RE: Further historical thoughts on this thread Re: [xmca] Zhozephina Shif – something in English?

[Achilles Delari Junior <achilles_delari@hotmail.com>]

Hi Larry, 

This is very interesting and so important... But I try to open the attached and nothing happens, I don't know about technical problems at my mail server... Could you send to me again, at delari@uol.com.br , please? I will read immediately. I guess I will compile all the posts in that thread too, for to send too xmca...

Thank you so much.

Achilles.




> From: lpurss@shaw.ca
> To: lchcmike@gmail.com; xmca@weber.ucsd.edu
> Subject: Further historical thoughts on this thread Re: [xmca] Zhozephina Shif – something in English?
> Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2010 11:07:38 -0800
> CC: 
> 
> Hi Achilles, Andy, Mike, and others
> I know this thread was dropped a week ago but it has continued to turn over
> in my mind.
> I've attached an article by Danzinger that elaborates on the themes of this
> thread and introduced a framework I thought was interesting.
> He suggests when we study the history and evolution of psychological and
> discursive objects we should consider 3 separated but interweaving levels of
> analysis.
> He prefers the term epistemic objects to discursive objects as the article
> explains.
> The 3  frameworks are 1) The person's biography  2) the situated social
> practices in which the epistemic objects had their historical development
> and 3) the discursive history of the formation of the psychological object.
> He believes that in our contemporary theorizing we are biasing the
> discursive and personal biographical frames and under theorizing the
> historical social practices.
> 
> Achilles, when you elaborated the complexity of the number of variables that
> must be considered when exploring the emergence and development of a
> "tradition"
> it seemed overwhelming.  Danzinger's proposal is one possible "map" for
> differentiating various strands and then interweaving them together.
> What do you think of the article
> Larry
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "mike cole" <lchcmike@gmail.com>
> To: "eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity" <xmca@weber.ucsd.edu>
> Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2010 2:37 PM
> Subject: Re: [xmca] Zhozephina Shif – something in English?
> 
> 
> Very interesting thread.
> I was struck by the following, Achilles:
> You write
> He thought that a better way is dialog itself, the true is not with me, not
> with you, and not with nobody and/or with everybody - the truth can
> historicaly emerge in.....
> 
> This is very reminiscent of Vygotsky way of talking about consciousness at
> the end of Thinking and Speech.
> 
> mike
> 
> On Sat, Jan 16, 2010 at 1:40 PM, Achilles Delari Junior <
> achilles_delari@hotmail.com> wrote:
> 
> >
> > Hi Larry,I think that all you said is about many crucial problems to us,
> > not only related to the history of a (plural) "way of thinking" in
> > psychology, but related to all our historical-cultural conditions as human
> > beings too. Vygotsky, I understand loved the the "Truth", and the search
> for
> > the "Truth", it is something that we can see in one of his letters to
> Luria
> > (1926), after even quoted by Valsiner and van der Veer, and by Veresov
> too:
> > "For me the primary question is the question of method, that is for me the
> > question of truth…" - but even understand the actual meaning of such a
> word
> > as "truth" is not a easy task, because of the own polissemic character of
> > it, because there is obstinate fights about what this word can mean in
> > different social contexts, because this meaning is not independent from a
> > "second" (a concrete situated interlocutor) and from a "third" (an
> anonymous
> > and generic social interlocutor in the time in that this word is said and
> > beyond, projecting it in time, in future, in the "Great Temporality" - in
> > Bakhtin words again)... But, in my naive reading, I guess that the was, at
> > least two traditions in Vygotsky's concept of "truth", the spinozian (with
> > the statement that there is nothing totally unkowing in Nature, i.e., in
> all
> > that exist, in all that embraces reality), and, of course, the marxian
> (with
> > the statement that the question of objective truth is not only a
> discursive
> > rhetoric task, but mainly a question of praxis, therefore a question of
> > actual transformation of the reality we try to explain with our words)...
