca@weber.ucsd.edu>
Objet: Re:
[xmca] need CHAT training
I think Martin suggests an excellent line of thinking.
Peter and Alcione, on reading your
emails, the work of Kris Gutierrez
immediately came to my mind. You are working with college students
and people
about to enter the workforce, while Kris and colleagues
have focused more on younger students and student-teacher
relations,
at least in the articles I am familiar with. But the methodology she
uses is strongly based on CHAT and
could be very helpful. So I am
providing links to a few articles for you to browse.
As she and a colleague explain
in a 2006 paper, "For more than a
decade, we have been involved in research with students for whom
English is not
the home language, learning what children can do across
a range of practices and contexts, and trying to understand
better the
various pathways and contextual supports that promote their literacy
learning."
In fact, this first
article I am providing a link to begins with the
question Martin asks - of how to pose "the problem" in the first
place. Something to keep in mind is that by posing "cultural"
identity and "professional" identity in the way you
touch on in your e-
mail, you are implicitly viewing not just culture but also social
class in specific ways. After
all, you are training these pre-service
teachers to be professional members of a workforce. And being of non-
dominant cultural backgrounds, they are also dealing with the issue of
being members - or at least being considered
members - of what is
obviously a very large and varied language, cultural and ethnic
minority in the US. I
especially appreciate the insights Kris and
colleagues provide on those issues. So this first article helps to
drive out some of the problems involved with how to initially pose
"the problem," just as Martin suggests.
Orellana,
M. & Gutiérrez, K. (2006). What's the problem? Constructing
different genres for the study of English Learners.
Research in the
Teaching of English., 41 (1), 118-123.
http://gseis.ucla.edu/faculty/files/gutierrez/gutierrez_RT0411Last.pdf
************
This next article precedes the
above one and describes some of the
more general issues involved. "In this brief essay, we take the
opportunity to
engage our literacy colleagues in a re-examination of
approaches in describing English Learners and other non-
dominant
students in literacy research." In your case, you are training
teachers who will be very engaged in such
issues - as you are
yourselves by conducting this study - and even just by being their
teachers and part of their
support system.
Gutiérrez, K. & Orellana, M. (2006). The problem of English Learners:
Constructing genres of
difference. .Research in the Teaching of
English., 40 (4), 502-507.
http://gseis.ucla.edu/faculty/files/gutierrez/gutierrez_RT0404Last.pdf
*************
There are a few more articles
available on Kris's site at http://gseis.ucla.edu/faculty/members/gutierrez
**************
On the lchc site is a paper
Kris and two colleagues published in 1995
that I found very interesting and which generated a very good
discussion
on xmca a few years ago, as I recall. It discusses the
underlife and counterscripts of students in what seems to me
to be a
typical LA classroom. I worked in a factory for 28 years and some of
the methodology Kris uses to analyze
these classroom dynamics between
the students and the teacher could be applied to worker-management
relations on a
factory floor (script and counterscript, underlife,
cultural repertoires, etc.) Possibly germane to your project,
perhaps
some the methodological ideas this article describes would also work
in relation to the dynamics of
training teachers, especially those
with "hybrid" (Mexican, US, etc.) identities.
I liked the way Kris and
colleagues in this article framed a number of
ideas and tools from quite a variety of perspectives - Bakhtin,
Bourdieu, Goffman, Gee, Geertz, Luke, Foucault, Vygotsky, Leont'ev,
Cole, Engstrom, Rogoff, Lave, Wenger, Freire, and
others - succinctly
tied these ideas and tools together within a cultural-historical
activity theory framework -
and then showed how to apply these tools
within this framework in an analysis of a recorded classroom
situation.
The title of the paper comes from one of the scenes being
examined where the teacher is trying to teach a lesson
about the 1954
Supreme Court ruling Brown vs Bd of Education while students get
laughs out of diverting the
discussion toward James Brown and other
jokes. I think the paper offers some very interesting insights into
what
is actually going on. My inclination is that this paper could
serve as a possible model for doing certain kinds of
empirical
research and CHAT analysis - and in any case offers a very interesting
methodological application of CHAT
theory in a dynamic social
situation where one side controls the script and the other side must
empower itself with
counterscripts and an underlife.
Script, Counterscript, and Underlife in the Classroom: James Brown
versus Brown v.
Board of Education.
by Kris Gutierrez, Betsy Rymes, University of California, Los Angeles
Joanne Larson, University of
Rochester
http://lchc.ucsd.edu/MCA/Paper/kris.pdf
Sorry to throw so many articles at you. My suggestion is to just
browse and
see what resonates. I hope you find something helpful.
