Ana,
Thanks a lot for letting me know. I agree with the idea of "enrichment" of some classical CHAT ideas by embedding them in various cultural contexts and different historical periods. In addition, we are dealing with diversity of schools of thought as well as communities of practice built on CHAT.
In regards to the "kernel of meaning", I am always in between two radically different approaches to building the bridges of understanding: the first assumes that there are "true meanings" of some original ideas of CHAT and one has to reconstruct the origins of these ideas before we can go any further (I was brought up and educated in this approach and respect it greatly); the second is radically different, it is built on the assumption that there is no possibility to reconstruct the universal truth and the "kernel of meaning" is in the constant negotiation of present contexts and meanings, practices and research findings.
It seems to me that both should be equally important in our discussions, they bring different issues on the table. Who can judge what is more important - to understand the initial Vygotskian meaning of "psychological function" ( A question brought by Seth Chaklin in our conversation with Zinchenko) or to explore the concept of zone of proximal development used as an explanatory concept to construct some meanings of actual spontaneous classroom experience used by professor Leslie Williams in her presentation at ISCRAT?
As a suggestion for future AERA meetings and beyond, it seems important to work on some conceptual/geographical maps of recent developments of CHAT. They will help those graduate students who are considering CHAT as a theoretical framework or research methodology for future studies to navigate better. Maybe interactive symposia where various lines of research are presented and discussed? What do you think?
Thank you for reminding me about wider geographical map of CHAT. I did not mean to limit it to English-Russian dialog, just used it as an example.
Elina
Ana Marjanovic-Shane wrote:
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Elina,
It worked: I got your message on the XMCA.
As for your comments that the meaning of Vygotsky’s ideas in the Russian dialogical space (of the specific historical period) is different from the meaning of the “same” ideas in the English speaking dialogical space (of another historical period), it is true. The question is how do we understand each other at all, since it is hardly possible to “transfer” an idea from one language/cultural historical moment to another.
I think of it as an enrichment of an idea – at least as a possible enrichment, at least for the people who are fluent in the contextual background of both cultural historical moments. The question is what are the means to bridge the two or more backgrounds, what are the devices by which some kernel of meaning is stabilized enough to be carried over to another context with sufficient power to recreate some basis for understanding. This is always a puzzle for a creative translator.
And don’t forget that on XMCA we don’t have just the Russian (then and now) and the English (American, Australian, British, New Zeeland) cultural worlds involved but also: Spanish (Latin American and European), Finish, Swedish, Serbian (Yugoslavian), German, and more…
Possibilities for enrichment and misunderstandings are great.
Ana
----------------------------------------
Ana Marjanovic-Shane
home: 1-215 - 843 - 2909
mobile:+267 -334-2905
-----Original Message-----
From: Elina Lampert-Shepel [mailto:ellampert@yahoo.com]
Sent: 11 August 2002 13:52
To: xmca@weber.ucsd.edu
Subject: International course on CHAT
I am trying to resend this message from my yahoo account, because I am not sure whether it
went through from my columbia e-mail account...Please let me know if you see it posted on
xmca...I do apologize if this message was posted earlier...
Thanks in advance.
Elina
Hi Mike et al,
The idea of the course is wonderful. I also strongly support the
diversity of forms of teaching as well as evaluation. Last semester I
was teaching a course at Teachers College, Columbia University
on "International perspectives on cultural-historical psychology and
activity theory". This graduate course was part of the Internship
program for graduate students from the Department of Curriculum and
Teaching, TC. The activity part was participation at ISCRAT. It was a
very interesting experience. So course-internship link worked for us.