> > Then if Vygotsky did not leaves out the concept and the desire of a truth,
> I
> > guess this is not in a classical, platonic and/or scholastic fashion
> > (tradition?) to approach this problem. I understand that this is not a
> > peripheral problem in Vygotsky's though and project to historical-cultural
> > psychology. But this can create several disputes, inside the arena of the
> > signs "truth", "method", and even "heuristics", for sure. The heuristic
> > problem, in sense of construction of paths to construct knowledge about
> > human condition and/or permanent transformation of that (social)condition,
> > the methodological problem, in the same sense, seems to be almost always
> in
> > the forefront in Vygotsky's concerns... If we can understand better the
> > social (complex, non-linear) formation of a trend of thinking in twenty
> > century Russian (and International) psychology, it is reasonable suppose
> > that we would can understand better another cultural collective movements
> of
> > creation of discourses and practices mediated by them. Particularly I
> wonder
> > that dialogic criteria to search the "truth" is very useful too. Bakhtin,
> in
> > this sense, is against not only "dogmatic" concept of truth, but even
> > against "relativistic" one... He though that a better way is dialog
> itself,
> > the true is not with me, not with you, and not with nobody an/or with
> > everybody - the truth can historicaly emerges in dialogical process... In
> > this sense, the different versions for the historical facts must not be
> > simply sawed as many equally true versions, in their inner logic and
> > structure all equally valid (relativistic approach), nor a question
> > exclusively about there are people lying when other are telling the real
> and
> > unquestionable truth (dogmatic approach) - but the fight between different
> > versions itself can be the own embodiment of the possible historical truth
> > to construct. But methodologically it is really not easy, to put in fight
> > that confrontation of the versions of the facts, even more many facts are
> > not like a meteorological happening to which people can say "It was a
> little
> > breath" and/or "it was a big torment" and then we must return to objective
> > fact to prove two versions and find the real true. Of course in history,
> in
> > psychology, the things are not in this fashion, because the own "versions"
> > becomes constitutive of the "facts" (i.e. what we call "version" is a
> > "discursive fact", an "speech act", etc.), and we are not in a very
> > comfortable position to decide. The textual analysis, the hermeneutic and
> > exegetic tools are very important and very useful and absolutely necessary
> > in this impossible mission, of course. But even this methodology to
> > understand the texts is constituted by some believes that we have/acquire
> > about what is the "text", what is "meaning", what is "reality", "truth"
> and
> > "lies", and who is the "subject" that produces this things in his/her
> social
> > relations, cultural contexts, etc... These believes about how to do our
> > hermeneutic task are historically constituted too, are not outside
> history,
> > supra-positioned respect the own text, in any sense, this exegetical
> > tradition is some kind of recreation of original texts too, and a new
> verse
> > to the play that must goes on, a part of the "tradition" (and
> contradiction)
> > too. Self-consciousness of this exegetic limit (to be a historical been in
> > the same time when we are trying to decode historical encrypted messages)
> > seems to be an interesting step... Because in future can will exist many
> > researchers telling about the lies we are just telling today. Even so, in
> a
> > "vygotskian tradition" we can not absolutely abdicate the quest for
> truth...
> > To do this can be to make a choice that will represent a more deep rupture
> > with the former project (if the existence of a "project" is not only an
> > illusion of my own mind), in my modest opinion.Achilles
> > > Date: Sat, 16 Jan 2010 10:36:28 -0800
> > > From: lpurss@shaw.ca
> > > Subject: Re:  Re: [xmca] Zhozephina Shif – something in English?
> > > To: xmca@weber.ucsd.edu
> > >
> > > Hi Achilles
> > >
> > > Your questions are fascinating as an inquiry of the constructs or
> > heuristic processes of emerging "traditions" "schools of thought"
> > "paradigms" "Discourses" as cultural patterns which we articulate and
> > INHABIT.