- Steve
On Sep 7, 2010, at 1:56 PM, Martin Packer wrote:
> Hi Alcione and Peter,
>
> First thing I say to anyone who comes to me for research advice is,
> what question do
you want to answer? The clearer the question, the
> easier the decisions about conceptual framework and
methodological
> tools and techniques.
>
> Here the question seems to be: How does the development of these
>
student teachers' cultural identities interact with their
> professional identities? Can you articulate that a bit
more for us?
> For one thing, it seems to presuppose something that would need to
> be confirmed, namely that there
*is* an interaction between two
> identities. That may well be the case, but it may be better to frame
> the
question in a more open ended way. Or perhaps that's not the
> central question?
>
> Martin
>
> On Sep 7, 2010, at 4:
37 PM, Peter Farruggio wrote:
>
>>
>> This is a recent exchange between Mike and my colleague, Alcione
>> Ostorga,
about our interest in learning more about how to use CHAT
>> for a longitudinal case study we'd like to do with a
group of our
>> bilingual preservice students.
>>
>> I'm going to follow Mike's suggestion and tap into the
collective
>> brain power on xmca to see if anybody can guide us in learning how
>> to use CHAT
>>
>> Pete
Farruggio
>> ________________________________________
>> From: Alcione Ostorga
>> Sent: Monday, August 16, 2010 4:03 PM
>> To: lchcmike@gmail.com; Peter Farruggio
>> Subject: RE: need CHAT training
>>
>> Hello Mike,
>> Nice to meet you
too.
>> I am on vacation this week so I may be a bit slow to reply.
>>
>> I am really interested in using CHAT for our
studies. From the
>> little I have read about CHAT, I see that it offers a lot of
>> potential for our multiple
studies in bilingual preparation because
>> in my opinion, it offers the most appropriate theoretical
>> foundation
to examine our bilingual teacher development. I like
>> the way it examines learning from a context based
perspective,
>> taking into consideration the sociocultural and historical
>> aspects. I really think that to
understand the development of our
>> pre service teachers we need to consider their history, their
>> experiences
both in our program and in their lives. Since we are
>> situated in the US/ Mexico border, the development of
these
>> preservice teachers is heavily impacted by their hybrid identities
>> as both American and Mexican.
Multilingualism is also an important
>> component and we cannot forget the history of the area and how it
>>
impacts the overall development of everyone here.
>>
>> Our research project has multiple layers. Some of us are
focusing
>> on very specific aspects of our bilingual teacher preparation
>> program. I am particularly interested
in examining the development
>> of professional identities in our teachers and how the development
>> of their
cultural identities interacts with their professional
>> identities. We have a lot of data. from cultural identity
surveys
>> and online discussions, educational philosophy assignments, focus
>> group discussions that asked for
their perspectives on the program
>> and some incredible assignments. Some are very reflective, like the
>>
development of a classroom management plan and video analisis of
>> thematic units used in teaching children in a
sumer library
>> program. In the fall, I will be doing observations of student
>> teaching. As a long term plan, I
will observe some of these
>> participants when they become teachers. I am interested in
>> examining their growth
as teachers longitudinally from the time
>> they entered the program last fall semester to the completion of
>>
their first year as teachers which will be December of 2011.
>>
>> Although, I think CHAT is the way to go in my study,
I must also
>> state that I am a novice and have only recently become familiar
>> with CHAT. I realize that is a
complex theory, because it is based
>> on examining the world from multiple perspectives. I think this is
>> one of
the positive aspects of CHAT. After all, the world is
>> complex and there are many simplistic approaches that are
overly
>> superficial and cannot possibly help us to fully understand human
>> development. I am not interested in
those approaches. But because
>> CHAT is complex, I feel I need to really learn it before I can use
>> it.
>>
>> I
am now getting familiar with the vocabulary and main concepts
>> through a lit research of the latest writings and
studies that have
>> used CHAT. A big question I have at this point is what kings of
>> analytical methods are
used in CHAT studies? Are qualitative
>> methods generally applied in other kinds of studies also applied in
>>
studies that use CHAT as an analytical lens? Or have CHAT theorists
>> developed their own methods for analyzing data
that best fit
>> activity theory? This is only the beginning, to fully use CHAT as a
>> foundation for our
research, we need to get some good professional
>> development in the use of CHAT as a theoretical basis for our
>>
analysis and interpretations of the development of bilingual
>> teachers.
>>
>> In the meantime, I will check the
XMCA. Do we have to subscribe to
>> the listserv to post questions?
>>
>> Thanks Pete for making this dialogue
possible. Let's see if we can
>> plan a video conference for us to learn more about how to use
>> activity theory.