I think there are various meanings of the word international, I was
mostly interested to trace with the students the various venues the
development of CHAT took in different countries and research
communities. I told my colleagues in Russia that I discovered a
different Vygotsky when I started reading the translations in
English. And it is not simply an interpretation through translation,
but the whole issue of a different dialogical space for some of the
key ideas. For example, Vygotskian ideas discussed in Russia by Boris
Elkonin in a dialogue with ideas of Florenskiy and Zinchenko's recent
explorations of Vygotsky-Shpet link are quite different from Vygotsky-
Dewey dialogical space in the US, to mention some of them. It seems
to me that it makes a great difference for the meaning construction,
in a dialogue with what other "theoretical and practical provinces"
the ideas of CHAT are shaped, within frameworks of what traditional
disciplines (anthropology, education, semiotics, etc.), research
methodologies, and within what socio-cultural-political contexts.
CHAT developes through our constant questioning to explore the
boundaries of the concept, and I believe teaching CHAT should involve
these questions to the foundations of CHAT.
What do you think?
Just a few comments to contribute. I am all for the
international/polylogical/multicultural/multidimentional
discussion/teaching CHAT.
I do not know how Russian my inner speech is after 8 years in US...:-
), but I am definitely fluent in my native language(Russian)and in
communication with Vygotskian community there, so would like to join
other Russian voices...
Elina.
Quoting Mike Cole <mcole@weber.ucsd.edu>:
>
> I had a chance to chat with Judy who is en route to a new
> locale. When she
> alights she can post her summary of the aera-related issues,
> about which I
> think we are agreed.
>
> This note concerns a "course."
>
> Here is my amateur take on this issue, which is frought with
> possibilities
> and potholes.
>
> 1. There almost certainly should be no "center," no one place
> where credit,
> in whatever form, is given.
>
> 2. I assume different people will get credit in different ways
> depending upon
> local circumstances. Here are some of the possibilities that
> could all
> exist simultaneously:
>
> 1.
> Local universities (UCSD, UCSC, Lesley College, The Autonomous
> U of Madrid,
> CUNY, Roskilde U...... whatever wherever) could offer the
> course to their
> local students as part of their local curriculum. Local people
> would
> probably meet from time to time in additon to internet
> mediated interactions.
>
> 2. UCSD extension could be induced to give this course,
> connected to regular
> course at UCSD. This costs some money, but is not Harvard unit
> costs by a long
> shot. People who take the course this way (at whatever
> extension school, I
> mention ucsd only as an example) get a transcript from that
> university saying
> they took that course.
>
> 3. People could simply participate and at the end get a
> certificate of
> participation.
>
> The cognisenti among us probably know more routes. My thought
> is that whatever
> works locally for participants works for the system as a
> whole. Perhaps there
> are cases where this could cause trouble. If so, let us know.
>
> As per Jim's note, if this topic is of limited interest we
> could set up
> a separate list serve for those who are interested in
> participating. If
> grad students want to write to jim, fine. Just keep others
> posted when there
> is something relevant to post.
>
> Like that
> mike
>
I have on my table a violin string. It is free. I twist one end of
it and it responds. It is free. But it is not free to do what a
violin string is supposed to do - to produce music. So I take it, fix
it in my violin and tighten it until it is taut. Only then it is free
to be a violin string.
Sir Rabindranath Tagore.
Elina Lampert-Shepel
Chairperson, General Education Department
Globe Institute of Technology, 2nd floor
New York, NY 10007
212 349 4330 ext. 114 (w)
"To a man with a hammer everything looks like a nail."
M.Postman Conscientious Objections,1988, p.33
Elina Lampert-Shepel
Chairperson, General Education Department
Globe Institute of Technology, 2nd floor
New York, NY 10007
212 349 4330 ext. 114 (w)
---------------------------------
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"To a man with a hammer everything looks like a nail."
M.Postman Conscientious Objections,1988, p.33
Elina Lampert-Shepel
Chairperson, General Education Department
Globe Institute of Technology, 2nd floor
New York, NY 10007
212 349 4330 ext. 114 (w)
---------------------------------
Do You Yahoo!?
HotJobs, a Yahoo! service - Search Thousands of New Jobs
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