> > > When you mention Freud, the extensive literature that has developed
> > exploring the formation of a "tradition" of psychoanalysis as a
> sociological
> > and cultural "way of knowing" is informative of epistemological ways of
> > creating knowledge. How different versions of the "truth"are contested and
> > "true believers" who are arguing for a specific version (as "dogma")  make
> > validity claims  of CERTAINTY for their "true" version (as they believe
> > Freud saw the world) is a process of narrative construction worth studying
> > in its own right. In fact the sociology of knowledge is a "tradition which
> > does just that.
> > > In exploring Vygotsky's contribution to a new emerging "perspective" or
> > vantage point from which to "see" human "nature" the same processes are at
> > PLAY.
> > >
> > > The metaphor that best captures the DYNAMIC PROCESS at play in the
> > creation or construction of "traditions" seems to be the metaphor of
> > CONVERSATION (as the process of sharing particular perspectives not to
> > confirm your particular perspective but as a conscious process that a
> THIRD
> > perspective that is NOVEL and emerges within the open space of the
> > conversation is constructed and each participants version (which is held
> > tentatively as a FALLIBLE perspective) is enlarged as each conversant's
> > "horizon of understanding" is expanded.
> > > The part that I'm curious about (in my ZPD) is how to create social
> > structures where this fallible position can be nurtured and the vitality
> of
> > conversation as creating THIRDNESS replaces the need for "traditions" as
> > locations of dogma as "truth".
> > > It is this SENSIBILITY towards "knowing" within the CHAT collective (in
> > contrast to SENSE) that I appreciate so much as a place which invites an
> > open space to generate THIRDNESS. ( I apologize if I'm using this term in
> a
> > way that muddles other conceptions of thirdness such as Peirce)
> "Thirdness"
> > as a spirit of inquiry does capture the spirit of NOVELTY created in
> > communities of inquiry.
> > > It also helps to explain when thirdness collapses into CERTAINTY and
> > scholars such as Freud or Vygotsky get locked into dogmatic traditions.
> > > The question to be answered is how do we keep "traditions" open to
> > novelty in a spirit of thirdness.
> > >
> > > Larry
> > >
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: Bella Kotik-Friedgut <bella.kotik@gmail.com>
> > > Date: Saturday, January 16, 2010 3:03 am
> > > Subject: Re: [xmca] Zhozephina Shif – something in English?
> > > To: lchcmike@gmail.com, "eXtended Mind, Culture, Activity" <
> > xmca@weber.ucsd.edu>
> > >
> > > > As a student I took part in Leontjev's course on geleral
> > > > psychology and the
> > > > his distancing was not obvious (at least for us as students
> > > > because one of
> > > > the compulsory tasks was to read "  Thinking and Speech"
> > > > and to be examined
> > > > fully on one book as well as another task to read Leontjev;s
> > > > "Problems of
> > > > development of mind") As for the tradition: Luria's "Basics of
> > > > Neuropsychology" is based on Vygotsky's ideas  quite
> > > > explicitly. Is this an
> > > > expression of cultural-historical tradition?
> > > >
> > > > Bella Kotik
> > > > .
> > > > On Sat, Jan 16, 2010 at 5:57 AM, mike cole
> > > > <lchcmike@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Achilles. I think we have lived to witness exactly "non-liner
> > > > genetic> course
> > > > > or history."  For many complex reasons Vygotsky "missed"
> > > > the dominant trend
> > > > > of his times, behaviorism/psychoanalysis" in a way that
> > > > anticipated the
> > > > > turn
> > > > > away from Piaget (who did not become "mainstream" in USA until late
> > > > > 1950's-60's) and banishment of Freud from mainstream
> > > > psychology to cultural
> > > > > studies circles and, in watered down fashion, human potential
> > > > movements) so
> > > > > that when
> > > > > Toulmin wrote about "The mozart of psychology" his clearly
> > > > idiocyncratic> interpretation fell like a match into a pool of
> > > > gasoline (that looked for
> > > > > all the world like a pool of water). The "Vygotsky
> > > > > explosion" that many, such as Laszlo Garai in Hungary have
> > > > written about,
> > > > > and that so irritate many, was the result.