>>
>> Alcione
>>
>>
>> My
>>
>> Alcione N. Ostorga, Ph. D
>> Associate Professor
>> Department of Curriculum &
Instruction
>> College of Education
>> The University of texas Pan-American
>> Edinburg, TX
>>
>>
>>
________________________________
>> From: mike cole [lchcmike@gmail.com]
>> Sent: Friday, August 13, 2010 6:13 PM
>>
To: Peter Farruggio
>> Cc: Alcione Ostorga
>> Subject: Re: need CHAT training
>>
>> Peter--
>>
>> Skype works pretty
well, even for small group- small group. I will
>> think of other refs (some of Engestrom's papers come to mine
>>
because he follows cases and he is always thoughtful) but I cannot
>> help recommending the chapter in Luria's
chapter on romantic
>> science from his autobio.
>>
>>
>> Hi Alcione, nice to meet you! Either you or Peter should
get on
>> XMCA and post the question about case studies and CHAT. I'll bet
>> people have not thought much about
that issue in that way, but
>> rather, they have unconsciously been using case study methods under
>> the banner of
>> "qualitative research". There are several such articles in Mind,
>> Culture, and Activity over the years.
>>
>>
mike
>>
>> On Fri, Aug 13, 2010 at 4:03 PM, Peter Farruggio
>> <pfarruggio@utpa.edu<mailto:pfarruggio@utpa.edu>>
wrote:
>> Mike,
>>
>> Thanks for the rapid, thoughtful reply. I'm copying to my
>> colleague, Alcione Ostorga,
because she's the one with the interest
>> in using CHAT for the study. Several of us are interested, but
>> she's
the one who brought it up. She can jump in with a precis, as
>> you suggest.
>>
>> I like the idea of doing a
videoconference with you as an initial
>> brainstorming session. We have the technical capacity to set
>> something
up to have an open conversation.
>>
>> Could you recommend some readings for us to do prior to such a
>>
conversation? Maybe some concrete stuff that shows how others have
>> used CHAT integrating the big picture
(institutions, communities,
>> local & state politics and policy making, etc) with the finer focus
>> (our students
moving through the system and into their careers)
>>
>> I'll wait for Alcione to explain to you before we think about
some
>> teleconferencing.
>>
>> Thanks again,
>>
>> Pete
>> ________________________________________
>> From: mike
cole [lchcmike@gmail.com<mailto:lchcmike@gmail.com>]
>> Sent: Friday, August 13, 2010 5:44 PM
>> To: Peter Farruggio
>>
Subject: Re: need CHAT training
>>
>> Pete-
>>
>> If you could perhaps send a precis of your proposal to XMCA, it
>>
would allow you to tap into a lot more brain power. The general
>> issue of case studies from a CHAT perspective is a
challenging one.
>> Maybe Luria will make a comeback?
>>
>> Also, I can interact from skype or Polycom but basically
do not
>> travel any more. Maybe a preliminary chat about CHAT via that zero
>> cost route would be helpful?
>>
mike
>>
>> On Fri, Aug 13, 2010 at 10:47 AM, Peter Farruggio <pfarruggio@utpa.edu
>> <mailto:pfarruggio@utpa.
edu><mailto:pfarruggio@utpa.edu<mailto:pfarruggio@utpa.edu
>> >>> wrote:
>> Mike,
>>
>> We have a faculty team in
bilingual teacher ed that has been
>> working together for two years on research about our teacher
>> preparation
program. We'd like to do a longitudinal case study of
>> some of our students as they finish with us and go into
the
>> teaching profession. We've already been teaching an experimental
>> cohort of students as a pretty cohesive
faculty team for the past
>> three semesters.
>>
>> We'd like to do our study from a CHAT orientation, as best we
>> understand it. To help us, we'd like to find a good CHAT "trainer"
>> who could come down here to South Texas to
meet with us and lead a
>> professional development session about how to use CHAT with our
>> circumstances. We
have a federal grant, so we can pay a reasonable
>> fee plus travel, lodging, etc.
>>
>> Would you recommend
somebody, or put the word out to help us find
>> such a person?
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Pete Farruggio
>> University of
Texas Pan American
>> Edinburg, TX
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> xmca mailing list
>>
xmca@weber.ucsd.edu
>> http://dss.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/xmca>
> _______________________________________________
> xmca mailing list
>
xmca@weber.ucsd.edu
> http://dss.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/xmca
_______________________________________________
xmca mailing list
xmca@weber.ucsd.edu
http://dss.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/xmca
_______________________________________________
xmca mailing list
xmca@weber.ucsd.edu
http://dss.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/xmca