> > > > >
> > > > > Its really a fascinating process to have lived through,
> > > > contributed to,
> > > > > been guilty of, etc.
> > > > >
> > > > > And look at one of its consequences. We chatter across the
> > > > globe as easily,
> > > > > or more easily, than we get a loaf of bread...... while others
> > > > starve.>
> > > > > Non linear for sure.
> > > > > mike
> > > > >
> > > > > On Fri, Jan 15, 2010 at 6:37 PM, Achilles Delari Junior <
> > > > >  achilles_delari@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I am not historicist, but I can remember something from
> > > > Benjamin about
> > > > > > "tradition" x "conservationism" ... That tradition is not always
> > > > > > conservative nor authoritarian, there are democratic, dialogical,
> > > > > > revolutionary traditions too... I guess - in addition - that
> > > > perhaps> > something like a "cultural tradition" (any cultural
> > > > tradition, in diverse
> > > > > > fields of society collective actions) can have a non-liner
> > > > genetic course
> > > > > or
> > > > > > history... I dont know if this is terminologically possible
> > > > or adequate.
> > > > > But
> > > > > > a psychological theory, and/or approach, and/or
> > > > "perspective" (has some
> > > > > > people tell here in Brazil: "historical-cultural
> > > > perspective") - can not
> > > > > be
> > > > > > like a dogmatic religious tradition (despite I have any
> > > > doubts if even
> > > > > > religions can be strictly dogmatic all the time without any
> > > > secular> > influences and changes to dialog with broader
> > > > cultural contexts, etc.).
> > > > > In
> > > > > > this sense neither behaviorism or psychoanalysis could be
> > > > understood as
> > > > > an
> > > > > > strict "tradition" (there was fights and ruptures all the time,
> > > > > dissidences,
> > > > > > detours, new trends, and interpretations, etc.). Scientific
> > > > thought> > presupposes changes as a sine qua non condition of
> > > > its own existence...
> > > > > Of
> > > > > > course, in the field of the Vygotsky's intelectual,
> > > > cultural, legacy
> > > > > > ("puzzle kind" legacy) the discontinuous, intermittent, sometimes
> > > > > enigmatic,
> > > > > > character of the history of this "(non)tradition" it is very
> > > > eminent.> There
> > > > > > are several important intellectual disputes about the "correct
> > > > > > interpretation", the best exegetic tools, etc. But how can
> > > > we name this
> > > > > > historical process? Is there something in this that can have
> > > > the same
> > > > > name?
> > > > > > Every new name means an actual paradigmatic rupture? A name
> > > > never can be
> > > > > > only one meaning, of course. The sample of the name of the
> > > > Journal is
> > > > > really
> > > > > > worthwhile - a kind of "family name" (as "complex" in
> > > > thought and
> > > > > language
> > > > > > relations). People sometimes use names, words, has sign of some
> > > > > collective
> > > > > > identity, to be included in a broader common troupe of
> > > > social actors...
> > > > > this
> > > > > > is far to be something harmonious or ideally synergistic,
> > > > but exist some
> > > > > > need to stay in touch with persons that have some common
> > > > interests,> mainly
> > > > > > common values, as Mike said. If this can be named a
> > > > tradition, now I
> > > > > already
> > > > > > don't if is the more important question.
> > > > > > Achilles.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > Date: Fri, 15 Jan 2010 17:26:30 -0800
> > > > > > > Subject: Re: [xmca] Zhozephina Shif – something in English?
> > > > > > > From: lchcmike@gmail.com
> > > > > > > To: xmca@weber.ucsd.edu
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Perhaps we can get the shif book translated if it is
> > > > interesting. Does
> > > > > it
> > > > > > > exist in Russian, Anton?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > I disagree with only one part of what you say about
> > > > > "cultural-historical"
> > > > > > > school never existing. In the period from about 1956
> > > > following Stalin's
> > > > > > > death, to the death of Luria and Leontiev, there was an
> > > > identifiable> > group
> > > > > > > of people who met together, talked together, shared
> > > > certain ideas and
> > > > > > > values. They were also quite influential as heads of some
> > > > departments> and
> > > > > > > institutes. They did not all agree with each other
> > > > (Achille's evocation
> > > > > > of
> > > > > > > family strikes me as about right) and Leontiev was both
> > > > feared and
> > > > > > distanced
> > > > > > > from the others, but they maintained a kind of uneasy
> > > > alliance. Here I
> > > > > > would
> > > > > > > include
> > > > > > > Luria, Zaporzhets, Elkonin, Slavina, Morozova, and perhaps
> > > > a few
> > > > > others.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > It is a great irony that NOW there is a journal of
> > > > cultural-historical
> > > > > > > psychology in Russia. But perhaps, not a bad thing.
> > > > > > > mike (socio-cultural-historical activity scholar) :-))
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > On Fri, Jan 15, 2010 at 12:00 PM, Achilles Delari Junior <
> > > > > > > achilles_delari@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > I really understand... Maybe we can say that Vygotsky
> > > > himself was
> > > > > > notever
> > > > > > > > following his own "project"... In some documents
> > > > (letters) he
> > > > > > expresshis
> > > > > > > > desire to dedicate to an species of "cause", the
> > > > "reconstruction of
> > > > > > > > allpsychological science, building an unified approach,
> > > > but I really
> > > > > > feel
> > > > > > > > that therewas no "tradition" stricto sensu, nor no "vigotskian
> > > > > school"
> > > > > > in a
> > > > > > > > very definitefashion... Even more to read Vygotsky is
> > > > hard exegetical
> > > > > > task,
> > > > > > > > his all workseems to be a kind of complex million pieces
> > > > puzzle, at
> > > > > > least
> > > > > > > > for us non Russianreaders... I dont know... But when
> > > > everybody lies,
> > > > > we
> > > > > > need
> > > > > > > > to think aboutmethodological tools to define if there is
> > > > a possible
> > > > > > > > differentiation betweenlies and truth, or we can be
> > > > satisfied with
> > > > > the
> > > > > > > > impossibility of any truth inany social discourse... In
> > > > capitalists> > liberal
> > > > > > > > regimes, people can tell some liesin order to satisfy
> > > > editorial needs
> > > > > > and
> > > > > > > > market demands too... financial researchfounds to their(our)
> > > > > projects,
> > > > > > and
> > > > > > > > so on. Then, nobody is without guilt... inthis great
> > > > social game for
> > > > > > > > personal success in unequal power relationships, between
> > > > nations,> > between
> > > > > > > > institutions, between groups, persons, or evenbetween
> > > > brothers at the
> > > > > > same
> > > > > > > > home...
> > > > > > > > :-(
> > > > > > > > Best wishes.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Date: Fri, 15 Jan 2010 11:35:51 -0800
> > > > > > > > > From: the_yasya@yahoo.com
> > > > > > > > > Subject: Re: [xmca] Zhozephina Shif – something in English?
> > > > > > > > > To: xmca@weber.ucsd.edu
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Same thing. No answer. Special research needed.
> > > > Everybody lies.
> > > > > From
> > > > > > > > 1930s -- onwards.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Also, note: "Cultural-historical tradition" sensu
> > > > Vygotsky never
> > > > > > existed.
> > > > > > > > And hardly exists today.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----
> > > > > > > > > From: Achilles Delari Junior
> > > > <achilles_delari@hotmail.com>> > > > > To: xmca@weber.ucsd.edu
> > > > > > > > > Sent: Fri, January 15, 2010 12:59:24 PM
> > > > > > > > > Subject: RE: [xmca] Zhozephina Shif – something in English?
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Anton,
> > > > > > > > > This sounds much better! :-)Thank you very much. And
> > > > about this
> > > > > > > > title?Психология глухих. (Под ред. И.М. Соловьева, Ж.И.
> > > > Шиф, Т.В.
> > > > > > Розановой
> > > > > > > > и Н.В. Яшковой), М., 1971.Not already from the 1930s...
> > > > What you
> > > > > > recommends?
> > > > > > > > I found an recent Russian publication from 2006,{
> > > > > > > > http://bookseller.ru/book.php?n=1454} but I did not feel
> > > > secure to
> > > > > > order
> > > > > > > > in my blind condition tounderstand the book importance
> > > > or relation to
> > > > > > > > historical-cultural tradition...
> > > > > > > > > Thank you.
> > > > > > > > > > Date: Fri, 15 Jan 2010 09:48:14 -0800
> > > > > > > > > > From: the_yasya@yahoo.com
> > > > > > > > > > Subject: Re: [xmca] Zhozephina Shif – something in
> > > > English?> > > > > > To: xmca@weber.ucsd.edu
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > RE: Its important to know that it is not near to
> > > > Vygotsky's> trends.
> > > > > > --
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > I never said so. I guess I meant to state that the
> > > > connection is
> > > > > > not
> > > > > > > > obvious and requires substantial textual analysis.
> > > > Especially so,
> > > > > given
> > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > deliberately cryptic style of writing in Soviet
> > > > Psychology from the
> > > > > > 1930s
> > > > > > > > onwards...
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----
> > > > > > > > > > From: Achilles Delari Junior
> > > > <achilles_delari@hotmail.com>> > > > > > To: xmca@weber.ucsd.edu
> > > > > > > > > > Sent: Fri, January 15, 2010 12:12:00 PM
> > > > > > > > > > Subject: RE: [xmca] Zhozephina Shif – something in
> > > > English?> > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > I understand.Thank you very much.I saw that there is
> > > > something> from
> > > > > > her
> > > > > > > > about deaf psychology, for instance, etc.Its important
> > > > to know that
> > > > > it
> > > > > > is
> > > > > > > > not near to Vygotsky's trends.
> > > > > > > > > > Best.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Date: Fri, 15 Jan 2010 08:10:21 -0800
> > > > > > > > > > > From: the_yasya@yahoo.com
> > > > > > > > > > > Subject: Re: [xmca] Zhozephina Shif – something in
> > > > English?> > > > > > > To: xmca@weber.ucsd.edu
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > I personally strongly doubt any translation of
> > > > this book ever
> > > > > > > > existed.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Good luck anyway!
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > -- However, there is other stuff by Shif available
> > > > in English,
> > > > > > but it
> > > > > > > > is hardly related to her Leningrad work and represent
> > > > her later
> > > > > Moscow
> > > > > > work
> > > > > > > > in defectology...
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----
> > > > > > > > > > > From: Achilles Delari Junior
> > > > <achilles_delari@hotmail.com>> > > > > > > To: xmca@weber.ucsd.edu
> > > > > > > > > > > Sent: Fri, January 15, 2010 2:37:26 AM
> > > > > > > > > > > Subject: [xmca] Zhozephina Shif – something in English?
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Hi XMCA
> > > > > > > > > > > people…
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > In order to
> > > > > > > > > > > help another friend of mine, biologist, studying
> > > > scientific> > concepts
> > > > > > > > > > > development, I’m wonder if you have any notice
> > > > about English
> > > > > > > > (Spanish, French,
> > > > > > > > > > > etc.) publication from the following text:
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Shif, J. I. “Razvitie nauchnykh ponyatii u schko’nika:
> > > > > > > > > > > Issledovanie k voprosu umstvenogo razvitiya
> > > > shkol’nika pri
> > > > > > obuchenii
> > > > > > > > > > > obshchestvovedeniyu” [The development of
> > > > scientific concepts in
> > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > school
> > > > > > > > > > > child: The investigation of intellectual
> > > > development of the
> > > > > > school
> > > > > > > > child in
> > > > > > > > > > > social science instruction]. Moscow – Leningrad:
> > > > > Gosudarstvennoe
> > > > > > > > > > > Uchebno-Pedagicheskoe Izdatel’stvo. 1935.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > I’m trying
> > > > > > > > > > > the Russian high now, but we are not so prepared
> > > > to actually
> > > > > > > > translate Russian so
> > > > > > > > > > > soon, without a huge time spending… And there are
> > > > many other
> > > > > > Russian
> > > > > > > > needs
> > > > > > > > > > > prior at the schedule, most of that already
> > > > provide thanks you
> > > > > > all.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > If you have any notice... :-)
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Thank you
> > > > > > > > > > > very much. Good 2010 for all.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Best
> > > > > > > > > > > wishes.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Achilles.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > _________________________________________________________________
> > > > > > > > > > > O Novo Windows 7 funciona do jeito que você quer.
> > > > Clique aqui
> > > > > > para
> > > > > > > > conhecer!
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> >
> http://www.microsoft.com/brasil/windows7/default.html?WT.mc_id=1539_______________________________________________>
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> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > __________________________________________________________________> >
> >
> > > > > > The new Internet Explorer® 8 - Faster, safer, easier.
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> > > > > > > > Yahoo!  Get it Now for Free! at
> > > > > > > > http://downloads.yahoo.com/ca/internetexplorer/
> > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________
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> > > > > > > > > > > http://dss.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/xmca
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > _________________________________________________________________> > >
> > > > > Deixe seu computador compatível com a sua vida. Clique para
> > > > > > conhecer o
> > > > > > > > Windows 7!
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> >
> http://www.microsoft.com/brasil/windows7/default.html?WT.mc_id=1539_______________________________________________>
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> > > > > > > > > >
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> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > __________________________________________________________________> >
> >
> > > > > Make your browsing faster, safer, and easier with the new
> > > > > Internet
> > > > > > > > Explorer® 8. Optimized for Yahoo! Get it Now for Free! at
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> > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________
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> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > _________________________________________________________________> > >
> > > > Agora é fácil compartilhar fotos no Messenger: solte todas na
> > > > > > janelinha.
> > > > > > > > Veja como!
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> >
> http://www.windowslive.com.br/public/tip.aspx/view/77?product=2&ocid=CRM-WindowsLive:dicaCompartilhamentoFotos:Tagline:WLCRM:On:WL:pt-BR:Messenger
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > __________________________________________________________________
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> > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________
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> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > _________________________________________________________________> > >
> > > O Novo Windows 7 funciona do jeito que você quer. Clique aqui para
> > > > > > > > conhecer!
> > > > > > > >
> > > > http://www.microsoft.com/brasil/windows7/default.html?WT.mc_id=1539> >
> > > >
> > > > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > > > xmca mailing list
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> > > > > > > > http://dss.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/xmca
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > > xmca mailing list
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> > > > > > > http://dss.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/xmca
> > > > > >
> > > > > > _________________________________________________________________
> > > > > > O Novo Windows 7 funciona do jeito que você quer. Clique
> > > > aqui para
> > > > > > conhecer!
> > > > > >
> > > > http://www.microsoft.com/brasil/windows7/default.html?WT.mc_id=1539> >
> > > > > > _______________________________________________
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> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > _______________________________________________
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> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Sincerely yours Bella Kotik-Friedgut
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > xmca mailing list
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> > > >
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> >
> > _________________________________________________________________
> > Com o Windows 7 nenhum arquivo vai se esconder de você. Clique para
> > conhecer !
> > http://www.microsoft.com/brasil/windows7/default.html?WT.mc_id=1539
> >
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> >
> >
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_________________________________________________________________
Com o Windows 7 nenhum arquivo vai se esconder de você. Clique para conhecer !
http://www.microsoft.com/brasil/windows7/default.html?WT.mc_id=1539

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